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Immortality of the soul, taught by the ancient greeks, but not fully accurate.....Early Christians were the first to believe in ONE soul that was eternal.
Yep, just like the false teachings of demons, devils, witches...
Mt 13:28 He said to them, a man1, an enemy has done this thing. And the servants said to him, Do you wish then that we go and gather2 them up?
1* Greek ανθρωπος man
you cant say everything contrary to your theology is demonic.
I said there are no demons that they even exist are false teachings.
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to misleading spirits, and doctrines of a devil;
No, that is not what I say, it what the Bible says! that you are departing from the faith...I will leave it up to God to determine if those who believe in "Doctrines of a Devil" are no longer Christian, thank you.so your saying that THAT VERSE speaks of "Doctrines of a Devil" meaning that if we believe in the Devil we are departing from the faith and no longer Christian?Is that what you are saying?really?
This is not true, Plato lived BC, but believed the soul was immortal. This is where the idea originated. It is not a Christian Belief. According to the NT, a person must be resurrected by Jesus Christ in order to have eternal life.Immortality of the soul, taught by the ancient greeks, but not fully accurate.....Early Christians were the first to believe in ONE soul that was eternal.
This is not true, Plato lived BC, but believed the soul was immortal. This is where the idea originated. It is not a Christian Belief. According to the NT, a person must be resurrected by Jesus Christ in order to have eternal life.
You have asked a lot of questions about our beliefs. Please read this short document, because it expains the biblical position very nicely.
http://lhim.org/topics/pdfs/Matt Elton -- Hell - A Place of Silence and Extinction Revision 4.3.pdf
No, that is not what I say, it what the Bible says! that you are departing from the faith...I will leave it up to God to determine if those who believe in "Doctrines of a Devil" are no longer Christian, thank you.
You must mean this one: http://lhim.org/topics/pdfs/Matt%20E...sion%204.3.pdfWhat happened? I responded to someone's post in this thread and now both my response and the post I reponded to are missing. It was a good post, and a good response, if I say so myself.
Thanks He-man, This is great. This really explains somethings I was having trouble with, I know that only those who are in Christ have eternal life, this explains the fate of those outside Christ very well. The Job quote is particularly good.You must mean this one: http://lhim.org/topics/pdfs/Matt%20E...sion%204.3.pdf
Hell is the place where all the dead - righteous and unrighteous - await the resurrectionat the day of judgement. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
--Revelation 20:13
As we have seen, the first death is a sleep during which a person unconsciously awaits the resurrection, but the second death will be the destruction of both body and soul (Matthew 10:28).
For ye say, Where is the house of the prince? and where are the dwelling places of the wicked? Have ye not asked them that go by the way? and do ye not know their tokens, That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath. Who shall declare his way to his face? and who shall repay him what he hath done? Yet shall he be brought to the grave, and shall remain in the tomb. --Job 21:28-32 http://lhim.org/topics/pdfs/Matt E...sion 4.3.pdf
You are correct in saying that is was from Pl.Phdr.246a, Arist.EN1111b22, Epicur. Ep.3p.60U., etc.; ὁ δὲ λιμός ἐστιν ἀθανασίας φάρμακον Antiph.86.6;.cf. Alexis 158 in contrast to σωμα
1Co 15:53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
G110 αθανασία immortality, deathlessness, indestructibility Pl.Phdr.246a, Arist.EN1111b22, Epicur. Ep.3p.60U., etc.; ὁ δὲ λιμός ἐστιν ἀθανασίας φάρμακον Antiph.86.6.
cf. Alexis 158 in contrast to σωμα
The error that I see from your idea of all wicked being raised is in the words, and shall remain in the tomb'!
You left out what the payment is, 'that they are to receive, which is to remain in the tomb/grave forever' because they have no good works to be judged by and have already been judged.
verse 31 Who shall declare his way to his face? and who shall repay him what he hath done?
32 'Yet shall he be brought to the grave, and shall remain in the tomb'
What follows is they will not be allowed to even see the face of God unless they had the good works and then rejected them by teaching other doctrines.
2Th 1:8-9
Not all of the dead are asleep because Christ never was aquainted with them, only those in Christ are asleep!
1Co 15:16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised: 17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins. 1Co 15:18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
Luk 13:24Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many will seek to enter in, I say unto you, and shall not be able.
25When once the master of the house is risen up, and has locked shut the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:
Mat 7:23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mat 7:26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 ..and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
What translation are you using? That translation gives a false impression that Satan is being referred to as a false doctrine. Here is what this verse actually says:I said there are no demons that they even exist are false teachings.
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to misleading spirits, and doctrines of a devil;
What translation are you using? That translation gives a false impression that Satan is being referred to as a false doctrine. Here is what this verse actually says:And the Spirit expressly speaketh, that in latter times shall certain fall away from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and teachings of demons, This verse says nothing about the Devil, but does confirm that demons and evil spirits exist. Nice job of disproving yourself!
How can demons have teachings if they don't exist? How can seducing spirits refer to some mundane entity?shall fall away from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and teachings of demons,
How can something so clearly presented in the Bible be a fable? You are effectively calling the Bible itself a fable here. Daimonion appears in the NT 60 times, daimōn appears 5 times, daimonizomai appears 13 times. That is 78 times total.Tit 1:14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.
Newton didn't believe in the Trinity either. Interesting the way you rely so much on a non-Christian in this matter. So Jesus and the disciples were all just dumb Jews who didn't know any better and THOUGHT there were devils. THAT is your interpretation?For Newton, therefore, demons were figures for disordered psychotic states. The cases of demon-possession in the Synoptic Gospels do not describe the activity of literal devils, but instead reflect the (mistaken) beliefs of first-century Jews.’
see the thread http://www.christianforums.com/t7604404/How can demons have teachings if they don't exist? How can seducing spirits refer to some mundane entity?
How can something so clearly presented in the Bible be a fable? So Jesus and the disciples were all just dumb Jews who didn't know any better and THOUGHT there were devils. THAT is your interpretation?
Nontrinitarianism, annihilationism, etc. are just forms of neo-Sadducceeism.
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Name calling doesn't work. First of all, This thread is "Let's talk about hell". Who said anything (in 6000 replies!) about the trinity or "nontrinitarianism"?Nontrinitarianism, annihilationism, etc. are just forms of neo-Sadducceeism.
<staff edit>
Name calling doesn't work. First of all, This thread is "Let's talk about hell". Who said anything (in 6000 replies!) about the trinity or "nontrinitarianism"?
If annihilationism (the belief that the wages of sin is death, as the bible states) is just a form of neo-Sadducceeism, is Eternal Tormentalism just a form of Neo-Phariseeism? Well, here is what God said to do about Phariseeism. "ignore them. They are blind guides leading the blind, and if one blind person guides another, they will both fall into a ditch." The Saducees say there is no resurrection. Annihilationism is the belief that all will be resurrected on the final day, the day of judgement, and some will go of to eternal life and others will go off to the eternal punishment of death, being dead forever. So we are not "Neo-Saducees". We are the complete opposite of them. You could call us "Neo-Apostolics" since we believe the same things the apostles taught.
As for the link, I've read every link on the web that supposedly refutes annihilationism, and their arguments are weak and illogical. Show me which link you are endorsing and I will show you the fallacies in their reasoning. Was the link from CARM?
I was using his faulty reasoning. Thank you for pointing out how illogical it is.name calling doesn't work, but ET advocates are pharisees? Nice.
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