Jealousy vs. Social Equality

[Prufrock]

Today I was driving by one of the many gated communities in America filled with million dollar homes, immaculate landscaping, the whole nine-yards...

An emotion came to me, and does more often as I have entered middle age, when we realize our limitations in life, earnings and otherwise. The emotion was either justice or envy. Either I was frustrated/angry at the inequality in living conditions or I was jealous.

I think it is fair to criticize the wealthy for spending on luxury instead of spending on charity. When do these emotions cross over to unhealthy or selfish ones?

 

[Inkachu]

Every time.

"Criticizing the wealthy" is the adult equivalent of a toddler throwing a tantrum because his friend got two lollipops and he only got one.

 

[Prufrock]

Hmmm...so what it the reason that the toddler's friend got two lollipops? was it an unjust reason? The tantrum response is not what I'm concerned about.

And to say that any criticism of the wealthy amounts to a toddler's tantrum does not seem equivalent to me. John Rawls had some criticisms for society based on unequal distributions of wealth. Was he too a crying toddler?

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

I think it is fair to criticize the wealthy for spending on luxury instead of spending on charity.

You have no idea how much they give to charity.

 

[Inkachu]

Hmmm...so what it the reason that the toddler's friend got two lollipops? was it an unjust reason?

None of the other kid's daggone business. He doesn't need to worry about what some other kid's mother gave him.

The tantrum response is not what I'm concerned about.

That's unfortunate, cause that's exactly what these "discussions" are. There may not be screaming and kicking, but they're adult-sized tantrums just the same. "They have more than I do! I want what they have!" I feel like handing out big pacifiers when I hear this stuff.

And to say that any criticism of the wealthy amounts to a toddler's tantrum does not seem equivalent to me. John Rawls had some criticisms for society based on unequal distributions of wealth. Was he too a crying toddler?

If you're criticizing the wealthy simply for being wealthy, then yes, chances are, you're a covetous crybaby. If you've got a genuine gripe with something that's illegal or unethical, then say so. Being miffed simply because someone else has something that you don't, that's coveting, which is a sin.

 

[Prufrock]

You have no idea how much they give to charity.

You are right that if I look at any one house, I would not know how much they give to charity. I can only see how much they keep. I do not know percentages.

 

[Robban]

Even the most expensive clock has no more than 60 minutes.

 

[Robban]

If the rich could hire others to die for them,
the poor could make a nice living.

 

[Robban]

"On your belly you shall crawl and dust you shall eat all the days of your life."

Not so bad, for a curse, dust is everywhere.

Would be convenient if we could live on dust.

We cry out to God for help,
the snake has no need, it needs nothing asks for nothing,
that is a curse.


A poor man is always aware of a blessing and turns to God for help and guidence every day.

 

[Prufrock]

None of the other kid's daggone business. He doesn't need to worry about what some other kid's mother gave him.

OK...maybe we should leave this analogy aside.

If you're criticizing the wealthy simply for being wealthy, then yes, chances are, you're a covetous crybaby. If you've got a genuine gripe with something that's illegal or unethical, then say so. Being miffed simply because someone else has something that you don't, that's coveting, which is a sin.

I'm not really looking to go that far with my OP. I'm just wondering more or less what feelings people have when seeing others live luxuriously. I take you do not notice them at all, or are ambivalent to the relative well-being of others, as its none of your business. A fair assessment? If I am honest, I first feel jealousy before feeling empathetic toward those who would benefit from their charity more substantially. But should the fact that I feel jealousy discredit the later feeling of empathy?

I know coveting is a sin, but is jealousy not the first feeling of empathy in some situations such as this? Does coveting in some situations not empower ambition?

What goes through your head when driving past extreme luxury?

 

[Paradoxum]

Every time.

"Criticizing the wealthy" is the adult equivalent of a toddler throwing a tantrum because his friend got two lollipops and he only got one.

And character assassination of those that criticise income inequality, is the modern equivalent of whipping serfs who say feudalism is unjust.

Next you'll say the slaves should just shut up and take it.

 

[Inkachu]

Of course I "take notice", as in, I'm aware of them. But you're right, how someone else got their wealth isn't any of my business.

I'd be lying to say I wouldn't like to be wealthy and never worry about bills again or how to survive or pay for anything. Everyone would like that. But I don't find myself eyeballing other people and thinking "MAN... I want what they have... so not fair..." Because I love the life I have, and I don't "deserve" anything, the world doesn't owe me jack-squat. It's up to me to find contentment in the lot I've been given, and to make the best of it. And if I had money, I wouldn't spend it on luxury "stuff", I'd be more likely to go back to school or start a business or travel. I have zero desire to live in some big, swanky house.

I'm confused by you saying that jealousy is somehow connected to empathy. Can you explain?

When driving past extreme luxury... hmm... I usually think "WOW... I would not want the responsibility!" I live in a small town with a nice lake. Someone just bought a corner lot by the lake and built a huuuuge mansion. My son (13 years old) always says "Wow, that is a perfect house, wouldn't you like that house?" and I say "No, it's too big, I wouldn't want to clean it. I wouldn't have any use for all those rooms, either. And it's not pretty, it's just... fancy."

There are things that I want that I don't have, but luxury is not one of them.

 

[elephunky]

i dont't think you can really judge a situation like that without actually knowing all the facts. I think that part of the reason that we hate or greatly dislike certain things is because we secretly wish we had that option.

 

[poolerboy0077]

I think it is fair to criticize the wealthy for spending on luxury instead of spending on charity.

Can't they do both? Unless by this you mean they take up Jesus on his word and sell everything they own. I don't think I've ever seen any Christian actually do that. Charity alone isn't really going to do much problem-solving. You have to change fundamental structures in government. To me, income inequality isn't so much a problem because it incorrectly assumes that acquiring more wealth necessarily diminishes the capacity for others to acquire their own wealth, like some kind of blanket that is of a finite size too limited to cover everyone snuggly. Instead, what is upsetting to me is the financial structures which allow people to rig the system by which the ultra wealthy make their affluence off the backs of the poor and middle class.

 

[ebia]

Today I was driving by one of the many gated communities in America filled with million dollar homes, immaculate landscaping, the whole nine-yards... An emotion came to me, and does more often as I have entered middle age, when we realize our limitations in life, earnings and otherwise. The emotion was either justice or envy. Either I was frustrated/angry at the inequality in living conditions or I was jealous. I think it is fair to criticize the wealthy for spending on luxury instead of spending on charity. When do these emotions cross over to unhealthy or selfish ones?

I guess it depends on:
Would you like to live there (personally I would hate to live in a "gated community" - it's an abhorrent idea)?
If they gave away the money, would you have it come your way?

 

[ebia]

Every time. "Criticizing the wealthy" is the adult equivalent of a toddler throwing a tantrum because his friend got two lollipops and he only got one.

I've no problem with someone else having two lollipops if I only have one.
I have a problem when some has more lollipops than they could possibly eat while another kid starves.

 

[ebia]

Even the most expensive clock has no more than 60 minutes.

Unless maybe you had one made during the brief period when France was trying to metrisise time.

 

[Ada Lovelace]

I am a minute away from falling asleep for the night so this is brief. I noticed your Kierkegaard quote and wanted to share a passage of his that floated in my mind while reading your posts.

“In the end, therefore, money will be the one thing people will desire, which is moreover only representative, an abstraction. Nowadays a young man hardly envies anyone his gifts, his art, the love of a beautiful girl, or his fame; he only envies him his money. Give me money, he will say, and I am saved...He would die with nothing to reproach himself with, and under the impression that if only he had had the money he might really have lived and might even have achieved something great.” ~ The Present Age and the Difference Between a Genius and an Apostle

I've grown up in one of the most affluent areas of the country and have also spent a little time in some of the most impoverished areas of the world, so I'll give some perspectives on jealousy and social equality when my brain is fully awake.

Btw, I think at 32 you still count as being "young" instead of middle age if you're living in America where most people live well beyond age 64.

 

[quatona]

Today I was driving by one of the many gated communities in America filled with million dollar homes, immaculate landscaping, the whole nine-yards...

An emotion came to me, and does more often as I have entered middle age, when we realize our limitations in life, earnings and otherwise. The emotion was either justice or envy. Either I was frustrated/angry at the inequality in living conditions or I was jealous.

I think it is fair to criticize the wealthy for spending on luxury instead of spending on charity. When do these emotions cross over to unhealthy or selfish ones?

I guess they begin to cross over when you forget that you are probably still among the 5% wealthiest people in the world.

 

[Robban]

Unless maybe you had one made during the brief period when France was trying to metrisise time.

I did not know that,

Though a Biblical hour (Halachically) is from sunrise to sunset divided by twelve.

but then there is also,

Time is God,s way of preventing everything from happening all at once.

However we try to intervene.