Joel Osteen false teacher??

[WileyCoyote]

In proper context remember all protestants are heretics according to Rome...
that being said my 16 year old and I listened to a sermon and listed out 6 times where his preaching clearly contradicted scriptural teaching...I choose to keep my distance his knowledge of scripture is considerably less than my 16 year old and he only speaks to things itchy ears desire to hear...

I don't care if Protestants are considered to be bug eyed aliens according to Rome. That wasn't an answer to my question.

What constitutes a heretic? Is it someone who teaches false things? It depends. ALL preachers teach false things to one degree or another because no one preacher has ALL knowledge. We know in part and prophesy in part. Any denomination claiming to have full knowledge calls God a liar. I do believe there is a difference between teaching a false doctrine and a damnable heresy. A damnable heresy is a teaching that will damn the soul if believed. Such teachings include denying the deity of Jesus, denying the virgin birth, denying the resurrection, denying the blood of Jesus, teaching that we can be justified by observing the law, etc etc. Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses and the like teach things that will damn the soul if believed. But simply teaching something false that doesn't fall under the umbrella of a damnable heresy, doesn't make one a 'false teacher'. Like I said, if that were true, ALL preachers would be false teachers. In all of Joel's sermons I have listened to, I have not found ONE teaching which would be considered a damnable heresy. Is he a perfect teacher? No way. Who is? Many people arrogantly like to point out little things in Joel's theology while ignoring the fact that many of the teachers they hold in high regard teach false things. It's the theological 'pot calling the kettle black'. Nobody is going to know all truth this side of heaven. So yes, people will continue to teach false things, but they will still go to heaven because they uphold the 'fundamentals'. Joel has never denied the Trinity, the blood of Jesus, the resurrection or anything that has to be believed in order to gain access into heaven. Not only does he believe it, he teaches it. I think the term 'heretic' is overused by people who want to put an easy label on those they disagree with theologically. After all, everybody has to believe like they do, right? My last point I'm going to make in this post is words like 'heresy' and 'blasphemy' were used more by the Pharisees in scriptures than they were used by Jesus. So when you see people overusing this term 'heretic', it makes them look like Pharisees.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Joel can not be a heretic. One must be pronounced a heretic by a council of The Church to be called a heretic.

He may follow or preach heresy. But he himself cannot "per say" be a heretic.

The study of heresy and heresies is fascinating.

Most heresies have been named after the person who was teaching that heresy.

Example... Arianism was taught by Arius.

Ar⋅i⋅an⋅ism

–noun Theology.

the doctrine, taught by Arius, that Christ the Son was not consubstantial with God the Father.


Forgive me...

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

The best way to study heresies is to get a list and learn each one, and why it is incorrect.

Forgive me...

 

[MamaZ]

If the way you take getting to heaven only trhough jesus is teh way I think you think.

Please explain what you think this means then.


Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,( so they could not know or accept Jesus ) do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

As I said Through Christ.

 

[Carey]

As I said Through Christ.

So these people who never knew Christ in this life will still go to heaven??

Maybe they were atheist matbe they worshipped their amazon jungle God??


Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,( so they could not know or accept Jesus ) do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

No matter how a person finds the father, it will have been through the son. For everything was created by him. NO matter exists that he did not create.

Forgive me...

 

[Carey]

No matter how a person finds the father, it will have been through the son. For everything was created by him. NO matter exists that he did not create.

Forgive me...

so if a jungle person has never seen a bible and only heard from a person who was a missionary or something about jesys did not believe does this apply


Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,( so they could not know or accept Jesus ) do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

so if a jungle person has never seen a bible and only heard from a person who was a missionary or something about jesys did not believe does this apply


Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,( so they could not know or accept Jesus ) do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

We are judged by our heart. Mine can be quite hard, I don't think I stand much of a chance. If he accepts me, it will be testament to his mercy.

Forgive me...

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

The problem is: The idea of "faith alone" can not allow for this to be true. Faith would require knowledge.

Forgive me...

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,( so they could not know or accept Jesus ) do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

BTW ~ Where do you suppose the "requirements of the law are written on their hearts" came from... if not Christ God, creator of all things?

Forgive me...

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Joel may be a nice guy, but that's not enough for leadership.

A leader must have knowledge.

Joel couldn't answer the question. Because he does not understand the answer to the question of salvation. Christ God is the creator, anyone who is recieved of the father must come through him. However that does not require that a person have knowledge of Christ to have made the journey and be judged by the content and shape of his heart.

Being unknowledgeable does not make him a heretic.

Forgive me...

 

[Carey]

Romans 2 : 14(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,( so they could not know or accept Jesus ) do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

BTW ~ Where do you suppose the "requirements of the law are written on their hearts" came from... if not Christ God, creator of all things?

Forgive me...

What would i need to forgive you for??

I believe they came from Yahweh Abba Father not Yeshua son and our savior.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

"Forgive me" is a constant among Orthodox Christians. I will always ask your forgiveness.

Jhn 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Forgive me...

 

[Carey]

"Forgive me" is a constant among Orthodox Christians. I will always ask your forgiveness.

Jhn 1:1-3 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Forgive me...

So Hohn 1 says Yahweh made the word and it was with him.

So I assume you are assuming Yeshua was the wor dwho God made and was with him as our spirm is with us when we make a child as a man??

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

That would be equating time with eternity.

There was never a time when Christ was not.

The Son is begotten of The Father.

To say that the Father made the word (The Son) would mean that Christ is a creature and not part of the Godhead. That is heresy. Specifically Arianism.

The Holy Spirit proceedes from The Father.

There is no "time" involved.

Forgive me...

 

[David75]

I can not judge or there for I would be judged myself. I've only watched him a couple of times. He does have pleasant voice.

 

[Carey]

That would be equating time with eternity.

There was never a time when Christ was not.

The Son is begotten of The Father.

To say that the Father made the word (The Son) would mean that Christ is a creature and not part of the Godhead. That is heresy. Specifically Arianism.

The Holy Spirit proceedes from The Father.

There is no "time" involved.

Forgive me...

So if my son spirm is born he is part of me??

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Our relations are not the same as the Godhead.

Christ The Son is equal and coeternal with the Father and The Holy Spirit. The trinity in one essense.

That is Christianity.

Forgive me...

 

[Seeking Him]

Whenever I listen to Joel Osteen, I come away feeling like there is a list of things I have to do. To me that is not the Gospel. His focus is not on Christ and the finished work of the cross, but on the Christian's ability to live the Christian life. God is our strength and his grace enables us to walk in the spirit. Joel gives you a manual for behaviorism.

 

[OrthodoxyUSA]

Whenever I listen to Joel Osteen, I come away feeling like there is a list of things I have to do. To me that is not the Gospel. His focus is not on Christ and the finished work of the cross, but on the Christian's ability to live the Christian life. God is our strength and his grace enables us to walk in the spirit. Joel gives you a manual for behaviorism.

I agree, he's a distraction.

You know ANTI in the greek does not mean against. It means "other than".

Therefore an Anti-Christ would be someone who preaches "another" gospel.

Forgive me...