Leading to God?

[StogusMaximus]

Is it man's quest to seek out God, or is it the Holy Spirit that guides man to seek out God?

I question this because, I believe that we must witness to people and spread the Good News to the world, but do my words or actions do any good?

If I share the gospel with somebody and they find Christ, is it my discussion that lead them to Christ, or is it the Holy Spirit that "grabbed" them and pulled them in? If it is the Holy Spirit that leads people to find God, then what is the point of the Great Commission? If it is our job to lead people to find God, what if we mess up, are we responsible for that person staying lost?

 

[Blackhawk]

Stogus,

I believe that it is always the H.S. who does the actual job of saving and the H.S. who convicts and pulls at the hearts of men. I do nto think the H.S. grabs them and jerks them into heaven but it is not me who does it. I feel that God uses me as an instrument to convict others and to witness to others. Like He might say go and witness to your boss. When i obey him and do it God is using me as arms and legs to speak to that person. God does not have to use me but I have the privelege of being in partnership with God. But if one rejects the offer of salvatin he is not rejecting me. He is rejecting God. So i think the great commission is not saying that God needs us to go out and witness for if we do not the very "rocks will cry out." But we get a gift from God that we can witness to others and see God working in them. It is a special blessing to be used by God. it is exciting and awesome but I do not I bring into the situation anything that is necessary for God to speak to anyone.

BH6

 

[StogusMaximus]

The H.S convicts you to witness to your boss. In your act of witnessing, you say what you are guided to say. It is the H.S that leads you every step of the way. I agree with that 100%.

If you refuse to listen to the H.S. when you are told to witness to your boss, do you think the H.S will guide somebody else to do the job?

Once you have witnessed to your boss, is it the H.S. that makes your boss listen and accept, or is it his thinking or desire?

 

[Blackhawk]

"If you refuse to listen to the H.S. when you are told to witness to your boss, do you think the H.S will guide somebody else to do the job?"

Yes. If it is God's will it will happen. I do not think that my obedience is necessary for God to acomplish His will.

"Once you have witnessed to your boss, is it the H.S. that makes your boss listen and accept, or is it his thinking or desire?"

I think that the H.S. convicts and woos and even begs but the H.S. does not force one to be saved. He does not drag one into heaven.

let me explain more fully what I think occurs at salvation. Basically we are totally depraved. We can do no good. God gives us all grace so we can see Him and choose whether to accept or reject His call of salvation. I choose to accept it. It is not my accpetance that makes me saved. it is God's grace. It is like accepting a million $ check. I did nothing to deserve the check and did nothing to earn it or gain it. I only accepted the gift. I only said yes.

So i guess i am in the middle of your question. i think that God has to help us accept but I think that He gives us a free choice to accept Him or reject Him.

BH6

 

[Blackhawk]

Oh one more thing about total depravity. i believe that God only gives all enough grace to accept or reject salvation. if we reject it we can do no other thing that will be good. Also when I say that one can do no good until saved what I mean is that one can't please God until saved. An atheist can give to the poor which is good horizontally. (man to man) But can't do anything good vertically (man to God) until the man accepts salvation. God gives us grace enough to choose to do accept Him which through His help is good vertically but unless we do that we can do nothing good vertically.

BH6

 

[StogusMaximus]

Stay with me, I am going to make a right turn......

And pardon my use of metaphors, I tend to put things that I have difficulty explaining into metaphors.

Does the H.S dwell in all of us from the time we are conceived, or does the H.S only "move in" when we are saved?

If option 1, H.S. dwells in us from the beginning, how is it the H.S can tollerate an evil person? Would the H.S. abandon someone who has blasphemed the H.S?

If option 2, H.S. starts dwelling in us from salvation, how is it that we are moved to accept salvation? Does the H.S. "whisper in our ear" until we accept and let Him in?

 

[Blackhawk]

Stogus,

i think it is option 2 because God can't live in the heart of a person that is not justified. His heart is evil and completely wicked.

"If option 2, H.S. starts dwelling in us from salvation, how is it that we are moved to accept salvation? Does the H.S. "whisper in our ear" until we accept and let Him in?"

Well i think the best analogy is that God knocks on the door of our heart waiting to come in. He does not break the door down. He waits until we open it to come in. I think even Calvinsists would go with me on this one. R.C. Sproul (a leading Calvinist) says that God does not force Himself on us. He changes our desires so that we will choose Him. (or let Him come in)

I like to view it like this. God shows Himslef to all and offers all the gift of salvation. He convicts and shows us a way out of our sin. Some choose to reject Him and others choose to accept Him. He calls upon a person until the appointed time of death or maybe the 2nd coming. then it is too late. But none can say that they did not have a chance or that God is unfair.

BH6