Its unauthorized to say that silence equals a command of God.

Splayd

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Here is a principle I have found helpful. I throw it out there for everyone's benefit.

Silence is "prohibitive" if....

1. That in question is opposite, or leads one in a different direction from that which is commanded.

2. That in question hinders the performance of that which is commanded.
Thanks John.

My initial reaction is that it's not an unreasonable approach, though I'm not entirely sure it's necessary.

Instead of even considering the "silence" aspect at all, one might consider that scripture actually addresses such matters by encouraging us to avoid stumbling blocks. I suspect that either approach should lead to the same conclusion most of the time, but one is speaking where scripture doesn't.

Peace
 
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JDIBe

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Splayd,

I agree, both are probably equivalent ways of saying the same thing. I do think it is an important thing to consider. One side can make the argument that Coke and Pepsi should not be allowed in the Lord's Supper and the other can make an argument that church pews are not explictly authorized, yet acceptable and they would both be right.

The truth seems to be somewhere in the middle. A method of interpretation to find that happy medium other than personal preference seems to be useful.
 
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Loveaboveall

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John 10:34 says, "Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, 'I said, Ye are gods?' "

Two observations:
1.) Jesus' audience in John was Jewish, and, "Written in your law," is a reference to the law the Jews were under - the law of Moses.
2.) "I said, Ye are gods," is a quote from Psalm 82:6. And, since Jesus considers the Psalms to be a part of Jewish law, I conclude that the law can be viewed in a broad sense to include the whole of that which Moses spoke and the O.T. prophets and writings that followed.

A few observations: The term "law" is used to describe several different things. It can be used to describe the whole of the writings the Jews had at that time, which would be synonomouos with "scriputre" or are word "Bible". It can be used to describe the whole of all the commands found in Exodus-Numbers which the Jews referred to as the "Law of Moses" and then there are instances where the term "law" refers to the 10 commandments. One must use context to decide what is the proper understanding of the term "law".

In the context of John 10 Jesus clearly uses the term to mean "scriptures" which encompasses all of the writings of the day.

The context of Colossians 2 is such that there can be no argument that it is not referring to the whole of the OT. It specifically refers to the ordiances that were against us and contrary to us. Where are these found? In the system of sacrifices and death that are found in Leviticus, numbers, and deutoronomy.

Acts 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command [them] to keep the law of Moses.

It is clear this is speaking of circumcision and other customs associated with the law written by Moses in the Torah. The context says nothing to suggest it refers to the whole of the OT.

Perhaps 1 Corinthians 5:1 might help you. Certain basic moral things seem to be understood by the Gentiles as being wrong. Although they weren't given the law per se, they did have a basic understanding of right and wrong.

As far as being under law, today Jesus has all authority (Matt. 28:18). Whether obedient or not, all of us are under His law. Obviously, those of us who acknowledge Jesus as both Lord and Christ (Acts 2:36) look at His rule differently than those who do not give Him the respect and reverence that He deserves.

One Question:
Which part or parts of the O.T. law do you practice today?


You say that the gentiles knew what is right and wrong but were not given the law. What does it mean to be given the law?

Romans 3:1-2 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit [is there] of circumcision?Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

Here it is clear by the context that Paul is speaking of the 10 commandments (see chapter2) Paul is saying that they have an advantage because God intrusted to them His law which they were to teach to the world. When Paul uses the term "given the law" it literally means God entrusted them with the written law that they would know specifically what it means to love God and to love man.

When a Gentile accepts Jesus and His nature is changed he keeps the law of God by the spirit writing the law on his heart(a change in nature). Even without this change in nature people God has still given each person an inherent knowledge of His law by the conscious(Holy Spirit) This is how someone who does not know the law of God will know it is wrong to kill, steal, lie, etc.

Whether obedient or not, all of us are under His law.

So, are you saying we are under a law today? What law? And how does this relate to the point Paul trys to make throughout Romans "you are not under law, but grace"?


I practice this part of the O.T. law:

Deut 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

Leviticus 19:18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I [am] the LORD.
 
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RefrusRevlis

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Hey Splayd, sorry for the delay in my response.

Of course it's true. ALL scripture is given by inspiration of God. At the time of writing that basically just meant the OT, but we both agree that it necessarily includes subsequent scripture.


Well, no, the content of the N.T. scriptures were being transmitted both verbally and in letters during the first century. The reason for spiritual gifts was for the transmission of the New Covenant. Yes, the word Scripture (graph[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ē[/FONT]) primarily means something written, but scripture came about as a result of inspiration, oral transmission and writing. You admit that " we both agree that it necessarily includes subsequent scripture", so I really don't see your point. Do you believe we have the completed NT?

What's more interesting it that some would determine that it REALLY means everything BUT what was considered scripture by the writer.


It seems that you are assuming that (1) there were no NT scriptures existing at that time, (2) that the author only regarded OT as scripture, (3) that I do not regard the OT as scripture. All of these assumptions are incorrect.


2 Peter 3:16
"as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures."


The wording of the previous verse indicates that Paul (who is the subject of this verse) wrote epistles and these were considered to be Scriptures.


Whether or not the NT scriptures were complete at the time of writing is really irrelevant. God was well able to say "all scripture" and include those yet to come into existence. We have the complete NT now, we have no excuse.


I also find it confusing that you would refer to this passage as an appeal for our bible being a complete and perfect volume. Now I'm inclined to believe it is, but that's not what the writer is saying. Our bible didn't exist then.


What I said:


The Bible says of itself that it is complete: as we have seen (2 Timothy 3:16-17), we are equipped for every good work. There is nothing lacking. It is perfect.


Are we equipped by every good work by the scriptures? Is there something outside the scriptures that can equip us for every good work? If so what is it?


Note the ":" after the words "The Bible says of itself that it is complete". I was using the statement from 2 Timothy3:17 "that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work" to indicate the total efficacy of the Scriptures and that that was all we need, NOT that the scriptures were all written down at the time of Paul's writing. The scriptures ARE now complete. It is entirely correct for me to say in the 21st century that "the Bible is complete", in both sense - that it lacks nothing necessary to bring about our thorough equipping AND it has been completed - i.e. all written down.


In fact, I don't see that the concept of a complete and perfect volume of scripture even existed then.

Read 1 Corinthians 13:9-10 and see the thread on "when the perfect comes".


If it did, then it was the Septuagint which contains books we reject and doesn't contain books we accept. Surely if the passage does in fact refer to a compiled volume of scripture it would refer to the one in use at the time and not the one compiled hundreds of years later.


You assume the absence of the written form of the NT at the time of the Apostles, this is incorrect.



Of course I don't think it is at all. I just think it's saying what it can be seen to be saying: ALL scripture is inspired by God. As such it can teach and correct etc... that we might be perfected.

All scripture is inspired by God. Both the OT and The NT. But this does not mean that everything found in both the OT and NT are binding on us today.


Romans 10:17 does indeed say that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. Context is interesting here. The passage is about the need to preach the gospel. Essentially it's saying that we need to tell people about Jesus because they won't have faith unless they hear God's word in the first place. Your understanding is dependant on your understanding of 2 Timothy as discussed earlier in this post.


The word "hearing" means "active hearing" in Romans 10:17. It is possible to hear the gospel without hearing it through the sense of hearing. If faith only comes through having the gospel preached to you and hearing it, what about deaf people? Sounds like a silly question, I know, but points out that faith does not only come from hearing someone preach the gospel, it can come from hearing the message through reading it. Yes, preaching is important, but only is it contains the word of God. Revelation 3:22 says


"He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches."
Now this was written in a letter and sent to the churches. The Spirit could be heard through the written word.



The inclusion of Romans 14 for your argument is an interesting one.

Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

Context seems to have been completely overlooked to find a convenient prooftext for your conclusion which followed.

Yes, the context is related to eating foods while doubting, however Paul appeals to a general principle to show this to be unapproved behaviour. The use of the word "whatsoever" shows the statement "for whatsoever is not of faith is sin" to be a general statement. The word "faith" refers to the faith a person has, which can also be expressed as the "lack of doubt". So faith equals lack of doubt. If you are not certain of something, you should not do it. How are we to know what is pleasing to God? How can we know what he wants us to do? The answer is through His word. The areas of doubt correspond to the areas of scripture silence. Does this mean that as long as a person thinks something is right, that it therefore IS right? Hardly. A person's faith must be based on The Faith.



a Faith comes from God's word
b Whatever is not of faith is sin.
c Therefore whatever does not come from God's word is sin.


Forgive me for adding the red letters. I did that for convenience. You are saying that a + b = c and I disagree. It's poor logic to assume as much, though I understand how you did.

a)You've equated God's word directly with the text of the NT, demanding a 100% correlation. Now it is true that the NT only contains God's word, but it isn't true that God's word is only contained in the NT. Without that direct correlation the argument falls apart.
The statement "Faith comes from the Word of God" stands. I do not believe that God's word is only the NT. However, the NT is the only part of the Word of God that is binding upon us.


Hebrews 8:13
In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.



Further, you've made the statement an exhaustive one. ie Faith ONLY comes from the text of the NT. That's another flaw in your understanding. People had faith before it was written and people can have faith without ever hearing the exact words of the NT. Of course they'll have to hear of the things it contains to have faith in Christ, but they don't need to hear the exact words to have faith. Those who were asked to preach the word in the correlating passage didn't even have the exact words yet.


You are assuming I mean the "text of the NT". It does not matter how the word of God is transmitted, however the most accurate method of its transmission is the written word. With it, one can be like those of Berea (yes, I know they would have been using the OT scriptures, but the principle is the same).


Consider the following:
Colossians 3:17
And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through Him.

To "do all in the name" of Christ, means to do all by the authority of Christ. This authority comes from His word:

Jn 14:26
Butthe Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.


Jn 16:13-14
However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. 14 He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you.


The words delivered by the Holy Spirit came through the authority of Christ. In the words of the NT we have that which enable us to do all in the name of (by the authority of) Christ.

This ties in with 2 Peter 1:3
"as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue"

The knowledge of Christ gives us all things that pertain to life and godliness.


Jude 3
Beloved, while I was very diligent to write to you concerning our common salvation, I found it necessary to write to you exhorting you to contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints.


I'm still wanting to know whether you believe that the Bible's silence neither authorises or prohibits.

Refrus
 
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Loveaboveall

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Do we need the writings of Acts-Jude to know that Jesus is the Son of God and died for our sins? Can someone come to the 5 steps of salvation through the reading of the gospel accounts and the OT? If you did not have Acts-Jude would one still be able to determine what was right and wrong in God's eyes? Was the testimony of Jesus and the Testimony about Jesus in the OT not enough?

The New testament is just one big "AMEN" to the OT.

If one diligently studied the scriptures as they should, the spirit would teach them all understanding which is exactly what Paul, Peter, Jude, Luke, and John did. If you carefully study their writings they reference the OT for most all of their points!

I am not saying that Acts-Jude is not applicable today, far from it! But, we should not need these writings to understand the gospel. And somehow, we have taken these writings and justified the "burning" of the OT by them. This should not be!

There is a small CofC in rural Texas that my extended family worships at. They DO NOT have bibles with the OT in them. They say there is no need to study the OT it has "vanished away". How far is too far?
 
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Splayd

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I'm still wanting to know whether you believe that the Bible's silence neither authorises or prohibits.
I'll get back to the rest when I can, but I figured I'd quickly respond to this. YES - I still believe that silence does neither by itself. I still don't see any reason to assume that it's any different in scripture than elsewhere. Your illustration of felt tips clearly demonstrated that in general situations, we understand "silence" according to the context. Until it's clear to me that scripture has established how to respond to silence, I see no reason to treat it differently in that regard. It still hasn't been satisfactorily demonstrated to me that it does, though I am gaining a greater understanding of the argument.

Peace
 
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- DRA -

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Question for Thought:
Deuteronomy 6:16 (and its context) was "silent" about jumping from the top of the temple. Therefore, was it applicable to that situation?

Comment:
My understanding of Jesus' teaching in Matthew 4:5-7 is that Deut. 6:16 was applicable, and "in principle" prohibited one from deliberately putting God to the test. Anyone wish to comment on Jesus' use of Deuteronomy 6:16 in His response to the devil's suggested understanding of Psalm 91:11-12?
 
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- DRA -

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Do we need the writings of Acts-Jude to know that Jesus is the Son of God and died for our sins? Can someone come to the 5 steps of salvation through the reading of the gospel accounts and the OT? If you did not have Acts-Jude would one still be able to determine what was right and wrong in God's eyes? Was the testimony of Jesus and the Testimony about Jesus in the OT not enough?

According to 2 Timothy 3:16-17, God inspired "all Scripture," and all Scripture completely furnishes us what all we need to serve God and please Him. Therefore, why should we feel compelled to feel the truth is complete without the books of Acts and Jude?

The New testament is just one big "AMEN" to the OT.

Agreed. However, there is just bit more. Jesus came to fulfill the law down to the smallest detail (Matthew 5:17-18). Once the law was fulfilled, He established His will upon His death (Hebrews 9:16-17) according to Moses' prophecy i.e. (Deut. 18:15,18; Acts 3:22; Acts 7:37).

If one diligently studied the scriptures as they should, the spirit would teach them all understanding which is exactly what Paul, Peter, Jude, Luke, and John did. If you carefully study their writings they reference the OT for most all of their points!

For sure, the apostles used the O.T. Scriptures to show that Jesus was indeed both Lord and Christ e.g. Acts 2:22-36. However, they also viewed each other's inspired writings as Scripture also e.g. 2 Peter 3:15-16.

I am not saying that Acts-Jude is not applicable today, far from it! But, we should not need these writings to understand the gospel. And somehow, we have taken these writings and justified the "burning" of the OT by them. This should not be!

Not sure exactly who is "burning" the Old Testament. If that is happening, shame on whoever is doing such a thing. :blush: There is much to be learned from the O.T. (Rom. 15:4). There are the types, copies, and shadows of Jesus, salvation, etc. And, there are examples of disobedience that we should learn from (e.g. 1 Corinthians 10:1-13), as well as examples of obedience (Hebrews 11). Without a doubt, the O.T. is a part of the "all Scripture" in 2 Tim. 3:16-17 that makes us complete to serve God today.

There is a small CofC in rural Texas that my extended family worships at. They DO NOT have bibles with the OT in them. They say there is no need to study the OT it has "vanished away". How far is too far?

If the church that you describe are diligent students of the New Testament, then they probably should give more consideration to Romans 15:4. For sure, the O.T. has many "lessons" that we can learn from, and it is the background to reinforce patience and hope as we wait for God to be true to His promises He has made through Christ - knowing good and well from the numerous O.T. examples that He indeed will be true to His word.

:clap:
 
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Splayd

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Refrus - I really didn't mean to imply these things:

It seems that you are assuming that (1) there were no NT scriptures existing at that time, (2) that the author only regarded OT as scripture, (3) that I do not regard the OT as scripture. All of these assumptions are incorrect.
BUT I can understand how it may have appeared that way. Trying to explain differences in subtle understandings is difficult. Allow me to address this from another angle.

In short it comes back to an understanding of what "all scripture" means. I read it the way I would read any similar statement. It applies to each individual instance. Consider - if I said "all birds fly" then my statement (though incorrect) means that pelicans fly AND pidgeons fly AND eagles fly AND... etc... The statement is meant for each and every individual bird. It's not reliant on "all birds" as one entity.

SO - when I read 2 Timothy 3:16-17, I see that Genesis is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work... and so is Exodus AND Leviticus AND Deuteronomy AND... so on. The statement is true of EACH book, not just the whole.

Your conclusion insists that "all scripture" be considered as one whole. As such the term becomes one noun "all scripture" and not a noun "scripture" with a quantifier "all".

In fact, a lot of translations prefer the phrase "every scripture" which clarifies the distinction even more.

Can you see the distinction? If it said "Psalms is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work." would you determine that we need Psalms-only authority?

As I see it, it does say that... BUT it also says it of each and every book independantly. Does that mean we need to have authority from each and every book? NO - the conclusion only works if we consider it as a whole, but even then it's inconsistent because it doesn't accept the authority from the whole.

I hope that explains my understanding of your argument in a better way. If I'm still not explaining myself or if I'm not understanding your argument, please clarify. I don't expect us to necessarily agree on this, but I'd hope to reach a point where we properly understand the other's perspective.

Peace
 
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- DRA -

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A few observations: The term "law" is used to describe several different things. It can be used to describe the whole of the writings the Jews had at that time, which would be synonomouos with "scriputre" or are word "Bible". It can be used to describe the whole of all the commands found in Exodus-Numbers which the Jews referred to as the "Law of Moses" and then there are instances where the term "law" refers to the 10 commandments. One must use context to decide what is the proper understanding of the term "law".

In the context of John 10 Jesus clearly uses the term to mean "scriptures" which encompasses all of the writings of the day.

The context of Colossians 2 is such that there can be no argument that it is not referring to the whole of the OT. It specifically refers to the ordiances that were against us and contrary to us. Where are these found? In the system of sacrifices and death that are found in Leviticus, numbers, and deutoronomy.

Acts 15:5 But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command [them] to keep the law of Moses.

It is clear this is speaking of circumcision and other customs associated with the law written by Moses in the Torah. The context says nothing to suggest it refers to the whole of the OT.

You say that the gentiles knew what is right and wrong but were not given the law. What does it mean to be given the law?

Romans 3:1-2 What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit [is there] of circumcision?Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

Here it is clear by the context that Paul is speaking of the 10 commandments (see chapter2) Paul is saying that they have an advantage because God intrusted to them His law which they were to teach to the world. When Paul uses the term "given the law" it literally means God entrusted them with the written law that they would know specifically what it means to love God and to love man.

When a Gentile accepts Jesus and His nature is changed he keeps the law of God by the spirit writing the law on his heart(a change in nature). Even without this change in nature people God has still given each person an inherent knowledge of His law by the conscious(Holy Spirit) This is how someone who does not know the law of God will know it is wrong to kill, steal, lie, etc.

So, are you saying we are under a law today? What law? And how does this relate to the point Paul trys to make throughout Romans "you are not under law, but grace"?

I practice this part of the O.T. law:

Deut 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

Leviticus 19:18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I [am] the LORD.

I also believe that we should love the LORD with all our heat, soul, and might today. And, I also believe that we should love our neighbor as ourself. Why? Jesus taught these principles were the basis for the law and the prophets (Matt. 22:36-40). However, Jesus and the N.T. writers also expounded on the need love for a genuine and sincere love for God and our fellow man - whether saint or sinner (Jn. 14:21, 1 Cor. 16:22, Phile. 1:5, James 1:12, 1 Jn. chapter 4, Luke 10:25-37, Gal. 6:10).
So, I don't keep it just because it was a part of the law of Moses per se, but because it is a part of the gospel of Jesus Christ - the new covenant established according to Hebrews 8:6-13.

As for the discussion of whether or not we are under law today, we are under the "law of faith" (NKJV) per Romans 3:27 - synonymous with the "perfect law of liberty" in James 1:25. No doubt, Jesus' will/testament/law was established after His death (Hebrews 9:16-17), and we are expected to obey Him (Hebrews 5:9) - assuming, of course, that we do desire to please Him and receive eternal life.

I suggest you give some more thought to the "handwriting of ordinances that was against us" in Col. 2:14. The sacrifices were coupled with the Levitical priesthood, and the priesthood with the law. In the book of Hebrews, God helps Jewish Christians "see" that the priesthood changed, which "of necessity" prompted a change in the law (Heb. 7:12 and chapter 8), and that the sacrifices and actions of the priests under the law of Moses were shadows (types or copies) of Jesus and His one-time sacrifice for sin (Hebrews chapters 9-10). In essence, the Jesus' sacrifice completely took sins away where the animal sacrifices only atoned for (covered) sins. So, in what way was the law of Moses against the Jews? ... It identified sin but couldn't completely take it away. ... Only Jesus' sacrifice on the cross could do that. Once Jesus made that sacrifice, the old law was indeed taken away. From that point on, as people obeyed the gospel of Christ, the focus what on the "apostles' doctrine" (Acts 2:42) - brought about by the Holy Spirit guiding the apostles to "all truth" just as Jesus promised (Jn 16:13).

Are you sure that Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18 are the only parts of the O.T. law that you practice? What about Psalm 150? You seemed to have an awful strong interest in this Psalm earlier in our discussion.
 
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- DRA -

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Originally Posted by JDIBe
Here is a principle I have found helpful. I throw it out there for everyone's benefit.

Silence is "prohibitive" if....

1. That in question is opposite, or leads one in a different direction from that which is commanded.

2. That in question hinders the performance of that which is commanded.

Thanks John.

My initial reaction is that it's not an unreasonable approach, though I'm not entirely sure it's necessary.

Instead of even considering the "silence" aspect at all, one might consider that scripture actually addresses such matters by encouraging us to avoid stumbling blocks. I suspect that either approach should lead to the same conclusion most of the time, but one is speaking where scripture doesn't.

Peace

Spayed,

As distasteful as it might be, there is indeed a valid point that can be made from God's silence when He has spoken and specified what He wants.

Hebrews 7:13-14 says, "He of whom these things are said belonged to a different tribe, and no one from that tribe has ever served at the altar. For it is clear that our Lord descended from Judah, and in regard to that tribe Moses said nothing about [was silent about] priests.(NIV)."
 
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- DRA -

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Originally Posted by WesWoodell
Posting two or more replies in a row is unauthorized.

I was wondering if anyone thought that the direction this thread has taken was ironic....

Or is that also not authorized???;)

It is my understanding that "thought" (referring to the thinking process) is authorized. :)

Wes seems to be worried about the chronological order of the posts. You seem to be worried about the direction of the thread. Would either one of you like to contribute something positive to the discussion? Like, for instance, if you think things are going astray or in the wrong direction, buy all means, please help us get things back on track. On the other hand, if by the "direction of this thread" you mean that you simply don't like the things being said nor the conclusions being drawn, that is a totally different matter. All of us face those kind of things in our spiritual development. Those sincerely interested in truth and pleasing God should yield their will to God's. And, if I'm the bad guy for saying such things, then so be it. You see, I believe that God expects us to do such things i.e. Jude 3, 2 Timothy 4:2-4. That makes such action "authorized," right?
 
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cremi

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Originally Posted by WesWoodell
Posting two or more replies in a row is unauthorized.



It is my understanding that "thought" (referring to the thinking process) is authorized. :)

Wes seems to be worried about the chronological order of the posts. You seem to be worried about the direction of the thread. Would either one of you like to contribute something positive to the discussion? Like, for instance, if you think things are going astray or in the wrong direction, buy all means, please help us get things back on track.
Actually, I thought I was...especially after reading the first page of this thread. :scratch:
On the other hand, if by the "direction of this thread" you mean that you simply don't like the things being said nor the conclusions being drawn, that is a totally different matter. All of us face those kind of things in our spiritual development. Those sincerely interested in truth and pleasing God should yield their will to God's. And, if I'm the bad guy for saying such things, then so be it. You see, I believe that God expects us to do such things i.e. Jude 3, 2 Timothy 4:2-4. That makes such action "authorized," right?
It's interesting how you have drawn so many conclusions about what I might be thinking from a small tiny sentence that I wrote.:help:

So...let me clarify. I was just playing along with the original intent of the thread. That's all. No evil motive. No words or thoughts about what anyone else said on thread. Just having fun.

Is that unauthorized also?:)
 
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