Justification from Eternity

moonbeam · Sep 4, 2014

Hammster said:
Dictionary.com | Find the Meanings and Definitions of Words at Dictionary.com

There are multiple meanings and nuances given for the 22 entries for "separateness" at your link.

It would help if you would elaborate on which particular aspect of the various nuances of the dictionary entries given..you had in mind, regarding your assertion - "No. Temporal and eternal are separate."

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Hammster · Sep 4, 2014

It's funny that you don't know the difference, yet were quick to inform me that I am wrong. smh

moonbeam · Sep 4, 2014

Hammster said:
It's funny that you don't know the difference, yet were quick to inform me that I am wrong. smh

Hammster - You have insisted that the temporal and eternal are "separate"

So explain yourself.what do you mean ?

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JM · Sep 4, 2014

Hammster said:
It's funny that you don't know the difference, yet were quick to inform me that I am wrong. smh

Hammster · Sep 4, 2014

moonbeam said:
Hammster - You have insisted that the temporal and eternal are "separate"

So explain yourself.what do you mean ?

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I did. And you said I was wrong.

JM · Sep 4, 2014

Hammster said:
I did. And you said I was wrong.

I can't see what mooner posts unless you quote him because I have him blocked. I can see he is ignoring your replies, isnt that called "invincible ignorance," when a person fails to deal with any evidence posted in favour of their own position?

Lol

moonbeam · Sep 4, 2014

Hammster said:
I did. And you said I was wrong.

Then why are you insisting I was wrong when I said you where wrong ?

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Hammster · Sep 4, 2014

moonbeam said:
Then why are you insisting I was wrong when I said you where wrong ?

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Because it now appears that you don't know what temporal and eternal mean. That means that you just assumed I was wrong because I disagree with you.

moonbeam · Sep 4, 2014

Hammster said:
Because it now appears that you don't know what temporal and eternal mean. That means that you just assumed I was wrong because I disagree with you.

I assume everyone who disagrees with me is wrong.

When they disagree with you do you assume they are right ?

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moonbeam · Sep 4, 2014

JM said:
...ignoring your replies, isnt that called "invincible ignorance,"...

Your analysis above is insightful…..and accurately summarizes your use of the cloaking device.

PS - still [patiently] waiting for your reply to post #140

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moonbeam · Sep 13, 2014

JM said:
Actually, it proves it. It comforts the Saints to know that we have God the Holy Spirit in us and therefore suffer no condemnation. Why? Because of God's grace in election.

JM ... Your attempt to alienate “justification” from the intent and context of Rom 8:1 fails.

Why ? ......because of your comment (bolded ) above.

Justification flows from Election...the scope and precision of the scripture at this point does not allow for justification to be excluded from the intent of the original author.

I understand that accepting what I assert (above) concerning Rom 8:1 would leave you in a vulnerable position in regards defending your false doctrine of justification in, and from, eternity...it would, in effect, destroy it.

Justification is fully intended in the legitimate scope of this scripture.

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.…[Rom 8:1]

Walking in the Spirit does not equal justification.

JM - Walking in the Spirit.......is to be Justified.

To be Justified.......is to Walk in the Spirit.

The two descriptors used in Rom 8:1 are precise enough that the proposition is a stand alone statement, a theological fact, and all encompassing in the range of its meaning...and it is logically applicable to justification.

This fact erodes the foundation of your false doctrine...as it forms the logical link to Rom 8:9 ...... and at that point, your ship flounders.

But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.…[Rom 8:9]

Just as the Lamb Jesus Christ was seen as "slain from the foundation of the world" we are seen in Christ from the foundation of the world.

As the Elect children of God.....chosen in Christ.......to BE

Your false doctrine does not allow....the BEING [immanence] of God.

It’s all has-been in your false doctrine.

JM - You are invited to make a reply, to the brethren, concerning these matters...your brother in Christ….BP

PS - This fundamental anomaly in the false doctrine you actively promote has yet to be addressed by yourself, or any of your supporting proponents [i.e. twin1954 etc]

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JM · Sep 13, 2014

Hammster said:
It's funny that you don't know the difference, yet were quick to inform me that I am wrong. smh

That seems to be his issue.

JM · Sep 13, 2014

"The immensity and infinity of God are strong proofs of his unity. God is infinite in his being and perfections: "His understanding is infinite," (Psalm 147:5) and so are his power, his goodness, his justice and his holiness, etc. As his eternity is that perfection by which he is not bounded by time, so his immensity, or infinity, is that perfection by which he is not bounded, or circumscribed by space. He that is God is every where; theres no fleeing from his presence; he fills heaven and earth with it; and by filling them, is not contained in them: "The heaven, and the heaven of heavens cannot contain" (1 Kings 8:27) him." - John Gill

moonbeam · Nov 11, 2014

JM said:
Makes sense to me. see also John's Gill and Brine.

Brine - "Justification is an immanent, and consequently an eternal act. This argument must be allowed conclusive, unless it can be proved that Justification is a transient act."

ALL...of the decrees of the Eternal God are, necessarily, immanent, and consequently eternal acts....What else could they be ?

The attempt to differentiate, between like and like, in regards the decrees of God...some effecting temporal matters while others are applicable to the eternal sphere...does not affect their [the decrees] essential nature.

ALL...decrees are inclusive, of the complete thought [singular], as a cohesive whole [alpha omega] which the Father spoke into existence by the Word.

The legitimacy of the temporal sphere, as a logical necessity, in effecting the relational dynamic between Creator and creature was attested to, and validated, by the incarnation of the Second Person of the Trinity.

This immanent eternal act of God...God in the flesh [at the appointed time]...Validates the temporal sphere in regards their [the decrees] logical, sequential, revealing, of Jesus Christ.

Hence...Justification occurs in the Temporal sphere.

Because...The Temporal sphere is the only place there can be relational contact between the Redeemer and the redeemed.

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JM · Nov 12, 2014

stenerson said:
I've heard some proponents of the doctrine, such as Fortner.. I've mulled it over and can understand how justification would be inferred from certain statements in scripture. I'm not confident though go further than what scripture clearly says on the matter.

I believe the doctrine is true but feel the Reformed confessions are a good way to bring us together on the doctrine of justificaiton.

moonbeam · Nov 12, 2014

JM said:
I believe the doctrine is true

Than you believe a lie.don't you ?

but feel the Reformed confessions are a good way to bring us together on the doctrine of justificaiton.

The authoritative Reformed confessions are worded specifically, and purposefully, to deny the lie you believe.aren't they ?

Publish an authoritative Reformed confession that is congruent with your false claim above.

And attempt a reply to my response to BrineI don't suppose Brine will be able to reply any time soonbut you are totally immersed and in agreement with their error, so should be able to articulate their defence for themshouldn't you ?

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JM · Nov 13, 2014

Justification From Eternity * by Jim Casey on Vimeo

moonbeam · Jan 27, 2015

JM said:
Justification From Eternity * by Jim Casey on Vimeo

JM my apologies for the delay in responding

in the video you have posted at 1:17 the comment is made regarding the righteousness of Christ worked out at the cross i.e. "...it becomes ours, and is ours..."

In particular I would like to focus on this portion of that comment "...it becomes ours"

Where does it become ours ?

In my previous post #194 I said."This immanent eternal act of God...God in the flesh [at the appointed time]...Validates the temporal sphere in regards their [the decrees] logical, sequential, revealing, of Jesus Christ.

Hence...Justification occurs in the Temporal sphere.

Because...The Temporal sphere is the only place there can be relational contact between the Redeemer and the redeemed."

The point being that the Father found it a logical necessity to actualize the second person of the Godhead in the temporal sphere to work out this righteousness at the cross.

Question - Why was that a logical necessity ?

JM · Sep 16, 2019

Sovereign Grace · Sep 21, 2019

twin1954 said:
We aren't justified in time when we believe we have that justification made known to us when we believe. Faith does not justify us the work of Christ does. Justification isn't applied to us when we beleive we beleive because we have been justified. Not only has God not seen us as sinners He has never dealt with us as sinners. We were by nature children of wrath even as others but we were never children of wrath.

This is a flat out denial of sola fide.

Romans 5:1
Colossians 3:8
Romans 3:28ff
Galatians 2:16

Just to name a few. Now, I agree that faith is a gift of God that He bestows solely to His elect ppl. But up until the gift is given, they are not justified, but under condemnation.

Justification from Eternity

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