Literal Days?

[tobewan]

C.Dave:
Gen. 1:1
In the beginning, the Formative/Cosmology Era),
God, (the Uncaused First Cause, or Dark Energy which pre-existed the material Universe), created...
... (all which followed the Big Bang that consisted of
Seven Stages:

1) The Plank Stage
2) The Hadron Stage
3) The Inflation Stage
4) The Lepton Stage
5) The Radiation Stage
6) The Nucleo-synthetic Stage
7) The Matter Stage,...

Tobewan considers:
Looked at your link, Mr Firth gave no training, education, nor any citations of those in the know and study thereof, indicating he just 'dreamed it up'. Where is the back-up?

 

[Huram Abi]

Gen. 1:1
In the beginning, the Formative/Cosmology Era),
God, (the Uncaused First Cause, or Dark Energy which pre-existed the material Universe), created...
... (all which followed the Big Bang that consisted of
Seven Stages:



the seven steps of Big Bang:
Step by Step Guide to The Big Bang | Scienceray

Uh... once again you fail to perform the simple function of counting before you go claiming "Aha! Seven!"

Mr. Firth has 9 eras listed.


Also, Scienceray is essentially a blog that crowdsources for content.

 

[SkyWriting]

Thus, energy is matter. And matter is energy. They are one and the same.

That's my take on it as well. Though you will find no official support for "energy is matter."
Nobody claims that except on Yahoo.answers and such.

Nonsense. Yes, energy and matter cannot be created or destroyed, they just change forms. Nothing in that statement suggests that "supernatural" must be employed to explain it.

I disagree. "Neither matter nor energy can be Created" says Science.
Yet here we are. Energy and Matter HAS been Created.
Science says Energy and Matter can't be. So the answer for a source must
be from outside of Science. Outside of Nature. Because inside, our rules state
that neither han be created out of nothing. Yet here we are.

(Side topical ranting):

[QUOTE]For one thing, that's meaningless. What is, "supernatural"? You don't know. You just throw that word out when you don't have a clue. If it interacts with this universe it's natural. Period. If it doesn't interact with this universe we have no way of knowing about it. So who cares? Your "entity" is not an option to creating us. Because then what created it? And no, it can't just create itself. Not an option. Then we don't need it because the universe can be self-creating no gods needed. [/QUOTE]

More anger, pouting, & sputtering off your own topic:

[QUOTE]Jesus was a man who knew very little about the world around him. You guys promoted him to a god. In his mind of course a god was responsible. That made sense back then. It's just ridiculous now.[/QUOTE]

 

[cupid dave]

Uh... once again you fail to perform the simple function of counting before you go claiming "Aha! Seven!"

Mr. Firth has 9 eras listed.


Also, Scienceray is essentially a blog that crowdsources for content.

?

Count them again.

Give us the list and see.

Matter Era


At the start of our present "era," (i.e.; the six geological eras from the end of the Big Bang onward),... photons were free to travel through the Universe.
Most electrons were bound to atoms until the first stars formed, reheating matter.

The diameter of the Universe is currently 100 million light years and rising. (1 light year = 9.6 trillion kilometres)


Note:
The article goes on to inform you again about what I have told you so manytimes, albeit yiur are recalcitrant to science edification due to opinionate biases.

Light did not start to flow across the Universe until God said, "Let there be light" some time after "In the beginning" of the Universe.




Gen. 1:3 And God, (Father Nature who says, "I am," almighty Reality), said, Let there be light: and there was light, (which was delayed by 400 million years after the Big Bang)

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Time: From the Big Bang Creation to the Present[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif](Note: 400 my Dark Age)[/FONT]​

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif](Amazingly accurate, Genesis claims that light appeared, with some implied delay, after the initial creation of the matter which would ultimately form the heavens and earth.)
[/FONT]


Genesis 1:3

 

[cupid dave]

IF a big bang occurred, what caused the big bang?

Stars with enough mass become black holes, so not even light can escape their enormous gravity. How then could anything escape the trillions upon trillions of times greater gravity caused by concentrating all the universe’s mass in a “cosmic egg” that existed before a big bang?

Pre-existing Energy is what "caused" the Big Bang.

Einstein explains this, in that since Energy can not be created but in a trasfigeration of itself it is the creator of the material univers.

The unfathonable amount of that pre-exising Energy apparently was quite sufficient of forces which, de facto, "could" explode matter sufficiently to "escape the trillions upon trillions of times greater gravity caused by concentrating all the universe’s mass in a 'cosmic egg'.”


The questions raised by these other people in your article merely encourage more theories, and do not negate the theory we have already established through evidenc that supports the Big Bang.

As Einstein himself sais, every theory is a door into a room where we find ten more doors that we must systematically examine and open as Science step by step, reports the facts of life.

 

[Huram Abi]

?

Count them again.

Give us the list and see.

You really can't count, can you?

Okay, Cupid, there isn't much I can do if you have a learning disability that hinders you from being to count beyond 7. I can only list and enumerate them and hope that you can figure out that "8" means eight and "9" means nine.

From the link you posted:


1. Planck
2. Inflation
3. Quark
4. Electroweak
5. Hadron
6. Lepton
7. Neucleosynthesis
8. Quark
9. Matter


And this is only a partial list. But even according to your own source, there are more than 7. The rest of what you posted about photons is irrelevant to the number of eras from the Big Bang till now, except that the era when this happened is called the "Photon era" and is not given in your list.

 

[Huram Abi]

Pre-existing Energy is what "caused" the Big Bang.

Einstein explains this, in that since Energy can not be created but in a trasfigeration of itself it is the creator of the material univers.

The unfathonable amount of that pre-exising Energy apparently was quite sufficient of forces which, de facto, "could" explode matter sufficiently to "escape the trillions upon trillions of times greater gravity caused by concentrating all the universe’s mass in a 'cosmic egg'.”


The questions raised by these other people in your article merely encourage more theories, and do not negate the theory we have already established through evidenc that supports the Big Bang.

As Einstein himself sais, every theory is a door into a room where we find ten more doors that we must systematically examine and open as Science step by step, reports the facts of life.

This whole thing is bogus, Cupid. Again, please don't ad lib. Do some research!

And your Einstien quote is clearly something that originated with you. It has your cadence, redundance, and idiosyncrasies.

"we must examine as science" and "report the facts of life" are dead give aways that this is yours. You may not notice that you can't help but repetitively use the same phrases and specific combinations of words over and over, but you do. It's a clear signature.

Besides, Einstien would have said something much more eloquent and insightful.

 

[Naraoia]

Thanks for the question -- tried to comply -- here are some, Naraoia, and all.

Thanks. Good to see your claims don't come out of your own backside

I'm not a cosmologist, so I can't get into the depths of the physics, but it does strike me that most of your material is pretty old. That makes it questionable that it reflects the current understanding of cosmology. Other comments I have:

“The big bang theory, now known to be seriously flawed, was based on three observations: the redshift of light from distant stars, the cosmic microwave background (CMB) radiation, and the amount of helium in the universe. All three have been poorly understood.” Ref: Roy C Martin Jr. “Astronomy on Trial” 1999.

AFAIK, the big bang theory was based on none of the above. Its roots were the redshift of distant galaxies (not stars), and the mathematical ramifications of general relativity. The CMBR wasn't discovered until decades after the theory was first proposed.

Redshift of starlight is usually interpreted as a Doppler effect; that stars and galaxies are moving away from the Earth, stretching out (or reddening) the wavelengths of light they emit. Space itself supposedly expands—so the potential energy of stars, galaxies, and other matter increases today no corresponding loss of energy elsewhere. Thus the big babg violates the law of conservation of energy, probably the most important of all physical laws. Ref: Jarant V Narlikar, “Noncosmological Redshifts” 1989; and, Edward R Harrison, “Mining Energy in an Expanding Universe” 1955.

I don't think the "no corresponding loss of energy elsewhere" part is true. The universe is cooling if nothing else.

CMB. All matter radiates heat, regardless of its temperature. Astronomers can detect an extremely uniform radiation, called cosmic microwave background (CMB) radiation, coming from all directions. It appears to come from perfectly radiating matter whose temperature is 2.73K---nearly absolute zero. Many incorrectly believe that the big bang theory predicted this radiation. Ref: George Ganow 1946; Tom Van flandern, “Did the Universe Have a Beginning” 1994.

Why is it incorrect? You forgot to quote the part that explains that.

Helium. Contrary to what is commonly taught, the big bang theory does not explain the amount of helium in the universe; the theory was adjusted to fit the amount of helium. Ref: Van Flandern pg 33. Ironically, the lack of helium in certain types of stars (B type stars), Ref: D.W.Sciama, “Modern Cosmology” 1971, and the presence of beryllium and boron in “older” stars, contradicts the big bang theory, Ref: Ron Cowen, “Starlight Casts Doubt on Big Bang Details” 1991. A big bang would produce only hydrogen, helium, and lithium, so this first generation of stars to somehow form after abig bang should consist only of those elements. Some of these stars should still exist, but despite extensive searches, none has been found. Ref: Bernard Carr, “Where is Population III?” 1987.

I thought first-generation stars were supposed to be heavy and short-lived The only place we could observe such stars is the edge of the observable universe. The most distant objects ever seen by humans appear as they were ~500 million years after the bang. The oldest known individual star is about the same age. If stars began to form a few hundred million years after the big bang and were indeed massive, they could've spit out many generations of heavy elements by that time. (Hey, and here's a rough stellar lifetime calculator. Awesome!)

IF the big bang occurred, we should not see massive galaxies at such great distances, but galaxies are seen. Massive galaxies and galaxy clusters are now found at such great distances that they must have formed soon after the universe began. The big bang theory cannot explain how such galaxy concentrations could have formed so quickly and so far away. Ref: Gregory D. Wirth, “Old Before Their Time” 2004.

Why? And far away from what?

The stretching explanation says that galaxies and galaxy clusters began before the heavens were stretched out, when all matter was relatively confined. A big bang should not produce highly concentrated or rotating bodies. Ref: James Trefil, “The Dark side of the Universe” 1988 & William R Corliss, “Stars, Galaxies, Cosmos: A Catalog of Astronomical Anomalies” 1987; Galaxies are examples of both. Nor should a big bang produce tightly clustered galaxies. Ref: Stephen D Landy, “Mapping the Universe” 1999.

This sounds muddled. I believe the actual hypothesis is that small, random density fluctuations in the early universe seeded galaxy clusters. Those clumps of matter that were large/dense enough for their gravity to hold them together in the face of expansion grew into the structures we see today, and everything else became the empty space in between.

Since I'm not a physicist, I'm sure this analogy has all sorts of holes in it, but I find a parallel to the way crystals precipitate from a solution. (I have several examples lying around on my lab bench. Should probably throw out used reagents, eh? ) The salts in the water don't precipitate into a homogeneous mass, but form large, separate crystals. If a crystal starts forming somewhere, it'll attract more and more salt to itself, growing bigger and emptying its surroundings at the same time.

Also, a large volume of the universe should not be—but evidently is—moving sideways, almost perpendicular to the direction of apparent expansion Ref: Alan Dresler, “The Large Scale Streaming of Galaxies” 1987.

The universe is expanding in every direction. Where is "sideways", then?

IF a big bang occurred, what caused the big bang? Stars with enough mass become black holes, so not even light can escape their enormous gravity. How then could anything escape the trillions upon trillions of times greater gravity caused by concentrating all the universe’s mass in a “cosmic egg” that existed before a big bang?

"Was there a big bang?" and "What caused the big bang?" are two separate questions. For a long time, people had no idea what caused the sun to rise, but that hardly invalidated all the evidence for the existence of morning...

If you really want to know? See Amazon for “In the Beginning” Walter Brown, PHd 2008

Well, if I really wanted to know, I could probably find a few cosmologists to ask

 

[cupid dave]

You really can't count, can you?

Okay, Cupid, there isn't much I can do if you have a learning disability that hinders you from being to count beyond 7. I can only list and enumerate them and hope that you can figure out that "8" means eight and "9" means nine.

From the link you posted:


1. Planck
2. Inflation
3. Quark
4. Electroweak
5. Hadron
6. Lepton
7. Neucleosynthesis
8. Quark
9. Matter


And this is only a partial list. But even according to your own source, there are more than 7. The rest of what you posted about photons is irrelevant to the number of eras from the Big Bang till now, except that the era when this happened is called the "Photon era" and is not given in your list.

Wrong.
I think you can count so I must attribute this kind of falsifying to your bias against the things I bring to your attention;

HERE IS THE LINK VERBATIM:

1) The Planck Era
No current theory of physics can describe what happened at this point in time, however we believe strongly that it was a singularity of pure energy at the start of time.


2) The Inflation Era
Part of the Universe expanded from billions of times smaller than a proton to something the size of a football field. This eras lifespan was a hundred billionth of a yoctosecond and was approximately 1,000 trillion trillion degrees centigrade.

3) The Quark Era
This period saw vast number of quark and anti quark (what is quark?) pairs forming from energy and then annihilating back to energy. Gluons and other particles also appeared. This eras lifespan was about 100 millionth of a yocto second and was approximately 10 billion billion degrees centigrade.
Separation of the Electroweak force
Close to the end of the quark era, the Electroweak force separated and the weak interaction, from then on, the forces of nature and physical laws were as they are now experienced. This era was about 1.1 microseconds and temperatures reached 1000 trillion degrees.


4) Hadron Era
Around the beginning of this era, quarks and antiquarks began combining to form particles called hadrons. These included baryons (protons and neutrons) anti baryons and mesons. This ear took 1 microsecond to complete an was approximately 10 trillion degrees.

5) Lepton Era
Leptons (elections, neutrinos and antiparticles) were very numerous, by the end of this era the electrons annihilated with positrons (anti elections). The lepton era took 1 millisecond and was approximately 1 billion centigrade, by this point in the Big bang the universe was 1000 billion kilometres in diameter.

6) Nucleosynthesis Era
Neutrons converged into protons as the Universe cooled, but when there was about one neutron for every seven protons, most remaining neutrons combined with protons to make helium neclei, each with two protons and two neutrons. This era was 1 second long and was about 10 billion centigrade. In the middle of the Nucleosynthesis Era the Universe stretched to 10 light years in diameter (94.6 trillion kilometres)

7) Opaque Era
During this lengthy era of 200 seconds the sea of matter particles were in a continual state of interaction with photons making the Universe foggy. Temperatures reached 100 million degrees.
At the end of the Opaque Era, many more free protons existed than helium neclei, or other atomic neclei. The scene was set for the first atoms to form. When they did about 9 hydrogen atoms were made for each helium atom. A few lithium a deuterium (heavy hydrogen) atoms also formed.






The Matter Era is the start of our present era


At the start of our present era, photons were free to travel through the Universe. Most electrons were bound to atoms until the first stars formed, reheating matter. The diameter of the Universe is currently 100 million light years and rising. (1 light year = 9.6 trillion kilometres)


Read more: Step by Step Guide to The Big Bang | Scienceray

 

[cupid dave]

I don't think the "no corresponding loss of energy elsewhere" part is true. The universe is cooling if nothing else.

Whoever is writing such a thing is confused.

As bodies move away from one another, the gravitational energy between them remains the same.

The Potential Energy is sored in the bodies and if they stop fleeing one another, it will draw them back together again.

It is analogous to having thrown a ball up into the air.
The Kinetic energy that is used to separate the ball from the ground is going to be re-directed in to opposite direction once the ball stops moving up.

The potential energy that converts to a kinetic energy heading towards the groud wil equal thr same energy given to the ball when it was initially thrown up.
No energy has disappeared.

All that happened was kinetic energy was stored on the way up, and released on the way down.

This same thinking is applied to the Zero energy concept for the Universe.

The initial energy that created the cosmos will equal the sum all the mass in the universe (in terms of its energy equivalent), plus this idea of kinetic/potential energy relationship between the masses that are now moving away from one another.

Some people call this something from nothing but they mean that we do not assume thatthere was a necessary pre-existing energy to account for the matter that would start movng away in that big bang.

 

[Huram Abi]

HERE IS THE LINK VERBATIM:

1) The Planck Era
No current theory of physics can describe what happened at this point in time, however we believe strongly that it was a singularity of pure energy at the start of time.


2) The Inflation Era
Part of the Universe expanded from billions of times smaller than a proton to something the size of a football field. This eras lifespan was a hundred billionth of a yoctosecond and was approximately 1,000 trillion trillion degrees centigrade.

3) The Quark Era
This period saw vast number of quark and anti quark (what is quark?) pairs forming from energy and then annihilating back to energy. Gluons and other particles also appeared. This eras lifespan was about 100 millionth of a yocto second and was approximately 10 billion billion degrees centigrade.

4) Separation of the Electroweak force
Close to the end of the quark era, the Electroweak force separated and the weak interaction, from then on, the forces of nature and physical laws were as they are now experienced. This era was about 1.1 microseconds and temperatures reached 1000 trillion degrees.


5) Hadron Era
Around the beginning of this era, quarks and antiquarks began combining to form particles called hadrons. These included baryons (protons and neutrons) anti baryons and mesons. This ear took 1 microsecond to complete an was approximately 10 trillion degrees.

6) Lepton Era
Leptons (elections, neutrinos and antiparticles) were very numerous, by the end of this era the electrons annihilated with positrons (anti elections). The lepton era took 1 millisecond and was approximately 1 billion centigrade, by this point in the Big bang the universe was 1000 billion kilometres in diameter.

7) Nucleosynthesis Era
Neutrons converged into protons as the Universe cooled, but when there was about one neutron for every seven protons, most remaining neutrons combined with protons to make helium neclei, each with two protons and two neutrons. This era was 1 second long and was about 10 billion centigrade. In the middle of the Nucleosynthesis Era the Universe stretched to 10 light years in diameter (94.6 trillion kilometres)

8) Opaque Era
During this lengthy era of 200 seconds the sea of matter particles were in a continual state of interaction with photons making the Universe foggy. Temperatures reached 100 million degrees.
At the end of the Opaque Era, many more free protons existed than helium neclei, or other atomic neclei. The scene was set for the first atoms to form. When they did about 9 hydrogen atoms were made for each helium atom. A few lithium a deuterium (heavy hydrogen) atoms also formed.



The Matter Era is the start of our present era


AND ALSO MUST BE COUNTED.

9) Matter era

Look again.

 

[tobewan]

Tobewan presents an interesting delight to some:

FLORIDA COURT SETS ATHEIST HOLY DAY

In Florida, an Atheist created a case against the upcoming Easter and Passover holy days. He hired an attorney to bring a discrimination case against Christians, Jews and observances of their holy days. The argument was that it was unfair that atheists had no such recognized days.

The case was brought before a judge. After listening to the pass ionate presentation by the lawyer, the judge banged his gavel declaring, “Case dismissed!”

The lawyer immediately stood objecting to the ruling saying, “Your honor, how can you possibly dismiss this case? The Christians have Christmas, Easter and others. The Jews have Passover, Yom Kippur and Hanukkah, yet my client and all other atheists have no such holidays.”

The judge leaned forward in his chair saying, “But you do. Your client, counsel, is woefully ignorant.” The lawyer said, “Your Honor, we are unaware of any special observance or holiday for atheists.”

The judge said, “The calendar says April 1st is April Fools Day. Psalm 14:1 states , ‘The fool says in his heart, there is no God. ‘ Thus, it is the opinion of this court, that if your client says there is no God, then he is a fool. Therefore, April 1st is his day. Court is adjourned.”

You gotta love a Judge that knows his scripture!

 

[tobewan]

Tobewan: Concerning your 9 points of era's: Gee whiz, Hiram Abi, you can imagine all that? Imagine that!

And do you think that the Creator would do all that? Hmmm....

The Creator has an agenda HE designed, not man in all of his imaginations.

Lets stick with the Scriptures

 

[Huram Abi]

Be my guest.

 

[Psudopod]

Tobewan presents an interesting delight to some:

You know this isn't a real event, right?
snopes.com: Atheist Holiday

 

[GuardianShua]

Nah....

Jesus, the mere son of a man was born in 4BC.

The Christ came down from heaven like a dove, and this spirit of God indwelled Jesus when his near death experience was induced by baptism wherein John held people under until they almost Straight Lined.







Mat 3:16 And Jesus, (the son of man), when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, (in this ritual of Plerosis), and he saw the Spirit of God, (the immortal Elijah), descending like a dove, and lighting upon him, (in a fulling by the indwelling spirit of Elijah

Mat 3:17 (Then and only then does the son-of-God appear),…

And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This, (now), is my beloved Son, (the immortal Elijah), in whom I am well pleased.

Uh oh, got some little boo boo's going. Recheck scriptures.

 

[Trogool]

Tobewan presents an interesting delight to some:

FLORIDA COURT SETS ATHEIST HOLY DAY

In Florida, an Atheist created a case against the upcoming Easter and Passover holy days. He hired an attorney to bring a discrimination case against Christians, Jews and observances of their holy days. The argument was that it was unfair that atheists had no such recognized days.

The case was brought before a judge. After listening to the pass ionate presentation by the lawyer, the judge banged his gavel declaring, "Case dismissed!"

The lawyer immediately stood objecting to the ruling saying, "Your honor, how can you possibly dismiss this case? The Christians have Christmas, Easter and others. The Jews have Passover, Yom Kippur and Hanukkah, yet my client and all other atheists have no such holidays."

The judge leaned forward in his chair saying, "But you do. Your client, counsel, is woefully ignorant." The lawyer said, "Your Honor, we are unaware of any special observance or holiday for atheists."

The judge said, "The calendar says April 1st is April Fools Day. Psalm 14:1 states , 'The fool says in his heart, there is no God. ' Thus, it is the opinion of this court, that if your client says there is no God, then he is a fool. Therefore, April 1st is his day. Court is adjourned."

You gotta love a Judge that knows his scripture!

Why would we love such ridiculously juvenile behavior from a judge?

 

[AV1611VET]

Why would we love such ridiculously juvenile behavior from a judge?

Atheists get their own day on the calendar -- handed to them on a silver platter and upheld in a court of law -- and what do they do? rant and rave about it.

Some people have to fight and argue and invest a lot of money to get their particular interest represented on the calendar.

 

[Naraoia]

Atheists get their own day on the calendar -- handed to them on a silver platter and upheld in a court of law -- and what do they do? rant and rave about it.

Some people have to fight and argue and invest a lot of money to get their particular interest represented on the calendar.

As if being called fools were a compliment. Maybe if you have enough of a martyr complex...

 

[AV1611VET]

As if being called fools were a compliment.

Would you rather be called 'lost'?