just a simple question

[hithesh]

If you know a route to perfect or to a better state of holiness (in this world), and you don't follow it, is that a sin? is anything wrong with not following this path?

To put it another way, if you knew a way to receive more blessing from God in this world, and in the next, and you choose not to follow it, should God be disappointed in you? Is there anything wrong with not taking a path to extended blessing from God?

(and please try not to respond using a list of biblical verses, if you plan on using verses, please just interpret them in your own way, to further your case, so that those that eye this thread can easily follow the flow of ideas, instead of trying to interpret your usage of verses in each instance.)

 

[goldenviolet]

may i ask a question?

why wouldn't you want to recieve the relationship and blessings God has for you with walking closer to Him?

 

[looksgood]

If you know a route to perfect or to a better state of holiness (in this world), and you don't follow it, is that a sin? is anything wrong with not following this path?

To put it another way, if you knew a way to receive more blessing from God in this world, and in the next, and you choose not to follow it, should God be disappointed in you? Is there anything wrong with not taking a path to extended blessing from God?

(and please try not to respond using a list of biblical verses, if you plan on using verses, please just interpret them in your own way, to further your case, so that those that eye this thread can easily follow the flow of ideas, instead of trying to interpret your usage of verses in each instance.)

The main question here seems to me to be "should I follow the road God wants me on or not and if I don't is it a sin?" Jesus said if you want to be His you must pick up your cross and follow Him. Else you will not be His.

Yes, not following God means you are following yourself and the devil. This is sin.

 

[hithesh]

may i ask a question?

why wouldn't you want to recieve the relationship and blessings God has for you with walking closer to Him?

I hate to make this seem like a game, but in all honesty this is not just a personal question to myself, but one that is reflected to each individual who reads this post. And I will explain in due time where I want to go with this (preferably when there are more responses at hand), but I promise my purpose is only for Christians to deeply think of our role as Christians. So again, is it okay for 'you', to deny extended blessings?

 

[hithesh]

The main question here seems to me to be "should I follow the road God wants me on or not and if I don't is it a sin?" Jesus said if you want to be His you must pick up your cross and follow Him. Else you will not be His.

Yes, not following God means you are following yourself and the devil. This is sin.

I'm not painting a picture of a man who chooses sin over god, but a man who chooses less of a reward in heaven than the greater.

It's fairly apparent that some individuals will be blessed more than others in heaven, because there is constant references in the Good Book, to greater rewards, and I assume if there are greater rewards there are also less.

So if you assume that you are on a path to some small quantity of rewards, and you choose to be content with that, instead of following a path that you are perfectly aware of that will lead you to greater riches in Heaven, and on earth from God, is it okay to choose not to? Is it okay to choose the lesser of two goods?

 

[looksgood]

I'm not painting a picture of a man who chooses sin over god, but a man who chooses less of a reward in heaven than the greater.

It's fairly apparent that some individuals will be blessed more than others in heaven, because there is constant references in the Good Book, to greater rewards, and I assume if there are greater rewards there are also less.

So if you assume that you are on a path to some small quantity of rewards, and you choose to be content with that, instead of following a path that you are perfectly aware of that will lead you to greater riches in Heaven, and on earth from God, is it okay to choose not to? Is it okay to choose the lesser of two goods?

Hmmm...I really am not sure if I follow. My question is, like has been asked before why would you not want to take the better road?

I could only find the reason in being that you would have to give up more of yourself if you took the road to more blessing.

If such is the case then you have things you have not submitted to God and those things show a lack of faith. Anything that lacks faith is sin.

If I am correct then I think I know where you are going. I will let this thread play out and just watch to see exactly what is on your mind.

 

[hithesh]

I could only find the reason in being that you would have to give up more of yourself if you took the road to more blessing.

If such is the case then you have things you have not submitted to God and those things show a lack of faith. Anything that lacks faith is sin.

and yes, you're right, I would rather not sacrifice all of myself for the road to more blessing, and I know of no one personally that will.

and yes I'm still waiting, for input, before I tell what plagues me, and possibly all who love God.

 

[hithesh]

A certain man approached him and asked, teacher, "What must I do to enter the Kingdom of God"

and Jesus answered and said, "You know the commandments, don't steal, don't kill, don't lie, don't cheat on your wife. Show love and respect towards your parents."

and the certain man answered and said, " I have lived and followed these rules, since I was a young boy"

and when Jesus heard this, he said to him, " if you seek perfect holiness, surrender your wealth, all of it, and give to the poor so they may not starve, and I will bless you greatly in heaven. Then come, and follow me.

and the certain man upon hearing this became very sad because he was a wealthy man, and Jesus looked at him and said, " It's very hard for the rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. Indeed, it is much easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle."

and the certain man walked away distraught by what he had just heard, and those that remained around Christ were perplexed and asked, "Teacher, then who can be saved?"

Jesus replied, "What is impossible for some, is possible with God"


(but little did they know, that the certain man was sitting, in a depressed state, by a tree, away from the view of the crowd, and upon hearings these last words from Christ, he rejoiced, thinking to himself, "I can continue the wealthy life that I'm living, but of course I'll give some coins to the poor, for good gesture. Shew!, so I don't really have to renounce everything I own, and I will still be able to indulge in the great fortunes of heaven " And in these thoughts the certain man finally walked away, delighted, believing he would taste the Kingdom)

continuing....

and Peter said to Christ, "we have left all we had, to follow you!"

"Peter, I speak to you all with earnest honesty. A man who has chosen to leave his all, for the sake of my Kingdom, will receive so much more than he has lost, in this age, and in the age to come, eternal life."

 

[guitarlover]

All throughout the new testament we see where Christ and Paul, inspired by God, tells us that we should give everything for the sake of knowing God more. The reason for sanctification is so that we can become more intimately aware of who God is and how he works for the good of all who love him. and sanctification is basically the ongoing process of God reshaping you into a person of holiness, selfless, and with a mind focused only on God.
So it doesn't really seem like it is a question of sacrificing for God's blessings so much as it is a question of sacrificing to know God the way that he wants you to know him. The blessings of God come throughout the journey of knowing him more intimately.

 

[looksgood]

A certain man approached him and asked, teacher, "What must I do to enter the Kingdom of God"

and Jesus answered and said, "You know the commandments, don't steal, don't kill, don't lie, don't cheat on your wife. Show love and respect towards your parents."

and the certain man answered and said, " I have lived and followed these rules, since I was a young boy"

and when Jesus heard this, he said to him, " if you seek perfect holiness, surrender your wealth, all of it, and give to the poor so they may not starve, and I will bless you greatly in heaven. Then come, and follow me.

and the certain man upon hearing this became very sad because he was a wealthy man, and Jesus looked at him and said, " It's very hard for the rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. Indeed, it is much easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle."

and the certain man walked away distraught by what he had just heard, and those that remained around Christ were perplexed and asked, "Teacher, then who can be saved?"

Jesus replied, "What is impossible for some, is possible with God"


(but little did they know, that the certain man was sitting, in a depressed state, by a tree, away from the view of the crowd, and upon hearings these last words from Christ, he rejoiced, thinking to himself, "I can continue the wealthy life that I'm living, but of course I'll give some coins to the poor, for good gesture. Shew!, so I don't really have to renounce everything I own, and I will still be able to indulge in the great fortunes of heaven " And in these thoughts the certain man finally walked away, delighted, believing he would taste the Kingdom)

continuing....

and Peter said to Christ, "we have left all we had, to follow you!"

"Peter, I speak to you all with earnest honesty. A man who has chosen to leave his all, for the sake of my Kingdom, will receive so much more than he has lost, in this age, and in the age to come, eternal life."

Hmmm... well, I think I may again be missunderstanding you.

Aside from the quotes being off from what is in the bible I wonder at this teaching. I am not sure what you are saying so if I am taking this wrong forgive me.

If I see what you are saying here it is that Jesus was saying you don't have to give up all for His sakes, but it is better if you do?

If so this is my responce:
Matthew 10:37-39
He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who finds his life will lose it, and he who loses his life for My sake will find it.

Jesus was telling this man to follow him. But this man felt the cost was too great because he loved his wealth more than God. He wanted his life more than God.

Thus Jesus said it was hard for the rich to enter, not impossable as He said in that what is impossable for men was possable for God. Because NONE can save himself!

When Jesus speaks of leaving the things of your life He speaks of following Him before the things of this world.

To think you can love the world so much that you would refuse to give it up for God and still be accepted by God is contrary to scripture. God seeks those who love Him MORE than any other. If something is of more value to you then God, it becomes your god. There is no two roads, only one and if you chose not to follow because the path cost too much then you will separate to the broad road that seems right but the end is death.

So the question becomes this: Do you love God enough to give up everything for Him? He may not be asking for you to get rid of your money, but He is asking you not to let it be your God.

He knows the things of this world have value to you, He tested the value of God with this man knowing his heart.

 

[looksgood]

Hmmm... well, I think I may again be missunderstanding you.

Aside from the quotes being off from what is in the bible I wonder at this teaching. I am not sure what you are saying so if I am taking this wrong forgive me.

If I see what you are saying here it is that Jesus was saying you don't have to give up all for His sakes, but it is better if you do?

If so this is my responce:
Matthew 10:37-39
He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who finds his life will lose it, and he who loses his life for My sake will find it.

Jesus was telling this man to follow him. But this man felt the cost was too great because he loved his wealth more than God. He wanted his life more than God.

Thus Jesus said it was hard for the rich to enter, not impossable as He said in that what is impossable for men was possable for God. Because NONE can save himself!

When Jesus speaks of leaving the things of your life He speaks of following Him before the things of this world.

To think you can love the world so much that you would refuse to give it up for God and still be accepted by God is contrary to scripture. God seeks those who love Him MORE than any other. If something is of more value to you then God, it becomes your god. There is no two roads, only one and if you chose not to follow because the path cost too much then you will separate to the broad road that seems right but the end is death.

So the question becomes this: Do you love God enough to give up everything for Him? He may not be asking for you to get rid of your money, but He is asking you not to let it be your God.

He knows the things of this world have value to you, He tested the value of God with this man knowing his heart.

Here is a couple things I think you may find interesting. These messages deal with this very subject in depth.

Traped In the Cares of Life
A Heart to Follow

 

[hithesh]

Here is a couple things I think you may find interesting. These messages deal with this very subject in depth.

Traped In the Cares of Life
A Heart to Follow

I have closed this thread off, and my complete ideas are in the thread: "Remix: Parable of the certain wealthy man", and all things that seemed confusing at first, are now explained (miracles, greater rewards in heaven, renouncing wealth).

 

[guitarlover]

i agree. Jesus isn't saying that people should sell their house, their car and all but one set of clothes when they become a christian. What Jesus is telling us is that we need to be ready and willing to give up everything for the sake of Christ if that is was God has planned for us. again, putting God first and then everything else.

 

[JPPT1974]

i agree. Jesus isn't saying that people should sell their house, their car and all but one set of clothes when they become a christian. What Jesus is telling us is that we need to be ready and willing to give up everything for the sake of Christ if that is was God has planned for us. again, putting God first and then everything else.

We aren't of this world
As well as Jesus wasn't
We aren't supposed to conform to the world
But conform to the heavens and to Jesus!

 

[kisstheson]

If you know a route to perfect or to a better state of holiness (in this world), and you don't follow it, is that a sin? is anything wrong with not following this path?

To put it another way, if you knew a way to receive more blessing from God in this world, and in the next, and you choose not to follow it, should God be disappointed in you? Is there anything wrong with not taking a path to extended blessing from God?

(and please try not to respond using a list of biblical verses, if you plan on using verses, please just interpret them in your own way, to further your case, so that those that eye this thread can easily follow the flow of ideas, instead of trying to interpret your usage of verses in each instance.)

We shouldn't follow Jesus because we will be rewarded in this life or in Heaven. He is generous and will reward us 'cause that's how He is. But if Jesus came to us, simple, unadorned ~ Just "simply Jesus" would we still follow Him? After all He really doesn't owe us another thing. He gave His life for us.

By grace I would hope to still follow Him. Yes!

 

[The Virginian]

If you know a route to perfect or to a better state of holiness (in this world), and you don't follow it, is that a sin? is anything wrong with not following this path?

To put it another way, if you knew a way to receive more blessing from God in this world, and in the next, and you choose not to follow it, should God be disappointed in you? Is there anything wrong with not taking a path to extended blessing from God?

(and please try not to respond using a list of biblical verses, if you plan on using verses, please just interpret them in your own way, to further your case, so that those that eye this thread can easily follow the flow of ideas, instead of trying to interpret your usage of verses in each instance.)

The whole point of redemption, is that mankind might once again enjoy the type of communion with God that Adam enjoyed prior to the Fall. That is the entire motivation of the monastic life; that is theosis, partaking in the nature of God.(2nd Peter 1)

The point of sin is this: Whenever, and however God tells me something, and I do not follow through in obedience, that is sin! Having knowledge of a particular ascetic mode of life, without participation in that lifestyle, is not sin. Satan may want to make you think that it's sin, so as to get you drowning in self-condemnation.

Attempting to deepen our communion with the Almighty in any way, and failing to reach the goal because the application of practical methods was beyond our ability, is in a word DANGEROUS! It can lead to dejection, and disobedience whenever God comes to you for you to move in the direction you just failed in. That was the long answer.

God wants to bless us, and He mainly wants to do so by having us share in His nature. Many of us know of the monastic lifestyle, and do not follow it. Is God disappointed in those who remain in the secular world, with knowledge of the rigors -and blessings- of the monastic ascesis? I do not know that God would be disappointed, but He might be sad, as in when the Savior wept over Jerusalem!

 

[JPPT1974]

Jesus atoned for our sins
On that lonely cross of Calvary
So that we wouldn't have to
Do it ourselves!