dollarsbill
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This clearly doesn't say that God burns people alive forever. Why is THAT so hard to believe?
I stated that the Bible says He burns humans alive. Refute that.
Why do you keep referring to verses that have nothing to do with the subject? Nothing to refute.And you still haven't refuted John 8:21
What? Now you agree that the penalty for sin is death and not eternal torture? I was beginning to think that you would never accept the truth.This clearly doesn't say that God burns people alive forever. Why is THAT so hard to believe?
I stated that the Bible says He burns humans alive. Refute that.
Why do you keep referring to verses that have nothing to do with the subject? Nothing to refute.
Tim said:Here is the 7th proof of conditional immortality, that those who are without Christ will die in their sins and not be eternally tortured for their sins.
John 8:21
Then He said again to them, I go away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin; where I am going, you cannot come."Jesus said they would die in their sin, not be burned alive forever.
If they were to be tortured alive for their sins after they died, why didn't Jesus tell them about it? Why did he say they would die in their sins if it's true that they will never die in their sins but be kept alive in hell forever burning?
I Have several times. First - Spiritual death. Second - physical death. LAST - THE SECOND DEATH.What? Now you agree that the penalty for sin is death and not eternal torture? I was beginning to think that you would never accept the truth.
NONE meaning 'cease to exist'.
2Peter 3:7 "but now, by the same Word [that is Jesus], heaven and earth are saved and kept for fire on the day of judgment, and the destruction of impious men.The cause of the pain will be the fire mentioned several times in the NT. Why is it so hard to believe that God will burn humans forever when the Bible CLEARLY shows that He burns humans alive?
Matthew 13:40-42 (NASB)
40 "So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age. 41 "The Son of Man will send forth His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all stumbling blocks, and those who commit lawlessness, 42 and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Which English translation are you quoting?2Peter 3:7 "but now, by the same Word [that is Jesus], heaven and earth are saved and kept for fire on the day of judgment, and the destruction of impious men.
http://aggreen.net/beliefs/heaven_hell.html
Take your pick:Which English translation are you quoting?
I Have several times. First - Spiritual death. Second - physical death. LAST - THE SECOND DEATH.
NONE meaning 'cease to exist'.
Matt 10:28 "Fear him who is ABLE to destroy BOTH body AND SOUL in fiery hell"---
This is the "be no more" end of the wicked for God has also "Destroyed the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah reducing them to ashes".
He is ABLE to save unto the uttermost those that diligently seek him and He is ABLE to destroy both body and soul in fiery hell. According to Christ.
in Christ,
bob
What? Now you agree that the penalty for sin is death and not eternal torture? I was beginning to think that you would never accept the truth.
death doesn't mean annihilate or why would we need to destroy BOTH the body and the soul....if death meant the defeat of both simultaneously?
What do you mean? Of course the first death means to cease to exist until the resurrection on the last day, and the second death means to cease to exist without another resurrection to end it. Another way the bible expresses this is "eternal destruction."I Have several times. First - Spiritual death. Second - physical death. LAST - THE SECOND DEATH.
NONE meaning 'cease to exist'.
Matt 10:28 "Fear him who is ABLE to destroy BOTH body AND SOUL in fiery hell"---death doesn't mean annihilate or why would we need to destroy BOTH the body and the soul....if death meant the defeat of both simultaneously?
If destroying both body and soul in fiery gehenna doesn't mean annihilation, what does it mean? Non-destruction of both body and soul?
Does it say fear him who is able to destroy both body and soul by not destroying body and soul?
So the seventh proof, John 8:21 goes unrefuted. Okay. it is established that the result of sin is that people die in their sins. The result is not that people will be tortured by God in hell forever for their their sins.Why do you keep referring to verses that have nothing to do with the subject? Nothing to refute.
Matt 10:28 "Fear him who is ABLE to destroy BOTH body AND SOUL in fiery hell"---
If destroying both body and soul in fiery gehenna doesn't mean annihilation, what does it mean? Non-destruction of both body and soul?
Does it say fear him who is able to destroy both body and soul by not destroying body and soul?
I didn't think you would have an answer to that one. Oh and BTW destruction means death not annihilate. Look it up.
Huh?gradyll said:I didn't think you would have an answer to that one. Oh and BTW destruction means death not annihilate. Look it up.
Annihilate:gradyll said:Oh and BTW destruction means death not annihilate. Look it up.
Annihilate:
1. a. To destroy completely: The naval force was annihilated during the attack.
b. To reduce to nonexistence.
c. To defeat decisively; vanquish.
2. To nullify or render void; abolish.
Oops! Destroy is part of the definition for annihilate. Once again you are wrong.
And if a person is demolished? you don't think they are destroyed, killed, annihilated and demolished?yeah, it means to completely destroy. But if there are levels of destruction and you just pointed out that there is.....what level of destruction are we to input into the scriptures?
this destruction simply means demolition:
destruction [dɪˈstrʌkʃən]
n
1. the act of destroying or state of being destroyed; demolition
2. a cause of ruin or means of destroying
[from Latin dēstructiō a pulling down; see destroy]
κατάρριψη, κατεδάφιση demolition destruction, ruin ▶ nounyeah, it means to completely destroy. But if there are levels of destruction and you just pointed out that there is.....what level of destruction are we to input into the scriptures?
this destruction simply means demolition:destruction [dɪˈstrʌkʃən]
n 1. the act of destroying or state of being destroyed; demolition
2. a cause of ruin or means of destroying [from Latin dēstructiō a pulling down; see destroy]
καταστροφή destruction ■ noun the action or process of destroying something. ▶a cause of someone's ruin.ME: from L. destructio(n-), from destruere (see destroy).
© Oxford University Press, 2004
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Mat 3:12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the depository; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.to cause to ruin hmmm doensn't sound like annihilation to me sorry.
καταστροφή destruction ■ noun the action or process of destroying something. ▶a cause of someone's ruin.ME: from L. destructio(n-), from destruere (see destroy).
© Oxford University Press, 2004
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