• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.

James 3:2 vs. James 3:8 (how to reconcile?)

Discussion in 'Christian Scriptures' started by friend of, Dec 24, 2017.

  1. friend of

    friend of Well-Known Member Supporter

    +1,847
    Canada
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Hey! reading through James 3 and noticed these verses which seem to contradict each other. Now, as a firm believer in the inerrancy of scirpture, I'm requesting the reader to help reconcile these two verses.

    James 3:2
    2 We all stumble in many ways. Anyone who is never at fault in what they say is perfect, able to keep their whole body in check.

    ^this verse seems to suggest that it is possible for a human being to live in a state where their tongues are in complete check. However—

    James 3:8
    8 but no human being can tame the tongue. It is a restless evil, full of deadly poison.

    ^this verse, following almost immediately from the former, seems to suggest that it is impossible for a human being to keep the tongue completely in check...

    Questions:
    Is it really possible to command total reign over our tongues?
    Is such an achievement necessary to be right in the sight of God?
    Do these verses contradict?
    Is this chapter imparting to us that we must always strive to bring our hearts and minds into submission to Christ? (I think so)
    Anything else that comes to mind!?


    God bless you all and have a wonderful, Merry Christmas filled with love, song laughter and good food and company :groupray:
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. Winken

    Winken Heimat Supporter

    +3,455
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    US-Others
    James is speaking to those who teach. One who teaches speaks from the Holy Spirit. In that instance it is impossible to teach error. On the other hand, those who speak from the flesh (minus the Holy Spirit) merely babble.

    We do not "strive", ourselves, to bring our hearts and minds into submission to Christ. He has already done that at the Cross, with the intercession of the Holy Spirit. What we do is wander away from that blessing into "mind" and "heart". The latter two are qualities of the nature of man before the experience of salvation, and are forever lurking in the darkness to bubble forth into error.

    May ALL His Blessings be YOURS!
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
    • List
  3. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +8,688
    Anabaptist
    Yes.
    Yes.
    No.
    Yes.
    Yes.
     
  4. St_Worm2

    St_Worm2 Senior Member Supporter

    +38,591
    United States
    Calvinist
    Married
    US-Republican
    Hi Friend Of, it seems to me that you don't need to go all the way to v8, that v2 contains within itself the very same 'apparent' contradiction, yes?

    IOW, "we all stumble in many ways" AND "if anyone does not stumble/is never at fault..."

    Whoops, gotta go right now. I'll have to come back a little later to finish.

    MERRY CHRISTMAS!

    --David
     
  5. Cat Loaf You

    Cat Loaf You Active Member

    304
    +140
    Poland
    Christian
    Private
    These verses do not contradict each other switch to KJV .
     
  6. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member Supporter

    +2,371
    Christian
    Married
    Verse 2 is about individual believers taming their own tongue. Verse 8 is about the inability of leaders to tame the tongues of congregants. He's reverting back to verse 1, "Be there not many teachers."
     
  7. friend of

    friend of Well-Known Member Supporter

    +1,847
    Canada
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Ah okay that makes sense. Yes it certainly is difficult for me to tame someone else's tongue. (more like impossible)
     
  8. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +8,688
    Anabaptist
    Don't forget , also, who gives the gift or way to get "self control" in Jesus. (outside of Jesus and YHWH'S Grace it is impossible).
     
  9. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member Supporter

    +2,371
    Christian
    Married
    I've preached to churches about it because of serious problems with gossip, only to have the message get almost completely ignored soon thereafter. The ones who need to hear it the most either phase out or find a way to be somewhere else while it's being preached (the nursery, the kitchen, anywhere but in the pew). Even if you manage to get members to control it well enough in public, they'll revert back to gossip and slander in an instant in private. The problem is it's become a habit for many believers, and so ingrained in them that it's difficult to root out.
     
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2017
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • List
  10. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

    +8,688
    Anabaptist
    Until they're willing , joyously willing, and choose for Jesus to change their lives,

    there's likely NO WAY for YHWH to do good through them or even for them in an effective way.
     
  11. friend of

    friend of Well-Known Member Supporter

    +1,847
    Canada
    Non-Denom
    Private

    Gossip, slander, reveling at others' expense behind their backs is ungodly and ignoble. The problem is that it's so easy to behave this way, especially today with our ability to communicate all of our thoughts instantly, that many sitting in congregations at present hardly notice the ill effects this behavior causes to people's reputations. It's toxic, but it provides a sort of instant self-satisfaction and it becomes a part of the identity of those who are trained by it their entire lives, making the root of it impossible to extricate. Those who live by the tongue in such a way are waging war against Proverbs 22:1
     
  12. friend of

    friend of Well-Known Member Supporter

    +1,847
    Canada
    Non-Denom
    Private
  13. Michael Collum

    Michael Collum Everything began with a voice, use yours Supporter

    +3,733
    Canada
    Christian Seeker
    Married
    These two can be harmonized with the teachings of Paul, regarding what is said about the flesh. The flesh is always in a state of animosity towards anything God related, the verses do not contradict, the verses are effectively saying: When you are matured or perfect, you will have tamed your tongue, and no human being can tame to tongue. It means trusting God to surpass the regular human boundaries, when we are born again we are made a new creation the old is gone, the new has come. There is no contradiction for the intended audience.
     
  14. JES1023

    JES1023 New Member Supporter

    75
    +85
    United States
    Baptist
    Single
    James 3:2 speaks of the Christian person who lets the Holy Spirit take hold of his/her tongue; something I have yet to learn to do.

    While James 3:8 speaks of Christians who try to take control of their tongue without letting the Holy Ghost do His wonderful work.

    When the Holy Spirit gets control of our hearts we as followers of Christ have the potential to speak the good words that He will cause to come out of our hearts; Matthew 12:34-37
     
Loading...