If it where "game over" then that would mean we would not exist, if hell were literally a place of fire then the game would not be over since we are still in existence.
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Literal Hell - Question for Christians
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MelissaShae
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But God is not in hell, it is Godless. Only filled with the unrepented souls that did not follow Jesus Christ. One can not be in hell and with God, that is why there is Heaven and Hell. With or without God.
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God is not omnipresent? I think separation from an omnipresent being would mean being cast out of existence.
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MelissaShae
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I am really not sure about what you are wanting to know, because you have asked a lot different questions but as far as God and Hell, God is not a part of hell. Those who did not believe in Him or come to him thru Jesus Christ in this life have their spirits cast into hell and they are seperate from Him for eternity. And after Satan and his demons are burned to ashes and the earth is also burned then there will be a new world for those who followed Jesus.
So basically yes, those will eventually cast out of existence and into hell and then they will burned to ashes and will never live again.
So basically yes, those will eventually cast out of existence and into hell and then they will burned to ashes and will never live again.
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Nicki4Christ
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I want to comment on your thread LeonTrotsky. If I understand your question correctly, you pretty much want to know how can a person burn in fire eternally? I will need to quote scripture:
Luke 16: 19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day. 20. And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, 21. And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich mans table:moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.22. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom:the rich man also died, and was buried. 23. AND IN HELL HE LIFT UP HIS EYES, Being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off and Lazarus in his bosom. 24. AND HE CRIED and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his fingerin water, and cool my TONGUE; for thou art tormented.
Please read this closely::: 26. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, from hence. 27. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my fathers house: 28. For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
One More:::
Mathew 25:46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous will go into eternal life.
Luke 16: 19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day. 20. And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, 21. And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich mans table:moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.22. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom:the rich man also died, and was buried. 23. AND IN HELL HE LIFT UP HIS EYES, Being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off and Lazarus in his bosom. 24. AND HE CRIED and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his fingerin water, and cool my TONGUE; for thou art tormented.
Please read this closely::: 26. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, from hence. 27. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my fathers house: 28. For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
One More:::
Mathew 25:46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous will go into eternal life.
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We will exist forever. God made spirit beings to be eternal. He didn't want a temporary family where members go poof every so often into nothingness. This is why devils and unsaved people are imprisoned rather than just executed, they can't be destroyed.
By game over, I meant their life in the physical realm is finished along with the chance to choose salvation and change their final destiny to Heaven. Actually, it's game over for anybody who has died. The ones who made it to Heaven won the "game".
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SuperNova
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Jesus said that there would be a time when all the dead would rise from their graves. So those in Hell one day will be there in the flesh. While it's safe to assume that the fire of Hell is a literal fire I don't see any reason not to also assume that "fire" is a way of describing the torment felt from being eternally separated from God. It's just a thought though.
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The first one was a parable, why are you taking it literally? And the second one does not mention fire.
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Digit
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Heya Leon, howya doing? 
Revelation 20:14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Revelation 20:15If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
I'm currently trying to decide which version I believe, as both can be reasoned with Biblically, I'm just not sure.
May I ask, why have you asked this question originally?
All the best!
Digit
This is because the Bible says it is so:
Revelation 20:14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Revelation 20:15If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
May I ask, what do you base this on? How do you know the attributes of the spiritual body, and how do you know the nature of spiritual fire, or if you don't believe it is spiritual fire, how do you know that fire will not harm these bodies?
This is correct, which is why some Christians do not believe that Hell is eternal, in the sense that you are conscious and it lasts forever, Hell is finite. You are tossed into the lake of fire, and your spiritual body is destroyed, and that's it. The second death.
I'm currently trying to decide which version I believe, as both can be reasoned with Biblically, I'm just not sure.
May I ask, why have you asked this question originally?
All the best!
Digit
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Heya Leon, howya doing?
This is because the Bible says it is so:
Revelation 20:14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Revelation 20:15If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
May I ask, what do you base this on? How do you know the attributes of the spiritual body, and how do you know the nature of spiritual fire, or if you don't believe it is spiritual fire, how do you know that fire will not harm these bodies?
This is correct, which is why some Christians do not believe that Hell is eternal, in the sense that you are conscious and it lasts forever, Hell is finite. You are tossed into the lake of fire, and your spiritual body is destroyed, and that's it. The second death.
I'm currently trying to decide which version I believe, as both can be reasoned with Biblically, I'm just not sure.
May I ask, why have you asked this question originally?
All the best!
Digit
hmm well this second death would make more sense because as I said fire would destroy a physical body. (Fire destroys not preserves) Why do I ask? Because I am curious.
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Digit
Senior Veteran
Yeah, it's an interesting study for sure. Again I am not sure which one to me speaks truly, as it also says the punishment is eternal. But you can interpret that to mean either ever-lasting or permanent. In which case, again, both could be true. Maybe the original text has more clues?
But, I feel you may be operating on an assumption which is that fire would destroy an eternal spiritual body. What if it could not destroy it? I mean, how do you know the nature of these things?
See what I am saying?
Digit
But, I feel you may be operating on an assumption which is that fire would destroy an eternal spiritual body. What if it could not destroy it? I mean, how do you know the nature of these things?
See what I am saying?
Digit
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If it were spiritual (which means non physical) then fire would not affect it, if it had feelings and other physical characteristics it would be a physical body and would be destroyed.
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Digit
Senior Veteran
My questions earlier, is how do you know this? Obviously if there is a lake of fire, it's not in the physical realm as it's the spiritual hell so to speak. So how do you know, that this spiritual fire, will not harm spiritual creatures?
My second question, is how do you know the characteristics of either, when neither are elaborated on in the Bible?
Do the sticky situation we get into if we begin to make these assumptions?
Cheers!
Digit
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My questions earlier, is how do you know this? Obviously if there is a lake of fire, it's not in the physical realm as it's the spiritual hell so to speak. So how do you know, that this spiritual fire, will not harm spiritual creatures?
My second question, is how do you know the characteristics of either, when neither are elaborated on in the Bible?
Do the sticky situation we get into if we begin to make these assumptions?
Cheers!
Digit
What is spiritual fire? If it is not a physical fire like the one you see at a camp fire then it is not fire. Obviously the idea of hell could have been described in a symbolic way. The Bible is not a science book and the point of death (from a person who believe in an afterlife) is separation from the physical realm and entrance into the spirit realm. You base your beliefs on a book written by men which has been around for over one thousand years and you believe pretty much everything in it. So you automatically assume its correct.
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Digit
Senior Veteran
It would follow that spiritual fire, would be fire in the spirit realm no? Or do you think that the spirit realm has normal fire? I don't think hell was described in symbolism at all, I think it's very literal, but I do not think we should assume that this fire is normal by any means. For example the Bible says it's a lake where the fire is eternal. That immediately doesnt' sound like normal fire to me, which requires fuel to burn, without it, it extinguishes. Clearly it's not normal in that light.
My point however, is that I felt you were perhaps getting confused by some assumptions, which you were taking to be definite facts. So in this respect, try to question things not from our human perspective, but from what the Bible tells us. I mean to say, you have already distinguished between physical and spiritual, and in the first sentence of your above reply, you mentioned physical fire. Which is fire that is as you describe, in the physical realm. So following that, does it not take that fire in the spiritual realm is spiritual fire?
Does that make sense?
All the best!
Digit
My point however, is that I felt you were perhaps getting confused by some assumptions, which you were taking to be definite facts. So in this respect, try to question things not from our human perspective, but from what the Bible tells us. I mean to say, you have already distinguished between physical and spiritual, and in the first sentence of your above reply, you mentioned physical fire. Which is fire that is as you describe, in the physical realm. So following that, does it not take that fire in the spiritual realm is spiritual fire?
Does that make sense?
All the best!
Digit
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This was a factual account, not a parable. The beggar has a name. What's the point of that if it's a parable? Why didn't Jesus stop at saying there was a certain beggar?
Well, what were you expecting when you addressed the thread to Christians? The Hindu POV or a quote from Stephen Hawking?LeonTrotsky said:
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It would follow that spiritual fire, would be fire in the spirit realm no? Or do you think that the spirit realm has normal fire? I don't think hell was described in symbolism at all, I think it's very literal, but I do not think we should assume that this fire is normal by any means. For example the Bible says it's a lake where the fire is eternal. That immediately doesnt' sound like normal fire to me, which requires fuel to burn, without it, it extinguishes. Clearly it's not normal in that light.
My point however, is that I felt you were perhaps getting confused by some assumptions, which you were taking to be definite facts. So in this respect, try to question things not from our human perspective, but from what the Bible tells us. I mean to say, you have already distinguished between physical and spiritual, and in the first sentence of your above reply, you mentioned physical fire. Which is fire that iss you describe, in the physical realm. So following that, does it not take that fire in the spiritual realm is spiritual fire?
Does that make sense?
All the best!
Digit
So hell contains special fire that never burns out and which does not need oxygen? Were are you comming up with this? Do you not know what fire needs to survive?
Why should I rely on a book written by men years and years ago when science was not nearly as advanced as today? Why not believe in the Koran? Obviously the Bible is not a good source since Christianity has many denominations and have never been able to agree on all subjects, I figured an error free book would be able to make that happen.
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Who knows why?This was a factual account, not a parable. The beggar has a name. What's the point of that if it's a parable? Why didn't Jesus stop at saying there was a certain beggar?
Well, what were you expecting when you addressed the thread to Christians? The Hindu POV or a quote from Stephen Hawking?
I know what the Bible says about hell but it seems not all Christians have come to an agreement about if it was symbolic or not. So I figured I can have some explenations on their views on hell.
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Digit
Senior Veteran
I don't know for sure. But I think so yes.
From the Bible:
Matthew 18:8
If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage...erse=7&end_verse=9&version=31&context=context Matthew 25:41
"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage...se=40&end_verse=42&version=31&context=context Jude 1:7
In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage...erse=6&end_verse=8&version=31&context=context
As you can see, it is most certainly eternal. Does that sound like normal fire to you?
That is almost a two-parter. First up is that if you come to a Christian forum and ask Christians questions based on Christianity, then you will quite obviously get responses from that perspective. You cannot ask a Christian about their religion, and then tell them to leave the Bible out of it. It is their religion.
Secondly, science compliments Christianity, in fact Christianity has done more for science than any other worldview:
"From Copernicus to Newton it was not deism but Christian theism that served as a principle factor helping the scientific enterprise reach self-sustaining maturity." - Stanley L. Jaki.
Again, isn't that a seperate thread? For myself, I not only believe in what the Bible says, but I feel what it says is true. I have felt God in my life and from that I conclude it is the Christian God, not another god.
Christians all believe the central message of the Bible, yet we differ on our specific focuses, the denominations are there as a sort of guideline so we can find people who focus and hold views like us, but who are of one faith. They are not seperate religious views as you say.
I hope that helped, to be honest I would appreciate some input from your side, as to why you feel these things are either unprobably, or impossible. I don't mind answering questions.
Cheers!
Digit
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