Is Showing Your Stomach a Sin? Inappropriate to Show Belly Button?

[LadyLamond]

I don't see a problem with the belly button showing, cause If I remember right, when I was a kid we had shirts that kind of did that also. I think though when it is put with pants, shorts or skirts that come off the hips is when it causes a problem. I personally don't have a problem with my daughter showing her belly button, but she isn't allowed to wear any pants that are off the waist line.

 

[New_Wineskin]

Perhaps the answer, then, is that it is not okay to wear a bikini at all. The Scriptures say to dress modestly. This means at all times without giving any exceptions (swimming included). I also don't think that men should be walking around without their shirts on - as this is immodest.

If that was the answer , it would not have already progressed to this stage . Yet , it has and now , all of a sudden , people think that it is an issue because of a "belly button" .

The Scriptures also say to put to death those who break the Sabbath . I don't see anyone obeying that command showing the importantance they place on obedience to the Scriptures ?

Anyway , "modesty" has changed a lot . People look at the Amish ( even Christians ) and think that they go over the top on the dresscode . Yet , they dress pretty much the same way that all people dressed a couple of hundred years ago . And , proposing to get rid of the bikini for women would mean for men to wear what *they* used to wear for swimming years ago as well . I doubt that you would be surprised with the reaction that you would get if you attempted to tell men who work in the hot sun to wear several layers of clothing for modesty sake .

How far back in history should we go for modest clothing ?

 

[ONE WHO REMAINS]

People do dress to impress, and there is nothing wrong with some one trying to attract some one else. You cant walk down the street and see a guy/girl and know that they have a great personallity and that they love the lord. The first thing you noticed in your spouse was there attractive looks. But this CAN be taken to far, as to show to much. But no its not wrong. What about when your at a swimming pool, you see guys stomachs, and girls.

 

[Carrye]

You cant walk down the street and see a guy/girl and know that they have a great personallity and that they love the lord.

You can't? Maybe you can't see their soul, but that's about all you can't see on many people lately. Who we are is reflected in how we act, what we say, and yes, even how we dress. Should we all be wearing shirts up to our necks and down to our knees? No. But should we be dressing as though we're respecting ourselves? Yes.

It's all about modesty.

Has anyone read A Return to Modesty by Wendy Schalit? I highly recommend it, if you haven't. http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/results.asp?WRD=A+Return+to+Modesty&userid=mHu1Dn1vVV&cds2Pid=946

 

[aggie03]

If that was the answer , it would not have already progressed to this stage.

If this logic were true, then no couples would live together outside of wedlock, there would be no premarital sex, and abortion would never occur. The simple fact that we ought not to do something in no way means that society will not cross the boundaries set by God and make sin the norm.

Yet , it has and now , all of a sudden , people think that it is an issue because of a "belly button" .

No, I wouldn't say that all of the world's troubles are spawned from one woman walking down the street with an immodest shirt. Cain slew Able and they were both clothed modestly. What I would say, though, is that a Christian ought to dress the way that God wants them to dress: modestly. This means no belly buttons showing on men or women

The Scriptures also say to put to death those who break the Sabbath . I don't see anyone obeying that command showing the importantance they place on obedience to the Scriptures ?

I don't agree with you completely here. I can't find any place where it says to kill a man for breaking the Sabbath. What I do find is the following:

Num 15:30-36 ASV

But the soul that doeth aught with a high hand, whether he be home-born or a sojourner, the same blasphemeth Jehovah; and that soul shall be cut off from among his people. (31) Because he hath despised the word of Jehovah, and hath broken his commandment, that soul shall utterly be cut off; his iniquity shall be upon him. (32) And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering sticks upon the sabbath day. (33) And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation. (34) And they put him in ward, because it had not been declared what should be done to him. (35) And Jehovah said unto Moses, The man shall surely be put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp. (36) And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him to death with stones; as Jehovah commanded Moses.

What I see here is not God saying that a man should be killed for violating the Sabbath, but rather for transgressing the Lord's commandments "with a high hand"; that is, he understood and knew his actions to be wrong, but did them in a manner that was spiteful to the Lord. This was the transgression that was deserving of death.

However, this really has no bearing on our conversation because Christians are not bound by the Old Covenant (Hebrews 8:13). Rather we have a New Covenant which we are bound by, one that distinctly demands modesty (1 Timothy 2:9, for example).

Anyway , "modesty" has changed a lot.

Mal 3:6 ASV

For I, Jehovah, change not; therefore ye, O sons of Jacob, are not consumed.

God does not change. This is speaking to the very nature of God. If there are things that are an abomination to God, any things that are sins to God, those things that offend the very nature of who God is, then those things will always offend God because He does not change.

This hearkens all the way back to the garden. When God saw the way that Adam and Eve had dressed themselves, He gave them a different set of clothes. The clothes that God gave to them were not loincoverings as they had made, but the very Hebrew word means something that covers the torso all the way down to about the knees - almost like a tunic with shorts to the knees. (Genesis 3:21)

This was how God clothed them. This is the bare minimum that I can accept as being modest because this is the way that God clothed His creation.

While the definition that society may give to modesty changes, what God considers to be modest will never change, because He does not change.

How far back in history should we go for modest clothing ?

How about back to the beginning

 

[BInC]

As far as the whole "how far back should we go," I don't think that is really the question we should be asking. The question is "what causes my brother to stumble?" The reason imodesty is wrong is because it distracts other from God, putting their attention on you. "Dress for success" is a good idea, but not in the way some people take it to mean. You can look good without tempting the oposite sex. The girls I find the most attractive are the ones that can dress modestly and still look good. That really impresses me. Also, if the first thing you noticed about you spouse was good looks, I'm sorry. Before too long, those will be gone. Believe it or not, I do my best to decide what girl I might like without considering ho good she looks. If I do pay any attention at all to hw she looks, it is this: 1. Is she showing too much? If she is, that is a definite turn off. My opinion of girls that dress to sexually attract people is very low. In my opinion, if she feels that she needs to do that then her personality isn't worth me getting to know her. 2. Does she take good care of her body? She can be ugly as a dog, but if she is nicely groomed with a smile on her face that is cool with me. After I check through those two things, I am satisfied with her physical side. I believe firmly that any girl that needs to dress like that to attract me must not have anything else to attract me with, which means no personality and no great realtionship with God.

Also, it seems like some of you believe that it is ok to dress like that if you aren't trying to show off. I don't mean to sound judgemental, but try being a guy for a day. Whether a girl thinks she is attractive or not, she looks the same to a guy. Whether she wants it or not, the guy is tempted and may stumble in his faith.

For modesty with guys in thier swimsuits, I agree with that too. I have never been a particularly attractive guy, but if I found that I was distracting a girl I would change my dressing habits. And yes, I would be willing to wear extra clothes while I was working in the heat if I believed it would help a girl not to stumble in her faith.

It isn't about whether you can see the belly button or not, or about how low the shirt is cut. Even fully-covering clothes can be distracting if they are especially tight. Male or female, it is about taking the focus off of God and on to yourself.

 

[happyinhisgrace]

I have met girls who are Christian but they also wear clothes that reveal their stomach and belly button. It feels kinda too revealing to me.
In this matter, I am not as much asking what Bible says, but what do you think is the right way from what you read in Bible.

If a girl looks my me, she should definitely NOT show her belly. I am twice the woman I used to be. (had to throw some humor in there)

 

[adamdavid]

First of all, I have to say that BInC did a very good job, and I share his oppinion on many levels... I will go on to say that the physical feature I find most attractive about females is their eyes (windows to the soul... they reveal alot more about the girl than her clothes do...) Good luck on covering that one up... even the most 'ultra-modest' Arab societies allow their women to reveal their eyes... that may be the only part allowed, but it is allowed... To me, a belly is a belly... there are things that should not be seen, and a belly isn't one of them...

And then we bring God into it... Honestly, do you people really think God cares a bit if he sees your belly? Come on people, he created it... I don't think God notices what we wear one bit... He could if he wanted to, but I really dont think he cares... He looks straight to the heart, and He knows if the goal is to be a temptress or not... The belly isn't the bad thing, its man's perverse mind thats the bad thing...

That being said, Girls, if you know its going to cause things that shouldn't be going on to go on in the minds of any guys you are going to be around that day, its simple: go to your closet and pick something else out... If your going to hang out with friends, all of whom you know well enough to know that it won't bother them, then go for it, but if you think it might be helpin the devil out, just dont let him use you like that...

Its all a matter of who your 'audience' (horrible word to use here, but I couldn't think of another one at the moment...) is... use your common sense...

AdamDavid

 

[New_Wineskin]

What I would say, though, is that a Christian ought to dress ...

I wrote some and decided to erase it since there is no reason to get into a quarrel over this . I even provided passages that you wrote that you couldn't find . But , that doesn't matter . If you think that you can force all Christians to dress your way , that is fine with me .

 

[aggie03]

I wrote some and decided to erase it since there is no reason to get into a quarrel over this . I even provided passages that you wrote that you couldn't find . But , that doesn't matter . If you think that you can force all Christians to dress your way , that is fine with me .

A quarrel, no, but a discussion is always a good thing

I would like for you to post those verses, but the point that I must impress upon you is that a Christian is no longer bound to follow the Old Covenant, otherwise you would have to go to worship on Saturday.

 

[Carrye]

But is modesty just for Christians? I hope not.

 

[aggie03]

No, I don't believe that it is. If we continue to look back to Adam and Eve, they were not Christians. God dressed them modestly. Therefore, I would believe that this is something that God expects and wants from everyone.

 

[Carrye]

I agree. It is a human virtue, not a particularly Christian one.

 

[Ave Maria]

I don't really see a problem with a girl showing her belly. However, they just need to be careful that they don't show too much skin and wear their pants or shorts ultra-low or something. I think it's best to avoid showing extra skin but it's not a sin if you do.

 

[adamdavid]

No, I don't believe that it is. If we continue to look back to Adam and Eve, they were not Christians. God dressed them modestly. Therefore, I would believe that this is something that God expects and wants from everyone.

Umm... I could be wrong, but it seems to me like God didn't clothe them in the beginning... didn't they get embarressed when they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil because they suddenly realized they were naked, and then they went and made clothes for themselves out of leaves? Thats how I remember the story, and I don't think that even the fig-leave clothes are probably very appropriate (I can see it now... rub too close to someone, get your stems tangled, try to walk away from eachother, and end up both people completely naked with a big pile of leaves in between them... how horribly embarrassing... ), much less the nudity they were created in... if we were all sinless, no prob, but we ain't, so thats not so good of an idea...

 

[happyinhisgrace]

That being said, Girls, if you know its going to cause things that shouldn't be going on to go on in the minds of any guys you are going to be around that day, its simple: go to your closet and pick something else out... If your going to hang out with friends, all of whom you know well enough to know that it won't bother them, then go for it, but if you think it might be helpin the devil out, just dont let him use you like that...

Its all a matter of who your 'audience' (horrible word to use here, but I couldn't think of another one at the moment...) is... use your common sense...

AdamDavid

Since when did a woman even have to do anything to cause things that shouldn't be going on in a man's mind to go on? A woman could wear 10 layers of clothing that is very baggy and completely covers the body and a man would still find a way to think something about that woman's body that he shouldn't. As my husband says, "a woman doesn't even have to be around for thoughts like that to enter a guy's mind, just a cool breeze will do it".

 

[aggie03]

Umm... I could be wrong, but it seems to me like God didn't clothe them in the beginning... didn't they get embarressed when they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil because they suddenly realized they were naked, and then they went and made clothes for themselves out of leaves? Thats how I remember the story, and I don't think that even the fig-leave clothes are probably very appropriate (I can see it now... rub too close to someone, get your stems tangled, try to walk away from eachother, and end up both people completely naked with a big pile of leaves in between them... how horribly embarrassing... ), much less the nudity they were created in... if we were all sinless, no prob, but we ain't, so thats not so good of an idea...

Gen 3:21 ASV

And Jehovah God made for Adam and for his wife coats of skins, and clothed them.

 

[BInC]

First of all, I have to say that BInC did a very good job...

Whoohoo!

But seriously. The rest of what he said was right too. The problem isn't with what the girls show, it's how we percieve it. Unfortunately, a guy's perception can be pretty twisted, if it is the wrong guy. And I'd caution you, even someo f the guys that you might htink can be pretty strong might be shaken be the wrong thing at the wrong time.

Since when did a woman even have to do anything to cause things that shouldn't be going on in a man's mind to go on?

Well, the way I see it "cause" means to make it to happen. How can what a girl wears cause it? Guys are visually oriented. A guy sees somthing he likes but shouldn't. He thinks about. I agree completely, even when you dress modestly guys can still find ways to get excited, but it is a lot harder. Whith a bikini it is right there, but with a sweatshirt the guy is gonna have to put some effort into it.

 

[New_Wineskin]

A quarrel, no, but a discussion is always a good thing

I would like for you to post those verses, but the point that I must impress upon you is that a Christian is no longer bound to follow the Old Covenant, otherwise you would have to go to worship on Saturday.

Ok . I will post them when I get home . They are in Exodus 32 aqnd 35 . I will have to look them up again .


You wrote that the Scriptures said to do such and such . If one considers that the old writings are a part of the Scriptures , then one is picking and choosing which Scriptures are to be obeyed and should allow others the same opportunity to pick and choose as well . Of course , Paul wrote that , if any set of written laws were to be obeyed , that set of laws would be the Mosaic code . In fact , Paul would look like an occult leader by saying in one breath not to obey Moses but say that people should obey him instead . The writings called "the New Testament" show that the new covenant is not based on writings on stone or paper but on what the Lord places on the hearts of His people .

 

[New_Wineskin]

Ok . I will post them when I get home . They are in Exodus 32 aqnd 35 . I will have to look them up again .

Exodus 31 ( not 32 ) : (NIV)
14 " 'Observe the Sabbath, because it is holy to you. Anyone who desecrates it must be put to death; whoever does any work on that day must be cut off from his people. 15 For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD . Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death.

Exodus 35 : (NIV)
1 Moses assembled the whole Israelite community and said to them, "These are the things the LORD has commanded you to do: 2 For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day shall be your holy day, a Sabbath of rest to the LORD . Whoever does any work on it must be put to death. 3 Do not light a fire in any of your dwellings on the Sabbath day."