BrotherJJ

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KJ Bible Dictionary Definition: VI'SION, n. s as z. L. visio, from video, visus.
4. In Scripture, a revelation from God; an appearance or exhibition of something supernaturally presented to the minds of the prophets, by which they were informed of future events. Such were the visions of Isaiah, of Amos, of Ezekiel, etc.
Source link: VISION - Definition from the KJV Dictionary

(MY NOTE: A vision is a revelation from God, something supernaturally presented to the mind, which inform of future events.)

Matt 17:
1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,
(MY NOTE: 3 FUTURE main characters)

2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
(MY NOTE: Jesus face shines bright & he's covered in Shekinah glory)

3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.
(MY NOTE: The great/loved/respected law & prophet representees are present)

4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
(MY NOTE: Peter wants to make 3 shrines, 1 for each)

5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him.
(MY NOTE Before Peter gets the statement out. A voice makes it clear to all, listen to my Son, He's NO #1)

9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.
Bible source link: Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 17 - King James Version

(MY NOTE: Jesus say's; Tell the VISION to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead)

The Order of Resurrection
1 Cor 15:
20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
(MY NOTE: Christ is 1st to resurrect)

21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
(MY NOTE: Christ is 1st to resurrect)
Bible source link: Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 15 - King James Version

(MY NOTE: On the Mt. Christ [the 1st to be resurrected] has yet to die. Moses & Elias can't be more than a VISION)

Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 1 - King James Version

Jesus was the FIRSTBORN/resurrected from the dead.

Jesus is PREEMINENT in all things within our realm:

Creation: Jn 1:3 & 10, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6

Redemption: Gal 3:13, Rev 5:9, Col 1:14, Rom 3:24

Resurrection: 1 Cor 15:20, Col 1:18, Jn 11:25, Acts 4:33, 1 Pet 1:3 & 3:21

Mediation: 1 Tim 2:5, Heb 8:6, 9:15, - 12:24

Judgment: Jn 5:22, Rom 2:16, 2 Tim 4:1.
 
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ByTheSpirit

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The word used for vision there is horama, G3705, meaning a thing seen basically. It doesn’t only mean a vision as in like, God spoke to me in a vision. Even that is a bit of a misnomer, for a vision can be had with our eyes open or closed and it literally just means something we see. So in that verse Jesus is telling them, “What you just saw, tell to no one until…” Not that they had a “vision” per se.
 
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BobRyan

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KJ Bible Dictionary Definition: VI'SION, n. s as z. L. visio, from video, visus.
4. In Scripture, a revelation from God; an appearance or exhibition of something supernaturally presented to the minds of the prophets, by which they were informed of future events. Such were the visions of Isaiah, of Amos, of Ezekiel, etc.
Source link: VISION - Definition from the KJV Dictionary

Paul calls the appearance of Christ to him -- a vision.
Peter calls it the "heavenly vision"
Vision means different things in different contexts. In the case of Matt 17 when Jesus stands glorified before the disciples and Moses and Elijah appear with him. They (Moses and Elijah) are talking to Jesus about His "departure" - that is soon to take place. They are not saying "you have departed" but are speaking about a coming event.

Luke 9:
"31 who, appearing in glory, were speaking of His departure, which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem."

This is a real event in real time and they are speaking to him about what he would do at the cross and at His ascension. The disciples needed to be there to have their faith strengthened as they too were about to walk with Christ through those departure events soon to happen.

What is interesting here is that Moses and Elijah stand with him in glory talking to him about that future event. They are coming down from heaven to speak with him - fully forgiven, fully saints, fully in heaven - yet the cross has not even happened yet.

This is because as scripture says "God views those things that are not as though they were" - God views the future as though it has already happened. The Lamb of God slain from the foundations of the world.
 
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ByTheSpirit

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Paul calls the appearance of Christ to him -- a vision.
Peter calls it the "heavenly vision"
Vision means different things in different contexts. In the case of Matt 17 when Jesus stands glorified before the disciples and Moses and Elijah appear with him. They (Moses and Elijah) are talking to Jesus about His "departure" - that is soon to take place. They are not saying "you have departed" but are speaking about a coming event.

Luke 9:
"31 who, appearing in glory, were speaking of His departure, which He was about to accomplish at Jerusalem."

This is a real event in real time and they are speaking to him about what he would do at the cross and at His ascension. The disciples needed to be there to have their faith strengthened as they too were about to walk with Christ through those departure events soon to happen.

What is interesting here is that Moses and Elijah stand with him in glory talking to him about that future event. They are coming down from heaven to speak with him - fully forgiven, fully saints, fully in heaven - yet the cross has not even happened yet.

This is because as scripture says "God views those things that are not as though they were" - God views the future as though it has already happened. The Lamb of God slain from the foundations of the world.

I know some who view this as meaning that Moses and Elijah will be the two witnesses of Revelation. And certainly the description given of the two witnesses makes it sound as such.

Revelation 11:6, “They have the power to shut the sky, that no rain may fall during the days of their prophesying, and they have power over the waters to turn them into blood and to strike the earth with every kind of plague, as often as they desire.”

The issue with that I see is that the two witnesses will be killed.

Revelation 11:7-8
" And when they have finished their testimony, the beast that rises from the bottomless pit will make war on them and conquer them and kill them, and their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city that symbolically is called Sodom and Egypt, where their Lord was crucified."

Revelation 11:7-8 (ESV)

But scripture also states men is appointed to die ONCE. Well we all know from scripture that Moses has already died, but there is another who has yet to taste death. Enoch.

This is why I personally believe the two witnesses will be Enoch and Elijah.
 
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BobRyan

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In the book of Jude - Jude quotes the book "The Assumption of Moses" when describing the dispute between Michael and Satan over the issue of resurrecting Moses' and bodily assuming him into heaven. So there is an argument that at the time of Matt 17 - Moses is also not dead.

Matt 17 is not a seance with the dead - it is two living saints speaking with Christ - in glory
 
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BrotherJJ

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KJ Bible Dictionary Definition: VI'SION, n. s as z. L. visio, from video, visus.
4. In Scripture, a revelation from God; an appearance or exhibition of something supernaturally presented to the minds of the prophets, by which they were informed of future events. Such were the visions of Isaiah, of Amos, of Ezekiel, etc.
Source link: VISION - Definition from the KJV Dictionary

(MY NOTE: A vision is a revelation from God, something supernaturally presented to the mind, which inform of future events.)

Matt 17:9 And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.
Bible source link: Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 17 - King James Version

(MY NOTE: Jesus say's; Tell the VISION to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead)

The Order of Resurrection
1 Cor 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 15 - King James Version

1 Cor 15:20 But now [as things really are] Christ has in fact been raised from the dead, [and He became] the first fruits [that is, the first to be resurrected with an incorruptible, immortal body, foreshadowing the resurrection] of those who have fallen asleep [in death].
Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 15 - Amplified Bible

(MY NOTE: On the Mt. Christ [the 1st to be resurrected] has yet to die. Moses & Elias can't be more than a VISION)

Col 1:18 He is also the head [the life-source and leader] of the body, the [e]church; and He is the beginning, [f]the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will occupy the first place [He will stand supreme and be preeminent] in everything.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 1 - Amplified Bible

Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 1 - King James Version

Jesus is PREEMINENT in all things within our realm:

Jesus was the FIRSTBORN/resurrected from the dead.

Creation: Jn 1:3 & 10, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6

Redemption: Gal 3:13, Rev 5:9, Col 1:14, Rom 3:24

Resurrection: 1 Cor 15:20, Col 1:18, Jn 11:25, Acts 4:33, 1 Pet 1:3 & 3:21

Mediation: 1 Tim 2:5, Heb 8:6, 9:15, - 12:24

Judgment: Jn 5:22, Rom 2:16, 2 Tim 4:1.

(MY NOTE: Christ isn't preeminent in all things, if Moses & Elias aren't just a vision)
 
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BobRyan

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Recap -- Paul makes it clear that "vision" does not necessarily mean "not real" -- notice 2 Cor 12

"Boasting is necessary, though it is not beneficial; but I will go on to visions and revelations of the Lord. 2 I know a man in Christ, who fourteen years ago—whether in the body I do not know, or out of the body I do not know, God knows—such a man was caught up to the third heaven. 3 And I know how such a man—whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, God knows— 4 was caught up into Paradise and heard inexpressible words, which a man is not permitted to speak."​


Paul is saying he does not know if he went to heaven in the body or out of the body -- for that vision. This is not even a possible source of confusion - if one argues that visions can never be literal.

In Matt 17 - Christ is "real" is literal, the mountain is real, the 3 disciples are real - and Moses and Elijah are real.
 
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