Liberating Motherhood

ChristoEtEcclesiae said:

Dress up like a man you must and if it really makes you feel more "liberated."

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lol, Its funny how feminists seem to dislike the culture of men, yet dress like them and butch themselves up. What is the deal with that? Fight the "patriarchy" by dressing more patriarchal?

some of those NOW organizers and leaders, man. They hate men, yet they want to look so much like them and dress like them. Its almost like weenie envy or something, lol. Look at Rachel Maddow or Madylyn Murray, holy smeckles!


HERE COMES THE BRIDE!

I'm not quite sure where you got the idea, Meepy, that Rachel Maddow "hates men" just because she is gay.

Gay people don't "hate" people of the opposite sex--they just don't have sexual relationships with them.

Using your flawed logic, if everyone hates the genders they don't have sexual relationships with, for example, priests would "hate" everybody.

Both ideas are flawed fruits of the same poisoned tree.

ChristoEtEcclesiae said:

That's the problem, I don't want to call a woman "sir."

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or a man, "miss"?


what happens when you go off the deep end ..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4f7_Hb2Djiw&feature=relmfu

Fantine said:

I'm not quite sure where you got the idea, Meepy, that Rachel Maddow "hates men" just because she is gay.

Gay people don't "hate" people of the opposite sex--they just don't have sexual relationships with them.

Using your flawed logic, if everyone hates the genders they don't have sexual relationships with, for example, priests would "hate" everybody.

Both ideas are flawed fruits of the same poisoned tree.

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Meepy didn't say gay people. Gay people just have an identity disorder. I had said radical feminists who like to dress like men(which constitutes a large proportion)

Maybe its a rebellion thing. Maybe rebelling against tradition or societal norms, God and the bible. But people who do this just tend to end up looking like idiots in the long run. Sorry, but its true. In the end they just end up going off the deep end. The family cultural in the west is anything but functional.

I'm still hoping for that kindle, fantine, hehe

ChristoEtEcclesiae said:

That's the problem, I don't want to call a woman "sir."

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Then don't. I don't see why that's so hard.

I am sorry if you can't tell women in pants from men, you might need glasses.

There is a teeny, tiny percentage of women who dress truly like men, and they are part of the lesbian social culture. And I don't think they'd much care if you called them "Sir".

Meepy said:

lol, Its funny how feminists seem to dislike the culture of men, yet dress like them and butch themselves up.

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Holy sweeping generalisations, Batman! Do you actually know any feminists?? The two most--and seriously radical, feminists I know are both dripping with femininity. Long hair, skirts, the whole caboodle.

_Shannon_ said:

Holy sweeping generalisations, Batman! Do you actually know any feminists?? The two most--and seriously radical, feminists I know are both dripping with femininity. Long hair, skirts, the whole caboodle.

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SHAA NAY NAY!!


which ones are they?

I always thought Ruth Ginsburg was the head honcho. And Gloria Steinem is always in those rigid mens suits. Naomi Wolf is feminine though, and kinda sexy too, hehe.

I never was a fan of Batman!

Here's some quotes from these nutcases :

"The simple fact is that every woman must be willing to be identified as a lesbian to be fully feminist" (National NOW Times, January, 1988).

"Feminism is the theory, lesbianism is the practice." -- Ti-Grace Atkinson

"Since marriage constitutes slavery for women, it is clear that the women's movement must concentrate on attacking this institution. Freedom for women cannot be won without the abolition of marriage" (feminist leader Sheila Cronan).

Actually Noami Wolf had some interesting things to say about womens modesty and the veil and burqua:

Wolf recently traveled to Morocco, Jordan, and Eygpt, where she found the women “as interested in allure, seduction, and pleasure as women anywhere in the world.” Whew! What a relief. She writes:


“Many Muslim women I spoke with did not feel at all subjugated by the chador or the headscarf. On the contrary, they felt liberated from what they experienced as the intrusive, commodifying, basely sexualizing Western gaze. … Many women said something like this: …’how tiring it can be to be on display all the time. When I wear my headscarf or chador, people relate to me as an individual, not an object; I feel respected.’ This may not be expressed in a traditional Western feminist set of images, but it is a recognizably Western feminist set of feelings.”


Marabel Morgan lives! In the mid-1970s, Morgan advised wives to greet their husbands at the door. Her book, Total Woman, sold more than ten million copies. According to Morgan, a Christian:

“It’s only when a woman surrenders her life to her husband, reveres and worships him and is willing to serve him, that she becomes really beautiful to him.”

I agree partly with Marabel Morgan, she seems to be one of the rare ones who truly understand real womens liberation. Not with "worshiping" your husband, but a wife being attentive and surrenders herself to him shows she trusts him and loves him. And in love we are truly free.

Meepy said:

I never was a fan of Batman!

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Exactly which one of those women is easily mistaken for a man??

There's no accounting for taste..BAtman rules!

If a man revered me, worshipped me, and honoured me, he would become beautiful to me, too. But somehow we always end up thinking that men don't have to revere or honour their wives, because that's the women's job. A man's reverence for his wife can be shown in many ways - helping her with household tasks, showing affection, speaking words of love. Treating her with respect and comforting her in times of need. That, to me, is very, very beautiful.

Dennis Prager had an interesting answer to what do men want, and what do women want.
What Do Men Want? - Dennis Prager - National Review Online

For a man, he wants to be adored and respected by a woman that he is in love with.

What Do Women Want? - Dennis Prager - National Review Online
For a woman, the answer is not the same, but complementary.
She wants to be loved by a man that she admires.

What feminism has given to the West, and what even liberal women of the third world are rejecting, is the feminist idea that men are not even necessary for a woman's ultimate happiness.

Really, this is something that ought to be rejected, as we ought to reject the idea that perfect equality in the relationship is what is to be wanted.
What is good for the goose is not always what is good for the gander. Western woman have been trained to think that they would fully appreciate a man who worships her, looks up to her, and honors him as a hero.
In reality, more often than not, a woman would end up looking down on a man like that.

Marriage is not enslavement of women. It is not a patriarchal institution that serves the interests of the man, but indeed it civilizes the nature of a man in order than he serve the interest of his woman and their family, and place those interests above the more pressing interests of his own penis.

Monogamy is not natural to men. His natural interest is to spread the seed far and wide. Feminists in the West resented this kind of freedom and resented that their destiny was tied to their biology. The Pill and abortion were the panaceas that 'freed' them to become like men, to open their wings and fly to the same heights of pleasure as the male of the species, without consequence or concern.

This was a grand experiment started in the 1970's. This is what we as Catholics really ought to reject.

Mary has always been the model for women to strive toward, humble, open to God, open to motherhood, not living for her own empowerment, but for God and her family—for the glory of the Man in her life even, through whom she herself becomes fulfilled.

This is who feminists of the West have rejected most of all.

I think many girls are finding, often too late, that there is no life less rewarding, less free, less pleasurable, less true to their own nature, than to live the kind of freedom that young men strive for. What may keep a Mick Jagger going well into his seventies is the antithesis of what any woman would normally strive for.

Motherhood is freedom.

I don't get it. Why not just be yourself? If you are an adult, why not do what you have too? And if you have the luxury what you want too? Public opinion doesn't make your choice more "right".

If you want children, then have them or adopt. If you wish to work or stay home with them then find a partner who is like-minded.

I am happy for the rights I have in the western world. Feminism has given me the choice to be who I want to be. It means if I stop listening to many I can follow my passions and do what I have to do. My goal now is to learn all I can. I'm going to be a physicist. If anyone doesn't like it then to bad.

SolomonVII said:

What feminism has given to the West, and what even liberal women of the third world are rejecting, is the feminist idea that men are not even necessary for a woman's ultimate happiness.

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They aren't... no one is necessary for anyone's ultimate happiness aside from God.

SolomonVII said:

Marriage is not enslavement of women. It is not a patriarchal institution that serves the interests of the man, but indeed it civilizes the nature of a man in order than he serve the interest of his woman and their family, and place those interests above the more pressing interests of his own penis.

Monogamy is not natural to men. His natural interest is to spread the seed far and wide. Feminists in the West resented this kind of freedom and resented that their destiny was tied to their biology. The Pill and abortion were the panaceas that 'freed' them to become like men, to open their wings and fly to the same heights of pleasure as the male of the species, without consequence or concern.

This was a grand experiment started in the 1970's. This is what we as Catholics really ought to reject.

Mary has always been the model for women to strive toward, humble, open to God, open to motherhood, not living for her own empowerment, but for God and her family—for the glory of the Man in her life even, through whom she herself becomes fulfilled.

This is who feminists of the West have rejected most of all.

I think many girls are finding, often too late, that there is no life less rewarding, less free, less pleasurable, less true to their own nature, than to live the kind of freedom that young men strive for. What may keep a Mick Jagger going well into his seventies is the antithesis of what any woman would normally strive for.

Motherhood is freedom.

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This statement is just ridiculous.

My mother was self-employed and in business with my father. She wears pants. She cuts her hair. And she wears make up.

She was also a wonderful mother.

To suggest that motherhood is the only way a woman can be happy is absurd. What about women that can't have children? Are they just not meant to be happy? What are we supposed to do with them -- throw them away?

And what about women that don't marry? They can't be happy?

princess_ballet said:

To suggest that motherhood is the only way a woman can be happy is absurd. What about women that can't have children? Are they just not meant to be happy? What are we supposed to do with them -- throw them away?

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This is what I have been asking, but so far, no one has answered me. I'm not sure what to think.

princess_ballet said:

This statement is just ridiculous.

My mother was self-employed and in business with my father. She wears pants. She cuts her hair. And she wears make up.

She was also a wonderful mother.

To suggest that motherhood is the only way a woman can be happy is absurd. What about women that can't have children? Are they just not meant to be happy? What are we supposed to do with them -- throw them away?

And what about women that don't marry? They can't be happy?

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This seems to be pure emotion without any thought as to what either I or Dennis Prager was saying.

Make-up?
Pants?
A job?

Where in the world are you pulling those things out of?

Dennis Prager encourages women to wear make-up and look their best. His own mother put her make-up on every day of her life.
So does my wife, with her pants and her job.

Maybe you should read what he was saying again, and think about it rather than huffing and puffing and getting all offended and defensive—all about things that most likely weren't either being said or even insinuated by either myself of especially not by Dennis Prager in the links I provided for context.

I think though for either a man or a woman to give up their sexuality to the priesthood or orders, or a gay to give up theirs for the sake of righteousness, there is a real, real sense of loss and sacrifice.

It is a hard hard thing to do, devastating in many ways. It is something that anyone born before the generations that the 1970's taught would have understood intrinsically, and something that anyone born since that time rejects with an unthinking, almost maniacal zeal.
When Ann Coulter said that abortion is the one human right that defines feminism, she wasn't far from the truth. Either through abortion, or birth control, or leading a sexless life, that is what is happening in the world today—a full scale assault upon a woman's very biological identity as a sexual being through motherhood.

This is not a piddling little thing, giving up motherhood, giving up life with a man or a woman to share it with.
There is a sacrifice involved.

Feminism has taught women well that they need a man as much as a fish needs a bicycle, and most young women have taken that lesson to heart. Many come out of their college years of hooking up feeling totally unfulfilled, and glad to be out of the scene; probably many more come out of those years totally sexless.

Not many look to Mary any more for anything —a vision or two in some exotic location, but that is about it.

And this you say, is ridiculous to muse about.

If you say so.
I am happily married, and my wife was never happier than when she was pregnant.


It is your life, not mine....
Enjoy

FWIW I know Solomon didn't say don't wear pants or makeup but I love pants hate makeup cuz I am lazy about makeup and really don't know what I'm doing with the stuff. I tried to wear it for awhile because I wanted to cover my freckles and blemishes and to be pretty enough for my dad to be proud of me and want to hug me without me prompting but at the end of the day.....
I was too lazy to be "pretty enough"

Gwendolyn said:

If a man revered me, worshipped me, and honoured me, he would become beautiful to me, too. But somehow we always end up thinking that men don't have to revere or honour their wives, because that's the women's job. A man's reverence for his wife can be shown in many ways - helping her with household tasks, showing affection, speaking words of love. Treating her with respect and comforting her in times of need. That, to me, is very, very beautiful.

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I disagree. The bible always commands husbands to love their wives. I think its more of a 1 Peter 3:1 type deal(show respect by behavior). Husband loves wife, wife relates back to the husband in a loving submissive manner, husband relates to his wife's respect, behavior and love for him. Which is what peter means, men being won over by the behavior of their wives.

_Shannon_ said:

There's no accounting for taste..BAtman rules!

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This is a real woman! She never tried to make a cultural statement. But only said "Thy will be done"! and traveled on a donkey with her husband while pregnant with Jesus. Now there is true taste.

thy will, not my will.