I am sure glad for this forum. I am not even close to brave enough to talk to someone in person about this stuff.
Funny, I usually connect on the funny level with others. Making jokes. But this is very strongly personal and serious. It feels like the ultimate relationship commitment process. Not to be taken lightly. I've never experienced these kinds of feelings/thoughts, I've never allowed myself to. Always afraid of being hurt....a deep trust issue.
I went for a long walk yesterday to spend time meditating on God and Jesus. Inspired by you, Abandoned Barns. I took my time with just going at it easy. There was a wonderous peace/calm that washed over me gently. Something strange to me, but not in a bad way. It felt like everything was ok. I was in a bubblespace, outside of time/space.
That's Awesome!!! Can you feel Him working on your heart?
Trust is such a delicate precious thing. We're all born with a full tank of it. As a matter of fact we kind of have to learn not to trust and that's really sad to me. Life's no picnic and as we grow we learn that sometimes there's just no way not to get hurt. People stink (some more than others) and they're going to hurt you; sometimes intentionally and sometimes not, and when that happens enogh (especially in the case of the former) we begin to feel like we're better off to just stop trusting.
The problem is that with no trust we're alone and that's a pretty tough way to get through life. I'll share with you that a few years back, shortly after I was saved, my wife had an affair. It was the most gut wrenching and painful thing I've ever been through. It literally just nummed me. Not just the affair, but after the affair was discovered and that whole process of trying to put back the pieces. What I learned was that simply catching your spouse having an affair does not automatically change who they are and all that decit and sneakyness and unwillingness to communicate truthfull doesnt just magically go away. She said that she was sorry, she prommised it wouldn't happen again, but the dishonesty and distain and the acting like it was my fault and the threatining to end the marriage everytime I disagreed with her about anything - that took longer. I had to learn to forgive and accept who she was and I had to trust that God would work on her heart in His own time.
During that period, I had a lot of time to work on my own relationship with God and my own relationship with me and I thought a lot about why it hurt so much to be betrayed by someone you trust. I don't claim to have it all figured out, but I think it has something to do with the idea of value. When she cheated on me, it was as if she had said "you have no value". If you hear that enought in life, you begin to believe it. But here's the thing, and it's taken me several years to get it through my thick head, my value is not assigned by other people. It's not a function of my college degree, or position at work, or how much money I make, or how good looking I am, or if my wife was unfaithful or not. Those are things that get at self esteem, not self value and the problem with self esteem is that it's fleeting, self value is lasting. They say that the problem with self esteem, is that Charles Manson has great self esteem. Have you ever seen an interview with that guy - he absolulty loves himself! It's ok to feel bad about ourselves sometimes. It's good that we feel bad about ourselves sometime. When we're messing up, we should feel bad about ourselves. I saw a movie once that had a line I'll never forget; "sometimes bad self esteem is just good common sense" - that's very true.
Self value is something different. My true value is that God loves me. That trumps all in this life and it's something in which I can completly trust. I know, in my heart, that my God loved me so much that He died so that I could be with Him. Not just died, but died horribly, shamfully, like a common criminal:
Luke 24 (ESV) said:
32Two others, who were criminals, were led away to be put to death with him.
33And when they came to the place that is called The Skull, there they crucified him, and the criminals, one on his right and one on his left.
34And Jesus said, “Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.”And they cast lots to divide his garments.
35And the people stood by, watching, but the rulers scoffed at him, saying, “He saved others; let him save himself, if he is the Christ of God, his Chosen One!”
36The soldiers also mocked him, coming up and offering him sour wine
37and saying, “If you are the King of the Jews, save yourself!”
38There was also an inscription over him, “This is the King of the Jews.”
39One of the criminals who were hanged railed at him, saying, “Are you not the Christ? Save yourself and us!”
40But the other rebuked him, saying, “Do you not fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation?
41And we indeed justly, for we are receiving the due reward of our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong.”
42And he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.”
43And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise.”
Think about this; this was the single worst moment of Jesus' life. Dying, wrongfully accused, humiliated, stripped down, beaten and forsaken by the first time in his life by the father. And here's this guy asking for something from him. How would you respond? I know how I would - "Really? Now? You need a favor now? Dude, I'm a little busy here. What with the being beaten and crusified and dying for all humanity. It's a little hard to concentrate with these thorns sticking into my skull!"
Thats not what Jesus does. He ministers to him. This criminal. A lowlife nobody who, as far as we know, may have led a perfectly sinful life. What do you think his self value was like? This man shows the smallest seed of faith:
“Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.”
and again, in the single worst momemt of his life, dying, in agony, and covered in blood and sweat and dirt and spit and tears and sour wine, he reaches out to him, comforts him, loves him:
“Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise.”
Brother, If you can't trust that proves He loves you, trust that it means you have value to Him, then we're going to have to work on your trust a little. Because, I like to think that Jesus wasn't just speaking to the theif on the cross, but also to me some two thousand years later. He's speaking to you as well Rafiel, to all of us. To all of humanity he's saying "Here! I did this for you. You can have this. You can know this peace, this love. I'll take you there and all you have to do is follow me"
I have not even accepted Jesus yet. Yes, I don't want to do this completely alone. I don't mind the sharing of verses and personal spiritual perspectives.
You're never alone brother.
why can't we just ask for forgiveness and have a relationship with God?
That's kind of all there is. You already said that you believe you are a sinner. Chuck in there that you recognize that Jesus died for you and your home. You see what we're really asking for is grace not forgiveness, because we don't deserve forgiveness. Forgiveness we do for ourselves and it doesn't have to be two way; you hurt me, I forgive you, have a nice life. Grace is two sided. That is two say for it to work it not only has to be offered, but accepted as well. Without that last part (the recognizing that Jesus died for you) your really not accepting God's grace. You're saying that you want a relationship, but you want it to be on your own terms not God's.
If this acceptance of Jesus is as powerful as it seems to be, and I only felt around the edges.......and that is a lot of peace already.....how come so many Christians seem to hide it?=this relationship of peace that comes being a Christian?
I don't know. Perhaps sometimes they just forget. I'm gonna be straight with you Bo; things arent all milk and cookies once you get saved. You'll still have trials. You'll still get hurt. It's amazing, but as powerful as that feeling is when you first come to Jesus, the world is gonna creep back in. They say that the devil may even tempt you more so because he hates to loose. The difference is now there is this invincible sense of hope. The idea that the things that happen in this world (good and bad) really don't matter all that much, because we're living for this world, but rather for the next and the security of knowing God is in control. That we might not understand why some things happen, but that they are part of His plan and can be used for good. I don't know why my wife had to have an affair. I don't know why your Pop had to do that to you with the gun. I do know some of the worst stories make the best testimonies. Maybe hearing my story will help bring you to Jesus. Maybe, someday, someone hearing your story will help them to do the same. That's kind of the way it works. That peace is always there availiable to us, but sometimes we just get so busy with the things of this worlld we forget to take it. We forget that we need it. We forget what's important that is that we are children of God.
I cannot even begin to explain the thanks I feel for the words that you all are sharing.
Rafi
My friend, I have faith that very soon you will understand that the pleasure is all ours.
I have to run into work for a few hours. SCE&G is fixing a gasline and I have to test the dirt density as they backfill it. I'll check back in later when I'm done if you need someone to chat with. I'm so happy and excited for you Rafiel. I'm praying all the time.
