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Just to clarify, "God" is not God, it is Wisdom

Gottservant

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Hi there,

So look, I am not sure if this will affect your arguments in any way and I certainly am not welcoming people who just want to negate God, for the sake of it, but I wanted to point out that "God" is not God, but Wisdom. What do I mean by this? I mean that saying "God is God" is not something God says, true enough He called Himself "I am that I am" for the sake of the Jewish people, but if you understand what I am saying, that was His way of saying "this exodus is wise". Why? Because "God" is just a title, a placeholder.

The thing is that God is no respecter of persons (NT), so when you come to the conclusion that you know who or what God is because of the title "God" you are not actually in a dialogue with God at all, you are discussing Wisdom, as in, you are discussing, is it "wise" to give a name to a supreme deity, who may or may not even be interested in the title. That really is my point, God is not necessarily interested in the title "God" at all, that is man's thinking. Man thinks "Aha, I have this name for God, now if I can just find Him, He will have to own up to it", as if you can "catch" God sinning or something like that. But that's not how it works.

"God" is a key, a door-opener, a switch starter, for thoughts about what God could possibly be like, what He could possibly be capable of. It is meant to stir thoughts, emotions, into action, around possibility and the meaning of existence, questions which you would ask God, if He did indeed answer. And that's the thing, you don't even really know if He will answer, if indeed any time you are talking to Him its not just some sort of cosmic feedback of the law of the conservation of energy, but at the same time its self-fulfilling, drawing you to believe more, both because you've believed already and because you don't know if believing a little more will eventuate into something fantastic.

It's a journey...

...but not one that hinges on "God".:liturgy:
 

Gottservant

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God is love, love is not god

God is wisdom, but wisdom is not god.

Common misunderstanding.

Did you study theology at Netflix?

There is more depth to this that you are giving credit for.

If you have been on this forum at all you will know that people argue about God as if "God" is God all the time.

Netflix has very little to do with it.
 
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Gottservant

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Is that like saying, "For all practical purposes, god functions as wisdom in a person?"

Such as, "the fear of the lord is the beginning of wisdom"?

Yes.

But I wonder if you see the connections you are describing.

Besides that the issue is more the logos of the logos, or the godness of God, as in a discussion of whether it is possible to utilize the Wisdom of denoting "God" is God, to prove that God is.

I would argue that while aligned in a similar context, the two things - "God" as God, and God being - are fundamentally two different things (and do not function relative to one another, because God is absolute)
 
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sarxweh

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Yes.

But I wonder if you see the connections you are describing.

Besides that the issue is more the logos of the logos, or the godness of God, as in a discussion of whether it is possible to utilize the Wisdom of denoting "God" is God, to prove that God is.

I would argue that while aligned in a similar context, the two things - "God" as God, and God being - are fundamentally two different things (and do not function relative to one another, because God is absolute)

Is that a sort of god as subjective and god as objective distinction?

There is God, himself.

Then there is God, "in man"

Something like that?

I personally see God, while he personally sees me and though he knows me more than I know him, my knowledge of him is my own, and his knowledge of me is his own. Making me just as objective as he, and just as subjective as he.

But the wisdom part takes it up a notch, because that's the way he effects me subjectively.

And as in the case of a prophets prayer, our words can sometimes effect his actions. Thus man also would function as "wisdom" in Gods subjective being...

Hmmm
 
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sarxweh

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Did I say something foolish?

I am uneducated! I took a year and a half of "core" and got married pretty young, so what I say is only my best attempt at logic, but it probably sounds like loaded defiance :) Go figure

I heard a teacher say the greatest philosophers all spoke in such a way that their words required much interpretation - implying that the students who disagreed about the meaning of their statements were the only reason they were well-known!

Let's hope not. But probably
 
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Gottservant

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no no, you provoked me to think

if you know when you are being objective about God and when subjective, then indeed you may have all the wisdom God requires of you, that is not impossible

I have just never met someone that confident before, I am not sure what to say
 
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Gottservant

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that is the point

if people think through what I am saying, usually they have creative thoughts

I thought your thoughts were creative

I guess the difficulty then is assessing whether being wisdom for God makes you free enough, to enjoy life to your fullest potential
 
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Aldebaran

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that is the point

if people think through what I am saying, usually they have creative thoughts

I thought your thoughts were creative

I guess the difficulty then is assessing whether being wisdom for God makes you free enough, to enjoy life to your fullest potential

Isn't God separate from wisdom, but the possessor of wisdom, and not simply wisdom itself? We must ask God for wisdom, which would mean that God is the supplier of it rather than wisdom itself. Am I wrong?
 
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Gottservant

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Isn't God separate from wisdom, but the possessor of wisdom, and not simply wisdom itself? We must ask God for wisdom, which would mean that God is the supplier of it rather than wisdom itself. Am I wrong?

God creates Wisdom, but God is not "God" before He does.

I am not saying God is not able to be "God", I am saying before God has Wisdom, He does not attempt to be "God".
 
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PsychoSarah

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Isn't God separate from wisdom, but the possessor of wisdom, and not simply wisdom itself? We must ask God for wisdom, which would mean that God is the supplier of it rather than wisdom itself. Am I wrong?

Depends on your concept of deities
 
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