Lying About Islam

[4Jesus]

Did anyone read this article by Stephen Schwartz in the Religion News section? Well hardy har har, it doesn't look like Islam is as close knit and unified as some want us to believe!

 

[dignitized]

4jesus - I COULD HAVE TOLD YOU THAT!! lol

There are -

Sunni
Shi'ite
Druze
Alaoui
Alawite
Wahhabi
Sufi
Ahmadiyyah
Ismali
Kharijis
Nation of Islam

and these are only the MAJOR sects!!

 

[4Jesus]

Today at 11:39 AM Br. Max said this in Post #2

4jesus - I COULD HAVE TOLD YOU THAT!! lol

There are -

Sunni
Shi'ite
Druze
Alaoui
Alawite
Wahhabi
Sufi
Ahmadiyyah
Ismali
Kharijis
Nation of Islam

and these are only the MAJOR sects!!

Thanks for the list. Did you get to read the article? 

 

[Talmid HaYarok]

Can you post a link here?

I'd also like to note that Wahhabi is a subsect of Sunni Islam. A few of the others listed were subsects of the main branches as well, for example Ismailis are a subsect of Shia Islam.

Oh, and the Druze aren't technically Muslim at all. They're a radical departure from Islam which is definitely its own religion. They like the Ba'hais have about as much in common with Islam as Mormonism does with Christianity, maybe even less.

 

[dignitized]

4jesus - nope but I'm sure I can guess what it contained.

 

[lowmagnet]

28th February 2003 at 05:39 PM Br. Max said this in Post #2 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=681764#post681764)

4jesus - I COULD HAVE TOLD YOU THAT!! lol

But to be fair and equal:

Catholic
Russian Orthodox
Greek Orthodox
Church of England
Lutheran

...and that's just the various direct branches of the main Church, not to mention:

Arianism
Coptic Church
Cathars

...or the protestants:

Pentacostal Church
Lutheran Church
Baptist
Church of Christ
Presbyterian
7th Day Adventist

...etc.

Don't pass judgement on other religions based on the number of sects that comprise them.

 

[dnich163]

28th February 2003 at 02:14 PM 4Jesus said this in Post #1

Did anyone read this article by Stephen Schwartz in the Religion News section? Well hardy har har, it doesn't look like Islam is as close knit and unified as some want us to believe!

What is the point in this?

Is it to say that the Muslim's are much like the Christians in that there are a multitude of views, opinions, denominations etc.

I wasn't aware that there was a claim; or even a view, that Islam was any different from any other religion in as much as that it is made up of human beings with all their inherent faults.

David

 

[Job_38]

Yesterday at 03:15 AM lowmagnet said this in Post #6

But to be fair and equal:

Catholic
Russian Orthodox
Greek Orthodox
Church of England
Lutheran

...and that's just the various direct branches of the main Church, not to mention:

Arianism
Coptic Church
Cathars

...or the protestants:

Pentacostal Church
Lutheran Church
Baptist
Church of Christ
Presbyterian
7th Day Adventist

...etc.

Don't pass judgement on other religions based on the number of sects that comprise them.

 Yes, but people are aware of Christian sects. What we are told is that Islam is a unified religion.

 

 

[Didymus]

I have heard of the differnt sects. Is it any different when all Christians sects get lumped together by non-Christians ?
I attended a Muslum culture day last fall. True most of the men wouldn t talk to me but the women were very friendly. My husband was very uncomfortable. I was amazed at those who said they really loved Jesus and what He stood for. One minister said "What s there not to love about Jesus ?" I know they don t think of Him as God but I was still surprised.

 

[Job_38]

Really? That is interesting. I knew that they held Jesus in high regard, but not that. Thanks.

 

[Didymus]

of course this was a group of American born and raised Muslums. i wanted my younger daughter to meet the kids and realize they are people just like us and not fire -breathing monsters.

 

[Arikay]

Told by who?

Today at 04:15 PM Job_38 said this in Post #8 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=695728#post695728)

 Yes, but people are aware of Christian sects. What we are told is that Islam is a unified religion.

 

 

[lowmagnet]

Today at 12:15 AM Job_38 said this in Post #8 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=695728#post695728)
Yes, but people are aware of Christian sects. What we are told is that Islam is a unified religion.

Goodness, I don't think there is such a thing. And I never did. There are sects of Buddhism as well. Does it matter? or is this just a matter of 'sticking it to them Muslims' or what? I have never heard a claim of one strong Muslim faith.

 

[Job_38]

Perhaps I should rephrase: I never knew of the sects. Forgive me for making an unclaimed statement.

 

[Lotuspetal_uk]

Told by who?

and

Goodness, I don't think there is such a thing. And I never did. There are sects of Buddhism as well. Does it matter? or is this just a matter of 'sticking it to them Muslims' or what? I have never heard a claim of one strong Muslim faith.

If you speak with Muslims trying to convert a Christian this is one of their primary 'sales pitches'. This and "the Bible is corrupted" and "Jesus was never crucified but Judas took His place". My husband converted because he became disillusioned with the many sects of Christianity and was attracted to the concept that Islam had "no" sects and that it was a unified religion with only one interpretation of the Quran.

Although I can't speak for the initial post, it is helpful to be made aware that this is not actually the case.

IMO it's not a case of 'sticking it to the Muslims' but more a case of being better informed.

Just my two cents....

God bless

 

[feral]

i beg to differ...i have never been told that islam is a unified religion. the only unifying thinge about it is that many islamically governed countries make it law, so you have to be muslim or follow the belief system. rather then secular law they have religious.

 

[4Jesus]

28th February 2003 at 04:11 PM Talmid HaYarok said this in Post #4

Can you post a link here?

I'd also like to note that Wahhabi is a subsect of Sunni Islam. A few of the others listed were subsects of the main branches as well, for example Ismailis are a subsect of Shia Islam.

Oh, and the Druze aren't technically Muslim at all. They're a radical departure from Islam which is definitely its own religion. They like the Ba'hais have about as much in common with Islam as Mormonism does with Christianity, maybe even less.

Sorry it took me so long to reply to you but the article has been removed. I did get a copy of it, here is is.

 

<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt; TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><B><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 16pt; FONT-FAMILY: Verdana">LYING ABOUT ISLAM </SPAN></B>



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<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 0pt"><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">By STEPHEN SCHWARTZ </SPAN><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o></o></SPAN>

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<I>February 28, 2003 </I>-- <SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o></o></SPAN>

AMERICANS have a lot to learn about Islam - even in the aftermath of the horrors of 9/11. While the atrocities of that day provided a wake-up call about terrorism, our political and media elites continue to show us that they haven't done their homework on the religious background of al Qaeda - and are likely not to.

An exceptionally irritating example of this came to light when a USA Today "Q&amp;A on Islam and Arab Americans" appeared as a mass mailing around the country. Although the flier bore the USA Today logo, a call to the newspaper elicited the claim that the logo was used without its permission, even though the content of the flyer appeared on the paper's Web site.

USA Today staffers doubtless thought they were doing Muslims and non-Muslims in America a favor by presenting a warm and fuzzy picture of the situation inside world Islam.

But the leaflet was sent out by the "International Institute of Islamic Thought" (IIIT) in Herndon, Va., one of a group of Muslim organizations raided by federal authorities in an antiterrorism investigation last year.

IIIT advocates for the Wahhabi sect of Islam, the most extreme, separatist and violent trend in the faith of Mohammed. Wahhabism is the official religion in Saudi Arabia. Saudi oil royalties are spent to spread Wahhabism throughout the world - including right here in America.

We shouldn't be surprised, then, at how the newspaper, and the leaflet, answered the question, <I>What is jihad?</I> "Jihad does not mean 'holy war.' Literally, jihad in Arabic means to strive, struggle and exert effort. It is a central and broad Islamic concept that includes struggle against evil inclinations within oneself, struggle to improve the quality of life in society, struggle in the battlefield for self-defense or fighting against tyranny or oppression."

Here we have the money quote: "Jihad does not mean 'holy war.' " A few lines later, however, jihad does include "struggle in the battlefield."

The truth is, military jihad cannot be written out of Islam. The prophet Mohammed himself led armies. This answer would be more honest if it said, "Jihad cannot be reduced to the idea of 'holy war.'" But IIIT seeks only to escape responsibility for the Wahhabi 'jihad,' which has been terroristic since the founding of the Wahhabi cult in central Arabia 250 years ago.

Wahhabism is murderous in its attacks on non-Wahhabi Muslims, especially the Shi'as who comprise a majority in Iraq and the oil-rich Saudi eastern province, as well as in Iran. Just last week, nine Shi'a Muslims were murdered in Pakistan. The finger of blame has been pointed at Lashkar i Janghvi, the same Wahhabi terror gang that killed American reporter Daniel Pearl. (Indeed, Pearl was among the few victims of Lashkar i Janghvi who was not a Muslim.)

The "Q&amp;A" that first appeared in USA Today and has been recycled by IIIT is part of a not-so-sophisticated campaign to convince Americans that there is only one Islam, represented by Saudi-Wahhabism, that it has nothing to do with terror, and, above all, that other forms of Islam, such as Shi'ism or Sufism, the spiritual form of Islam, do not exist or are unworthy of notice in the West.

This is especially pernicious as the United States solicits allies among Shi'a Muslims in Iraq, who yearn for liberation from the bloody hands of Saddam Hussein. Over the weekend, Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul D. Wolfowitz met with Shi'a Muslims in Michigan who stressed their hatred of Saddam and their desire to see the United States take firm action. One said, "It is not a very good idea to wait much longer."

In New York, Shi'a Muslims will hold their annual religious procession on March 9. They will proclaim their loyalty to America and their hatred of Saddam, of Wahhabism and of terrorism.

In addition, I and others who work closely with dissident Saudi subjects increasingly hear that restive young people in the kingdom, rather than supporting Osama bin Laden as the Saudi rulers claim, are turning to the peaceful and meditative way of Sufism as a form of opposition to the extremist form of Islam that has a grip on their country.

But Shi'ism and Sufism are absent from the USA Today Q&amp;A. It's bad enough that Saudi money has enabled Wahhabis to take over 70-80 percent of American mosques. But when major American media like USA Today cover for this, it's a disgrace - and a threat.

<I>Stephen Schwartz is the author of "The Two Faces of Islam: The House of Sa'ud From Tradition to Terror" and senior policy analyst at the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies in Washington, D.C.</I>

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[SavedByGrace3]

5th March 2003 at 10:15 PM lowmagnet said this in Post #6



But to be fair and equal:

Catholic
Russian Orthodox
Greek Orthodox
Church of England
Lutheran

...and that's just the various direct branches of the main Church, not to mention:

Arianism
Coptic Church
Cathars

...or the protestants:

Pentacostal Church
Lutheran Church
Baptist
Church of Christ
Presbyterian
7th Day Adventist

...etc.

Don't pass judgement on other religions based on the number of sects that comprise them.

When was the last time the baptists gassed a village of catholics?
I am not being smartie... I am just pointing out that even tho we have differences, we still manage to get along. I do not know any of the demoninations you listed which claim the others are ****** and need to be exterminated.

 

[Arikay]

What about what was/is happening in Ireland?

Or how about the plenty of wars in the past that were between two christian groups?

Today at 01:18 PM hobart schmedly said this in Post #18



When was the last time the baptists gassed a village of catholics?
I am not being smartie... I am just pointing out that even tho we have differences, we still manage to get along. I do not know any of the demoninations you listed which claim the others are ****** and need to be exterminated.

 

[David Gould]

Today at 08:18 AM hobart schmedly said this in Post #18



When was the last time the baptists gassed a village of catholics?
I am not being smartie... I am just pointing out that even tho we have differences, we still manage to get along. I do not know any of the demoninations you listed which claim the others are ****** and need to be exterminated.

There are groups of Christians that claim that other groups are evil and will be ****** to hell.

And as Arikay pointed out, protestants and catholics have been murdering one another for centuries over religion, and&nbsp;both sided&nbsp;have killed men, women and children indiscriminately.