BrotherJJ

Well-Known Member
Jul 23, 2019
1,120
424
North America
✟166,813.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace

Each Capitalized name in Isa 9:6 is a TITLE. Each title represents a different attribute of the Son, that shall be given.

Christ is God our Creator Jn 1:3 & 10, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6. Christ holds every TITLE mentioned above.

1 Tim 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Theophany definition: a visible manifestation to humankind of God.
 

Dave L

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jun 28, 2018
15,549
5,876
USA
✟580,140.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace

Each Capitalized name in Isa 9:6 is a TITLE. Each title represents a different attribute of the Son, that shall be given.

Christ is God our Creator Jn 1:3 & 10, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6. Christ holds every TITLE mentioned above.

1 Tim 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Theophany definition: a visible manifestation to humankind of God.
You need to realize the Trinity is in Christ the man.
 
Upvote 0

BrotherJJ

Well-Known Member
Jul 23, 2019
1,120
424
North America
✟166,813.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
You need to realize the Trinity is in Christ the man.

Hello,
I don't understand you're reply. I posted 1 OT scripture that made no reference to Trinity. Isa 9:6 speaks of a promised Son to come.

I gave verses that proclaim the Son as creator. And placed a NT verse I believe parallels each. So???
 
  • Agree
Reactions: 1 person
Upvote 0

Dave L

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jun 28, 2018
15,549
5,876
USA
✟580,140.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Hello,
I don't understand you're reply. I posted 1 OT scripture that made no reference to Trinity. Isa 9:6 speaks of a promised Son to come.

I gave verses that proclaim the Son as creator. And placed a NT verse I believe parallels each. So???
But my answer explains why Isaiah calls the Son the Father. You need this to refute the Oneness heresy.
 
Upvote 0

BrotherJJ

Well-Known Member
Jul 23, 2019
1,120
424
North America
✟166,813.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
But my answer explains why Isaiah calls the Son the Father. You need this to refute the Oneness heresy.

As to your answer, I asked you no Isa question. I promoted no Oneness doctrine.

Isa 9:6 (God breathed scripture) calls the Son, the everlasting Father. It's one of many TITLE'S attributed to the Son as the post points out.

I gave scripture support that Christ is Creator & Jesus was God in the flesh.

The thread post focus was Isa 9:6. Perhaps you could start a discussion thread on Trinity. JJ
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Mr. M

Well-Known Member
Mar 9, 2020
8,136
3,213
Prescott, Az
✟38,803.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
Theophany definition: a visible manifestation to humankind of God.
The Father Revealed

John 14:

7 If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him
and have seen Him.

8 Philip said to Him, Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.

9 Jesus said to him, Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip?
He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?

10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak
to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works.

11 Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, or else believe Me for the sake of
the works themselves.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: BrotherJJ
Upvote 0

BrotherJJ

Well-Known Member
Jul 23, 2019
1,120
424
North America
✟166,813.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
The Father Revealed

John 14:

7 If you had known Me, you would have known My Father also; and from now on you know Him
and have seen Him.

8 Philip said to Him, Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.

9 Jesus said to him, Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip?
He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?

10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak
to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works.

11 Believe Me that I am in the Father and the Father in Me, or else believe Me for the sake of
the works themselves.

I agree with your reply. Having said that, find a few posts I've placed here & on other forums that may help clarify my personal beliefs regarding the Godhead:

Feb 22,2019
Parsing Oneness & Co-Equal

Aug 15, 2019
Parsing Deuteronomy 6:4 & Some questions on the oneness co-eaqual doctrine

Aug 5, 2020
Manifestations/persons difference

Mar 1, 2020
Oneness or trinity, Is Jesus God or man?

Apr 25, 2020
Three Gods or one? Explain the Trinity.
 
  • Friendly
Reactions: Mr. M
Upvote 0

Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Dec 14, 2020
3,833
328
66
Georgia
✟125,375.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
But my answer explains why Isaiah calls the Son the Father. You need this to refute the Oneness heresy.
But the Son isnt the Father. I believe the appellation " the everlasting father" refers to Him having been given a spiritual seed as in Isa 53:10

Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him;
he hath put him to grief:
when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin,
he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days,

So the Son is a Father in that respect, and of course in His Deity He is God, sharing the One Divine Essence of the Godhead with the Father and Holy Ghost !
 
Upvote 0

Dave L

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jun 28, 2018
15,549
5,876
USA
✟580,140.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
But the Son isnt the Father. I believe the appellation " the everlasting father" refers to Him having been given a spiritual seed as in Isa 53:10

Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him;
he hath put him to grief:
when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin,
he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days,

So the Son is a Father in that respect, and of course in His Deity He is God, sharing the One Divine Essence of the Godhead with the Father and Holy Ghost !
Jesus the man had the Trinity in place of a human spirit as we have. He IS the triune Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
“For in Him the whole fullness of Deity (the Godhead) continues to dwell in bodily form [giving complete expression of the divine nature].” Colossians 2:9 (AMP)
 
Upvote 0

Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Dec 14, 2020
3,833
328
66
Georgia
✟125,375.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Jesus the man had the Trinity in place of a human spirit as we have. He IS the triune Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
“For in Him the whole fullness of Deity (the Godhead) continues to dwell in bodily form [giving complete expression of the divine nature].” Colossians 2:9 (AMP)
So do you believe Jesus is His Father ?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Daniel Marsh

Well-Known Member
Jun 28, 2015
9,749
2,615
Livingston County, MI, US
✟199,553.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
"
The everlasting Father - The Chaldee renders this expression, ‹The man abiding forever.‘ The Vulgate, ‹The Father of the future age.‘ Lowth, ‹The Father of the everlasting age.‘ Literally, it is the Father of eternity, עד אבי 'ĕby ‛ad The word rendered “everlasting,” עד ‛ad properly denotes “eternity,” and is used to express “forever;” see Psalm 9:6, Psalm 9:19; Psalm 19:10. It is often used in connection with עולם ‛ôlâm thus, עולם ועד vā‛ed ‛ôlâm “forever and ever;” Psalm 10:16; Psalm 21:5; Psalm 45:7. The Hebrews used the term father in a great variety of senses - as a literal father, a grandfather, an ancestor, a ruler, an instructor. The phrase may either mean the same as the Eternal Father, and the sense will be, that the Messiah will not, as must be the ease with an earthly king, however excellent, leave his people destitute after a short reign, but will rule over them and bless them forever (Hengstenberg); or it may be used in accordance with a custom usual in Hebrew and in Arabic, where he who possesses a thing is called the father of it.

Thus, the father of strength means strong; the father of knowledge, intelligent; the father of glory, glorious; the father of goodness, good; the father of peace, peaceful. According to this, the meaning of the phrase, the Father of eternity, is properly eternal. The application of the word here is derived from this usage. The term Father is not applied to the Messiah here with any reference to the distinction in the divine nature, for that word is uniformly, in the Scriptures, applied to the first, not to the second person of the Trinity. But it is used in reference to durations, as a Hebraism involving high poetic beauty. lie is not merely represented as everlasting, but he is introduced, by a strong figure, as even the Father of eternity. as if even everlasting duration owed itself to his paternity. There could not be a more emphatic declaration of strict and proper eternity. It may be added, that this attribute is often applied to the Messiah in the New Testament; John 8:58; Colossians 1:17; Revelation 1:11, Revelation 1:17-18; Hebrews 1:10-11; John 1:1-2." Isaiah 9:6 - Verse-by-Verse Bible Commentary - StudyLight.org there is more at this link worth reading.

"אֲבִיעַד (aviad): phrase consisting of the noun אֲבִי in the construct state, meaning "father of," and עַד, meaning "eternity." Altogether, literally meaning "father of eternity," but understood as "eternal father." (cp. Hab. 3:6: , i.e., "eternal mountains"" In Isaiah 9:6, why is "Eternal Father" the preferred translation rather than the more literal "Father of Eternity"?

"“Everlasting Father” literally means “the father of eternity.”1 It was a Hebrew and Arabic custom to call “he who possesses a thing … the father of it.”2 For Jesus to be the father of eternity means that He is eternal. "
The Isaiah 9:6 Child: Everlasting Father | Lighthouse Bible Studies

BibleGateway - Keyword Search: "Father of"

Hebrew Names for God - HaAv, the Father

J.B. Rotherham Emphasized Bible
For, A Child, hath been born to us, A Son, hath been given to us, And the dominion is upon his shoulder, - And his Name hath been called Wonderful Counsellor, Mighty GOD, Father of Futurity, Prince of Prosperity.

Young's Literal Translation
For a Child hath been born to us, A Son hath been given to us, And the princely power is on his shoulder, And He doth call his name Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, Father of Eternity, Prince of Peace.

The Septuagint version is, "the Father of the world to come"
https://www.biblicalstudies.org.uk/pdf/jbl/1881_169.pdf
 
Upvote 0