"It is good for a man not to touch a woman." How far does this go?

[Itagaki]

It seems almost anything is a sin, depending upon who you ask. That's so stupid. If you asked ten Christians what is sin, and what isn't, you'd get eleven answers.

Some say it's a sin to hold hands, others to hug, others to fantasize, others say that is all ok, but not sex, others say anything goes. What a mess.

 

[Angelfrog]

How about looking to Jesus for a bit of a clue?
If Christianity is somehow so rule- bound that males and females shouldn't even touch (and I mean the literal sense of the word, not as a euphemism for sexual contact), then Jesus would be in for a ticking off from Paul, wouldn't he?

What about incidents like Mary anointing his feet?

How about the woman who touched his robe to be healed? (Hey, we could make a whole new rule there! Silly, I know- but I bet someone in the world would turn that passage into 'proof' that unwed men and women can only touch through cloth!)

How about the crippled woman that Jesus healed by putting his hands on her?

If it's sinful for a man to even touch a woman, then Jesus just blew that whole sinless saviour thing didn't he?

If touching in such a simple way is causing you to sin- then don't do it. But that's purely a personal thing.

To say that it's wrong for a man to touch a woman- as in make any physical contact- well, no offence but I'll take what Jesus did over any misconstrued verse any day.

 

[looking4answers89]

The short answer, is it means to simply have sex. There is no such thing as sex before marriage. Sex is marriage in the eyes of God.

I don't know where you think that sex is marriage. That is so absurd. Then what about prostitutes, or rape victims? You might want to get the facts straight, because that's a really big leap you've made.

Fornication IS sex before marriage. God made marriage, He binds two people together in Him first, before physical consummation. Even Jewish culture knew this with "kiddushin" and "nissu'in", which are the 2 stages OF marriage. The father of the soon-to-be-bride asks a suitor for his daughter's hand in marriage. This is "kiddushin". The suitor can reject or accept (not a sin), and then if he accepts, he has a year until "nissu'in", which is when they are allowed to consummate the marriage. But technically, "kiddushin" is marriage, but without consummation. They took consummation very seriously, as well as the formality of getting married (living together, the man supporting the woman with his job, etc) as I think God would, too. Sex is not just sex, not simply sex, NEVER. The world knows that.

 

[Albion]

So, I am currently in a relationship. She is 22, I am 23. We have never kissed or held hands, and we plan on getting married someday. That is in the future, nowhere near now.

We both do not date to just "date", and we both have made it clear that we want to be with each other. Our relationship is amazing, with God as the focus. We read our Bible's daily, pray together, and we go doorknocking and soulwinning together. God is #1 in both of our lives.

My question, however, stems from this verse:

"Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: it is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let ever man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband." 1 Corinthians 7:1-2

Paul tells the church in Corinth that it's GOOD for a man NOT to touch a woman. But what does this mean? Is this a baseline, blanket statement regarding any physical contact whatsoever?

No, it means that if one is able to devote himself more fully to God by avoiding romance, sex, and family, it's good to do that. But as is also evident from that and the verse where Paul says that it is better to marry than to burn, this is not a command or even something being strongly urged. It was understood that this is something exceptional.

If this is so; have you ever shaken hands with a pastors wife? Every helped a woman not fall by bracing her back? Ever given your mother a hug? I mean, if the verse means a man can NOT touch a woman EVER, isn't that kind of absurd? Why is that a sin?

It doesn't mean that. As with other passages in scripture, physical sex is described in more polite or elusive terms in the Bible than most people would do today.

If it does NOT mean ALL contact then, where is the line drawn? Me and my girlfriend hug. We do not hold hands, we do not kiss (we plan on kissing for the first time at our wedding day) and we honestly have ZERO conviction regarding our hugs. They aren't 10 minute hugs, but they are embracing hugs. It's not a side hug. But my question is, why would that be a sin?

It's not.

We have never done anything remotely sexual. We have chose to abstain from that from the beginning of our relationship. We think holding hands is a little too "intimate" for two people who are not married to do, and I think that's fine. Kissing as well. But the Bible says "It is good for a man not to touch a woman."

Where is the line drawn? What is Paul saying?

That's hard to answer absolutely, although I've heard many preachers and teacher try. Let's just say that you haven't come close to the line.

 

[BFine]

Does anyone know what the word "touch" is in original greek and what it means? Because people take this out of context and I want proof that Paul is not saying you can never TOUCH a woman.

*1 Corinthians 7:1--
The word for "touch" Paul used is:γυναικὸς μὴ ἅπτεσθαι pertains to: sexual
intercourse...to lie with carnally, cling to or touch in an intimate way that leads
someone astray(seducing/ seductive touching-- for example.)

From my studies the Corinthians were forbidding marriage, criticizing those
who were married, telling them not to have sex (even if they were married),
pressing married people to divorce-- abstinence was taken to the extreme, Apostle Paul sent instructions to correct the Corinthian's extremism...he also
says there are times when it's best to remain as he is (celibate) however, if
you can't it's best to marry.
Apostle Paul found it best in his situation to remain celibate
(his call and duty, Paul took seriously and devoted himself wholly to
being in the Lord's Service)-- he was often under heavy persecution and
faced many hard trials/tribulations while he was ministering in various places.


For example: those who were married:
1 Corinthians 7:5
"Do not deprive each other except perhaps by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer.
Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your
lack of self-control."

 

[iambren]

"good for a man not to touch a woman"

1 This is a euphemism for man having sex with a woman.


2 Paul is quoting this phrase from the letter that the Corinthians sent to HIM.

(Some at Corinth had the idea that sex outside marriage and INSIDE the
marriage was a more holy state before God.)

3 He spends the next six verses correcting that error.

 

[parsley]

*1 Corinthians 7:1--
The word for "touch" Paul used is:γυναικὸς μὴ ἅπτεσθαι pertains to: sexual
intercourse...to lie with carnally, cling to or touch in an intimate way that leads
someone astray(seducing/ seductive touching-- for example.)

If so, it seems that was not even a euphemism -- that it was the translators who chose to make the language less graphic.

The Greek also shows a more permanent implication -- adhering to someone.

NAS – Now concerning the things about which you wrote, it is good for a man not to touch a woman.
WH – περι δε ων εγραψατε (5656) καλον ανθρωπω γυναικος μη απτεσθαι (5733)


581
Thayer's Definition

1. to fasten one's self to, adhere to, cling to
   1. to touch
   2. of carnal intercourse with a women or cohabitation
   3. of levitical practice of having no fellowship with heathen practices. Things not to be touched appear to be both women and certain kinds of food, so celibacy and abstinence of certain kinds of food and drink are recommended.
   4. to touch, assail anyone

Strong's Definition

Reflexive of G681; properly to attach oneself to, that is, to touch (in many implied relations): - touch.

This sounds more like he is saying that it can be good when a man chooses not to commit his life too closely with another person.

 

[parsley]

Also "good" καλον does not imply a mandate.

Thayer's Definition

1. beautiful, handsome, excellent, eminent, choice, surpassing, precious, useful, suitable, commendable, admirable
   1. beautiful to look at, shapely, magnificent
   2. good, excellent in its nature and characteristics, and therefore well adapted to its ends
      1. genuine, approved
      2. precious
      3. joined to names of men designated by their office, competent, able, such as one ought to be
      4. praiseworthy, noble
   3. beautiful by reason of purity of heart and life, and hence praiseworthy
      1. morally good, noble
   4. honourable, conferring honour
   5. affecting the mind agreeably, comforting and confirming

 

[SaintJoeNow]

So, I am currently in a relationship. She is 22, I am 23. We have never kissed or held hands, and we plan on getting married someday. That is in the future, nowhere near now.

We both do not date to just "date", and we both have made it clear that we want to be with each other. Our relationship is amazing, with God as the focus. We read our Bible's daily, pray together, and we go doorknocking and soulwinning together. God is #1 in both of our lives.

My question, however, stems from this verse:

"Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: it is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let ever man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband." 1 Corinthians 7:1-2

Paul tells the church in Corinth that it's GOOD for a man NOT to touch a woman. But what does this mean? Is this a baseline, blanket statement regarding any physical contact whatsoever?

If this is so; have you ever shaken hands with a pastors wife? Every helped a woman not fall by bracing her back? Ever given your mother a hug? I mean, if the verse means a man can NOT touch a woman EVER, isn't that kind of absurd? Why is that a sin?

If it does NOT mean ALL contact then, where is the line drawn? Me and my girlfriend hug. We do not hold hands, we do not kiss (we plan on kissing for the first time at our wedding day) and we honestly have ZERO conviction regarding our hugs. They aren't 10 minute hugs, but they are embracing hugs. It's not a side hug. But my question is, why would that be a sin?

We have never done anything remotely sexual. We have chose to abstain from that from the beginning of our relationship. We think holding hands is a little too "intimate" for two people who are not married to do, and I think that's fine. Kissing as well. But the Bible says "It is good for a man not to touch a woman."

Where is the line drawn? What is Paul saying?

The line is drawn at holiness. If you and her are both sure you are doing nothing wrong in embracing, what good would it do for anybody to say you are doing wrong? If things heat up, you'd best stop the hugging.
You would have to both agree to stop it until after marriage, and who is leader enough for you and her both to respect if they were to say something like "abstain from all appearance of evil"?

I hope you have a wonderful marriage. My pastor would advise the you stop the hugging until after marriage and I would have to agree with him...but I'm not your pastor, my pastor is not your pastor....and I honestly hope you have a wonderful marriage and hope all the best for you.

 

[Messy]

The pastor I had said it depends on the couple. He and his wife couldn't even just hold hands without getting turned on, so they didn't.

 

[bottledwater]

So, I am currently in a relationship. She is 22, I am 23. We have never kissed or held hands, and we plan on getting married someday. That is in the future, nowhere near now.

We both do not date to just "date", and we both have made it clear that we want to be with each other. Our relationship is amazing, with God as the focus. We read our Bible's daily, pray together, and we go doorknocking and soulwinning together. God is #1 in both of our lives.

My question, however, stems from this verse:

"Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: it is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let ever man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband." 1 Corinthians 7:1-2

Paul tells the church in Corinth that it's GOOD for a man NOT to touch a woman. But what does this mean? Is this a baseline, blanket statement regarding any physical contact whatsoever?

If this is so; have you ever shaken hands with a pastors wife? Every helped a woman not fall by bracing her back? Ever given your mother a hug? I mean, if the verse means a man can NOT touch a woman EVER, isn't that kind of absurd? Why is that a sin?

If it does NOT mean ALL contact then, where is the line drawn? Me and my girlfriend hug. We do not hold hands, we do not kiss (we plan on kissing for the first time at our wedding day) and we honestly have ZERO conviction regarding our hugs. They aren't 10 minute hugs, but they are embracing hugs. It's not a side hug. But my question is, why would that be a sin?

We have never done anything remotely sexual. We have chose to abstain from that from the beginning of our relationship. We think holding hands is a little too "intimate" for two people who are not married to do, and I think that's fine. Kissing as well. But the Bible says "It is good for a man not to touch a woman."

Where is the line drawn? What is Paul saying?

What I get from scripture is that we are to never allow ourself or put another in a position where we begin to feel a desire to go further.
it sounds to me like you both have it all worked out, it is working for you.
I couldn't even begin to fathom why anyone would want to take that to the next level, until you both commit to one another in marriage. So don't.
God bless you both brother. I love you both and look forward to one day rejoicing with you at the wedding feast of the Lamb of God, Whom not unlike yourself also waits patiently for His bride.

 

[znr]

Chris is now happily married and hasn't logged in to cf for a year.

 

[bottledwater]

Chris is now happily married and hasn't logged in to cf for a year.

Oh.. So my advice worked then. lol. lol.

 

[bottledwater]

Chris is now happily married and hasn't logged in to cf for a year.

Did he marry her?

 

[znr]

Yep.

Did he marry her?

 

[bottledwater]

Yep.

Very nice.. thanx Zeener