mandatory vaccinations

[IHOM]

Where do you guys stand on this issue.. its not effecting the uk....yet!! But its going on in the usa other parts of europe and oz. My kids are vaccinated except for the MMR which is made using aborted fetal cells... i picture it as a kind of satanic sacrafice a mockery of the lords sacrafice.... the injection of the flesh and blood of aborted children sacraficed to satan...

I couldnt in good conscions have my children injected it is against my faith... but what if i dont get them vaccinated they will take my children away

Your thoughts guys

 

[High Fidelity]

I think it's the right thing to do.

It's no mistake that the vaccinated illnesses have either declined rapidly or been all but removed from our societies.

 

[Fish and Bread]

I think that if they are provided for free or at a charge that is affordable to you, vaccinating your children is a moral obligation to both your children and to the larger society. And, yes, I'd make it mandatory (Provided we provide the vaccines for free to those unable to pay). You don't get to put your children at the kind of risk that not being vaccinated entails, and you certainly don't get to put other people's children and immune compromised adults at that kind of risk, which is what people not vaccinating their children does. Vaccines need to be widely administered to be effective. We're starting to lose herd immunity because of the anti-vax movement, and old diseases thought eradicated in the first world are breaking out again. And not only among the non-vaccinated, those who had vaccines that didn't take, infants, the elderly, and those who have poor immune systems are at significant risk as well, all because some parents aren't being responsible with their children.

 

[Fish and Bread]

I couldnt in good conscions have my children injected it is against my faith...

You're here on the Roman Catholic forum. Getting your children vaccinated is not against the Roman Catholic faith.

but what if i dont get them vaccinated they will take my children away

Please get your children vaccinated.

 

[ebia]

Where do you guys stand on this issue.. its not effecting the uk....yet!! But its going on in the usa other parts of europe and oz. My kids are vaccinated except for the MMR which is made using aborted fetal cells... i picture it as a kind of satanic sacrafice a mockery of the lords sacrafice.... the injection of the flesh and blood of aborted children sacraficed to satan...

I couldnt in good conscions have my children injected it is against my faith... but what if i dont get them vaccinated they will take my children away

Your thoughts guys

No abortions are happening to facilitate vaccines.

The Catholic Church has looked into the involvement in abortive foetuses being used in the original cell lines many decades ago, and concluded that while that should not have been done it is acceptable and a moral duty to have such vaccines while there is lack of an alternative.

By not having your children vaccinated you are not only putting them at risk, but you are putting others at risk - especially in the case of Rubella other unborn children.

 

[IHOM]

But FORCED vaccinations...with threat of your children being taken away.... surely you cant agree with that...how can a catholic agree with such a thing?

 

[ebia]

But FORCED vaccinations...with threat of your children being taken away.... surely you cant agree with that...how can a catholic agree with such a thing?

I wouldn't force it in that way, but if people choose to put others at risk then should expect penalties.

 

[Armoured]

My kids are vaccinated except for the MMR which is made using aborted fetal cells...
Your thoughts guys

No it's not.

http://www.drwalt.com/blog/2008/07/09/vaccine-myth-13-vaccinations-are-made-from-aborted-babies/

No ethical health worker will support vaccines being mandatory. They're just a very, very good idea.

 

[Armoured]

I wouldn't force it in that way, but if people choose to put others at risk then should expect penalties.

I have no problem with unvaccinated kids being denied places in school activities and similar, unless, of course, there is a legitimate medical reason they're unvaccinated.

 

[ebia]

I have no problem with unvaccinated kids being denied places in school activities and similar, unless, of course, there is a legitimate medical reason they're unvaccinated.

We all accept that there are a very small number of people who can't be vaccinated. Indeed, that's one of the key reasons why everyone else needs to be.

 

[IHOM]

Measlea is dangerous in 3rd world countries where adequent helth care facilities ect dont exist. I cant in good conscoiusness inject anything developed using aborted fetal tissue which is admited to me by my doctor into me or my children... i just cant do it.... its disgusting... now as i understand it the church has left it open for parents to make an informed choice and to accept or reject the vaccine on grounds of moral consciousness but at the same time it is not immoral to do so

 

[IHOM]

It dosnt mater what a ethical health worker thinks... if its law it will be enforced by unethicsl health workers

 

[ebia]

Measlea is dangerous in 3rd world countries where adequent helth care facilities ect dont exist. I cant in good conscoiusness inject anything developed using aborted fetal tissue which is admited to me by my doctor into me or my children... i just cant do it.... its disgusting... now as i understand it the church has left it open for parents to make an informed choice and to accept or reject the vaccine on grounds of moral consciousness but at the same time it is not immoral to do so

Measles and Rubella are dangerous everywhere. They are becoming less dangerous in the third world (where vacinat ion rates are higher) than in the west. Rubella causes massive problems for unborn children.

When you refuse to be vacinated it's not you that takes most of the increased risk; you still bludge off all the people around you who have been vacinated.

it's all the people around you who can't be vacinated that must carry the risk so you can be all pius about something your religous moral authority says is okay.

Would you be prepared to front up to a child born with a serious deformity because of your choice and tell him and his parents that they have to bear the cost of your 'disgust'?

So no, in answer to your original question, I do not think anyone has the moral right to opt out of MMR.

If you had a problem with tetanus, say, then that's your problem because it's only your family you are putting at risk, but I do not think you have the right to put others at serious risk.

 

[Armoured]

We all accept that there are a very small number of people who can't be vaccinated. Indeed, that's one of the key reasons why everyone else needs to be.

Quite so.

 

[Armoured]

It dosnt mater what a ethical health worker thinks... if its law it will be enforced by unethicsl health workers

"if"

 

[FlaviusAetius]

No it's not.

http://www.drwalt.com/blog/2008/07/09/vaccine-myth-13-vaccinations-are-made-from-aborted-babies/

No ethical health worker will support vaccines being mandatory. They're just a very, very good idea.

Interesting, I know everyone is trying to convince the anti vaccination person but now I'm curious.

Doesn't this mean Catholics can support embryonic stem cell usage so long as the abortion occurred initially because the mother wanted it dead for personal reasons? I mean, vaccinating using these two tissue strains is already using evil to produce good, so why not just keep using that loophole?

I mean thousands of women would love nothing more than to kill a unwanted embryo and get paid so scientists can experiment, make stem cells of it and use it for other medical uses.

 

[ebia]

Interesting, I know everyone is trying to convince the anti vaccination person but now I'm curious.

Doesn't this mean Catholics can support embryonic stem cell usage so long as the abortion occurred initially because the mother wanted it dead for personal reasons? I mean, vaccinating using these two tissue strains is already using evil to produce good, so why not just keep using that loophole?

I mean thousands of women would love nothing more than to kill a unwanted embryo and get paid so scientists can experiment, make stem cells of it and use it for other medical uses.

Can I suggest you look up and read the fuller ethical working through of the question?

 

[Armoured]

Interesting, I know everyone is trying to convince the anti vaccination person but now I'm curious.

Doesn't this mean Catholics can support embryonic stem cell usage so long as the abortion occurred initially because the mother wanted it dead for personal reasons? I mean, vaccinating using these two tissue strains is already using evil to produce good, so why not just keep using that loophole?

I mean thousands of women would love nothing more than to kill a unwanted embryo and get paid so scientists can experiment, make stem cells of it and use it for other medical uses.

I don't honestly know how the church's position on such matters is determined. It makes sense to me that an embryo that was terminated anyway being used for a secondary purpose is preferable to it just being thrown out. But that's me, and I'm sure people will disagree.

Then, if the woman was being paid for the embryo, I'm sure you'd run into all sorts of moral and ethical questions over whether such payment counted as inducement to have an abortion, or worse, whether people were getting pregnant for the express purpose of being paid to have an abortion.

Can of worms I don't care to open...

 

[FlaviusAetius]

Sometimes apathy is the only answer. Hence why I'm getting to the point where I'm starting to not care about any of it. I'll accept vaccines without thought, cease caring on political issues the Church will inevitably lose on the secular front. In fact I won't be surprised if one day I'll have to give an apathetic shrug and accept stem cells from embryos as a legal and likely praised procedure.
In any case, I understand your reasoning for wanting some secondary good from a primary evil.

One thing I do know, in anger I spit on the notion of Western nations calling themselves Christians and especially at the USA and their pack of lies "In God we trust."

Nothing but lies! That and the belief God would bless a nation like ours!

 

[IHOM]

"If"

Comes into law in austrialia in jan 2016... already in opperation in france and germany and other parts of europe... the doctors are fighting like mad to prevent it happening here in the uk.... it is a global agenda it will come no doubt about it.... and no matter if your pro vaccine (which i am... just no MMR) or anti vaccine to force people to be violated against their wishes is nothing more than non sexual rape