Jesse Duplantis' message on Heaven

[AFinChrist]

Hi Cindy!

LOL! Things have changed drastically since the last time we've talked.

The throne room is in our hearts. We can go there any time.

Jesus looks like a tall slender man. Brown eyes, brown wavy hair. The Holy spirit is a tall etherial man, all glowing and white with HUGE wings. God the Father looks like a powerful but gentle man. I have to use the face of my imagination because He is difficult to see. I see my own father's face or a man's face.

The room is where I go to chat, but they have other thrones where its set up high above the ground. Nations were worshipping them. Everyone had their hands up and singing.
They were in the center, up high.

There are other people/spirits there. Some children/babies and adults. I didn't stay long to talk with them. I saw my own "mansion" and the roads paved in emeralds and rubies.
There are cities and outlying towns and countries. Much like earth but better.
No cars.

As for authority; depending on what you are to Him on earth, you will have that much authority in heaven. Best I can describe is like Joshua when he was dividing the land amongst the tribes in Caanan.

Gotta go start my day...
talk with you more later.

 

[MikeMcK]

I find it hard to believe someone like you was ever a wofer, now that you're in bed with the heresy hunters.

Looking back, I find it hard to believe, but God is faithful and it's a testimony to His great mercy and faithfulness that He led me out of that Unbiblical belief system.

Iirc, you had some bad experience at one church; perhaps it was just that ONE church, maybe they claimed to be wof but really were cultic, and if they were cultic they probably didn't know it.

Actually, Gary Whetstone and Bob Palmer, the pastors of the two churches I attended are very well known in WoF circles. If they're not WoF, then they certainly have the WoF community fooled.

In any event, Jesse Duplantis still teaches false and Unbiblical doctrines, just as Whetstone and Palmer, and it is still disturbing that Christians would fall for his nonsense, including his Unbiblical "Heaven" story.

 

[TheGloryisHere]

You can't prove he didn't go.



same one



No, he did say Chinese...or Asian at least.

I think it has something to do with the grip of Communism in that area.

Not that I have anything against Asians

He said Asian children, and not many of them adults. I'm not too sure we should focus on particular countries, as it could breed strife.

 

[Simon_Templar]

There will be no marriage in Heaven.

Marriage is an Earthly institution by God to demonstrate and to be a foreshadow of the relationship between Christ and His church.

Just as the Sabbath was a foreshadow of the coming Christ, and has now been fulfilled in Christ, so there will be no need for the shadow in Heaven, when the real marriage ceremony comes.

This

the problem with this, is that we won't be in heaven. We'll be on the 'new earth'. Which would appear to be pretty much a new garden of eden.

 

[Simon_Templar]

Um ahem, there are "poorer" people that are very close to God. I have been "poor" myself.
Jan

I wasn't saying that there is anything wrong with being poor.. actually Mr. Duplantis would be the one implying that. I was saying that I question the idea that getting rid of poverty was Jesus' first objective.

 

[MikeMcK]

the problem with this, is that we won't be in heaven. We'll be on the 'new earth'. Which would appear to be pretty much a new garden of eden.

I see. So then, when Jesus ascended, and said that He went to prepare a place for us, so that where He is, so we may also be, He was really ascending to the New Earth?

 

[Simon_Templar]

I see. So then, when Jesus ascended, and said that He went to prepare a place for us, so that where He is, so we may also be, He was really ascending to the New Earth?

No, but if you read a little more carefully, you'll see that the place he prepared for us, descends from heaven onto earth, and we dwell there on earth with him.

 

[MikeMcK]

No, but if you read a little more carefully, you'll see that the place he prepared for us, descends from heaven onto earth, and we dwell there on earth with him.

If you say so, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to go with the Bible on this one.

 

[Simon_Templar]

If you say so, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to go with the Bible on this one.

then maybe you should try reading what it says before you make your assumptions and make up your mind.

Specificly you might try Revelation chapter 21.

 

[Atlantians]

If you say so, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to go with the Bible on this one.

You are implying that he was speaking in contrast to the Bible.
Like he says, it is a place that descends.
He gave you the scripture.

Also, heaven is spiritual.
If he was preparing houses in heaven, they would be metaphorical.

 

[CindyisHis]

Wherever it is, I'm glad I'm going to be there!

(I do have my opinion drawn from scripture as to where.) Point is, we rejoice because our names are written in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[9-iron]

Hisgirl, he said you would be in right relationship with your former spouse. He never said mentioned being married to them in Heaven.

I've heard another sermon on this. All relationships that were severed on earth will be fully restored in Heaven. I think that was Jesse was saying.


Jesus comes out to church in Lubbock every year. Last year the church only had half the parking lot paved. Jesse wrote a check to the church to have the other half paved. If you don't know what kind of money that cost, call your local paving company.

Also, he was there two nights, the second nights offering he gave back to the church as well.

Jesse is a little extravagant not doubt, however, I think he gives back as much as he recieves. He seems to care about the poor and gives tons of money to help those in need.

 

[pauldst]

Rick Joyner, writing in The Final Quest and the The Call, mentions some couples in heaven. The one's that he mentions were all married only to each other, I think, and for a long period of time. There is not much on that, but the impression that I had was that their relationships were what was the focus and that they just naturally hung out together. Marriage was not current, just the relationship. This does not contradict Jesus, who spoke of people in the afterlife still remembering and caring for those they loved. (Luke 16:19-21)

 

[MikeMcK]

You are implying that he was speaking in contrast to the Bible.
Like he says, it is a place that descends.
He gave you the scripture.

No, I'm not implying anything. I'm stating outright that he's speaking in contrast to the Bible.

Also, heaven is spiritual.
If he was preparing houses in heaven, they would be metaphorical.

Then why does the Bible describe Heaven as a physical place?

 

[JTM3]

Also, heaven is spiritual.
If he was preparing houses in heaven, they would be metaphorical.

That's ludicrous.

So what, are you saying heaven isn't an actual place?]

It's a state of mind or something???


Ugh. Everything with people like you is "metaphorical."

 

[Simon_Templar]

No, I'm not implying anything. I'm stating outright that he's speaking in contrast to the Bible.



Then why does the Bible describe Heaven as a physical place?

you have formed your opinions, and then bent the bible to match. Not that I expect you are capable of seeing this yet, but you may get there.

 

[MikeMcK]

you have formed your opinions, and then bent the bible to match.

No, I've studied the scriptures for nearly twenty years and have based my opinions on it.

Not that I expect you are capable of seeing this yet, but you may get there.

Funny, but you're very good at hurling childish insults, but when it comes to actually backing them up with scripture and correnting me, not a peep out of you.

Frankly, I think that says it all.

 

[Atlantians]

That's ludicrous.

So what, are you saying heaven isn't an actual place?]

It's a state of mind or something???


Ugh. Everything with people like you is "metaphorical."

Heaven is not metaphorical, nor did I say it was.
People like me?
A bit of rude wording on your part.
Further it was uncalled for.

The Bible says: God is spirit, and we must worship him in spirit.
Obviously if he is spirit he is not physical.
So any physical descriptions of him are either metaphors, or temporary manifestations.

Heaven is the spiritual presence of God. Not a physical place.
The spiritual realm is non-caporeal.
We can exist as siprit in non-caporeal form. That is how we can remain alive after death.
So we will "exist" "in" heaven, but heaven has no depth, or mass, or dimension.
So "there" would not be a place, as much a state of existence.

So no, heaven is not metaphorical. It is a place described thusly since we can not comprehend what it truly is. I certainly don't comprehend it, I am just good with understanding concepts... rarely can I apply said concepts, but that is another issue.

Again, please refrain from judgement.
One should be slow to anger.
One should not judge to harshly, or to quickly for what is to judge.

No, I'm not implying anything. I'm stating outright that he's speaking in contrast to the Bible.

Then demonstrate thusly.
He quite literally quoted scripture in the sense of paraphrase.
If it was wrong, prove it.
The burden of proof is on you because you questioned it first in a sense of challenging without first asking for clarification.

Then why does the Bible describe Heaven as a physical place?

How could we understand existing without a body in a place without dimension?
Spirit is not physical.
angels, demons, God. They are all not physical.
How can their realm be if they are not?
Besides "to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord."
If we are absent from the body, we are not in the body, and are obviously not in a "place".

you have formed your opinions, and then bent the bible to match. Not that I expect you are capable of seeing this yet, but you may get there.

That is rude, and no better than anything he said.
Whether you fealt it was or not I do not know.
It simply would be wrong for me to rebuke him, if I don't say the same to you when you do the same thing.

 

[MikeMcK]

Heaven is the spiritual presence of God. Not a physical place.

Then the Bible is wrong when it describes Heaven as a real, physical place?

The spiritual realm is non-caporeal.
We can exist as siprit in non-caporeal form. That is how we can remain alive after death.

You do know that believers are resurrected bodily, don't you?

 

[Simon_Templar]

No, I've studied the scriptures for nearly twenty years and have based my opinions on it.



Funny, but you're very good at hurling childish insults, but when it comes to actually backing them up with scripture and correnting me, not a peep out of you.

Frankly, I think that says it all.

I already gave you the scripture and you ignored it, because it doesn't fit with your views.

I'm not trying to insult you. Most people, including most christians do exactly the same thing. Its just the way humans are. The problem is that we don't realize we do it... and until we do, we can't fix the problem. Studying the bible for 20 years doesn't mean that you don't study it, and interpet in the context of your view point.

I've studied the bible for 15 years or more, and for most of that time, without even knowing it, I studied, and interpeted based on the assumptions I had already been taught, and made myself.
Its simply the way humans work, that we need to be trained specificly to step outside our view points and look at things objectively, or we simply don't do it. Its not something we do naturally.

I'm not just trying to insult you. Time and time again here I've seen you misrepresent other people's view point and beliefs, essentially 'strawmanning' any view point that differs significantly from your own.
Some of the people around here think you do this because you are malicious. I don't, I think its simply because you're at the stage of reasoning where you can't step outside the basic assumptions of your worldview, because you haven't been trained to do it, and maybe haven't been shown that it is important to do so.

In my own experience I've recognized three stages of reasoning. First is the stage where you accept what you are taught. You pretty much trust what authority figures say and assimilate it into your belief. This is where everyone begins, and its fine until you find people who don't share your views.

The second stage is what usually happens when people find their beliefs challenged. Those who do not hold their beliefs strongly, may just give them up in favor of accepting whatever the new authority tells them. Those who hold their beliefs strongly will enter a stage where they examine the evidence and the opposing view point from the stand point of looking for ways to validate their own view point, and defeat the opposing view point. This usually leads to using lots of strawman arguments and having lots of heated debates.

The third stage is when you stop just trying to defeat the opposing view point, and start trying to actually understand it. When you start trying to understand other people's beliefs, the way they believe them as opposed to how you percieve them. This is also the place where people begin to honestly question their own views and see wether they really match up to the truth. It requires you to step outside of your assumptions and examine them objectively. Its frequently very uncomfortable and unnerving, so people don't do it. At this point you try to stop using strawman arguments, and instead of heated debates, you have conversations and an exchange of ideas. You seek understanding and truth, rather than "winning"