Is Sex Before Marriage Permissible?

[Floatingaxe]

Originally Posted by Floatingaxe
God is the Father of all prodigals...if they are of His house in the first place.

Christians do not tend to believe that God isn't their Father! That is precisely what we do believe!

holo: There are many children of God out on the street, living as homeless and alcoholics and junkies. Frighteningly many of them come from christian homes, and so many of them profess a profound love for Christ and faith in him, but they know they can't be in a christian setting. Because "christian" means something quite different than "child of God." Many of these people also believe the lie that they've sinned their way out of salvation. Because of attitudes like yours.

Even street people who love the Lord Jesus Christ can worship Him. Christian setting? What are you talking about? Church? Church is free! Salvation doesn't come through parentage, either.

Some people do fall away from God in sin, and it ahs nothing to do with MY attitude whatsoever! It's their own that matters.

Just because we are of the human race doesn't make us all "God's Children". Only those who are His own, through faith in Jesus Christ can bear that distinction.

Originally Posted by Floatingaxe
A child who continually disobeys and goes his own way is indeed wayward and God waits and watches for his return, but often we see that they don't come back. A Christian undergoes a rebirth, a heart "transplant", which changes them completely, but without solid teaching and discipling, any forward motion in Christ is short-lived and easily short-circuited by his own fleshly desires and by the world's influence and also by Satan's schemes to boot.

holo:Well, your teaching isn't very solid. Your teaching isn't Jesus and about the treasures of wisdom found in him. Your teaching is about compliance with moral rules. Your teaching is "touch not," "eat not," "handle not." It appears to be godly, but it's powerless.

Jesus teaching! "Follow me!" He says! When you refuse, you lose. That's solid enough for me. If you cannot obey, then there's evidence for you that there has not been any regeneration. One's regenerated heart longs to obey!

Originally Posted by Floatingaxe
Good teaching and good godly counsel will prevent that sort of waywardness in most cases.

holo: No, abiding in Christ will prevent waywardness. But young christian girls aren't taught to abide in Christ, but rather to abide in rules.

Every Christian, no matter what the age, needs to be discipled, and taught to abide in Christ.

 

[JacobHall86]

Is this really a question that needs to be addressed?

 

[LJSGM]

Is this really a question that needs to be addressed?

Do you know how many Christians are being permiscuous? I think the percentage is the same as the rest of the world. There also is this percentage, something like in the 90-something% of people have had sex with someone other then their spouse at some point in their lives. so, yes, it is a good subject to cover.

 

[Fireinfolding]

That's interesting.

It is

The interpretation you are attempting to use that Scripture for is in alignment with how Islamic Apologists use it.

I dont know any Islamic apologists, so thats an interesting coincidence

Context is extremely important.

You should study the whole chapter. In fact you should read chapter 7 and chapters 9, 10 and 11 as well.

What makes you think I havent? Me thinks you assume to much.

Romans 10:1-21 is created (showing the footsteps of the Holy Spirit) which are gathered together in the following verses as written by Pal

Paul starts in... Lev 18:5 ...

Then he turns to.... Duet 30:12-14

Next, right into... Isaiah 28:16

...immediately into... Joel 2:32

... he returns back into.... Isaiah 52:7

....He skips "up to".... Isaiah 53:1

.... Turns to.... Psalms 19:4

....reaches back into .....Duet 32:21

.....now and up to.... Isaiah 65:1-2


Just to make a "single point"... (in Romans) which is ONLY 21 verses long.

Now "10 of those 21 verses" came from 5 different books (not so bad right?) But they are NOT from the chapters of the same book and only TWICE are 2 verses ever taken at one time, the rest is Paul interjecting between them.

How is THAT for "in context"?

Can you find Paul's "sense of context"?

Peace

Fireinfolding

 

[Floatingaxe]

Originally Posted by Floatingaxe
The concern is that she hasn't had true repentance because she doesn't appear to have godly sorrow.

holo: Who are you to evaluate her repentance anyway?

Christians are called to "evaluate" all things. When we see those who are supposed to be brothers and sisters in Christ erring, we seek to bring them around to repentance. Now that is how we behave in the local Body, but it can also happen in a place like this...I did risk your disdain, but for her salvation, I figure it is worth it.

Originally Posted by Floatingaxe
She has not said anything about whether or not she is a born again Christian or if she has repented. She just has said she has no regret.

holo: OK. Picture all the sins you've ever committed. Now, have you felt "godly sorrow" for each and every one of those sins? Have you repented for each sin? Did you feel anything in particular about all those sins, and was that feeling a requirement for being righteous?

Or are you suggesting she does something you're not doing yourself?

Godly sorrow is a prerequisite for all repentance. Before a holy God, we have no option! He demands it, and we are helpless to refuse!

Originally Posted by Floatingaxe
2. No repentance, due to the hardness of heart that comes from being one with the world, either refusing to acknowledge sin, or living ignorant that fornication is a sin at all.

holo: What? She doesn't feel sorry for having a child out of wedlock, so it's reasonable to conclude that she's "one with the world"? I think that's even more rude than it's outlandish.

No one knows for sure about Miss Jeffsgirl. But from her posts, it can be assumed, unless she states positively otherwise, that she feels that she has done nothing wrong. When one is so hardened in heart as to not recognize sin, then we see these little girls, not long out of Barbie dolls, full of flights of fancy, living out a childish dream. It's a very spiritually risky place for this girl right now.

Any well-grounded adult, saved or unsaved, would have many concerns for her psychological welfare. I, and other Christians have an added concern which is more eternal, and more important---her spiritual health.

 

[Floatingaxe]

Waits with what? You mean you wait for marriage. Love doesn't wait for some man-made rule that you can't join yourself with the one you love unless you perform a ceremony first or comply with the local definition of "marriage".

A man and woman who love God and serve Him only, will love each other enough to respect God's will for the other. A man won't take what God hasn't given Him legal right to, and a woman won't either.

Self control is the fruit of the Spirit.

Stop peddling your lawlessness here.

 

[IamRedeemed]

I hear you brother! One would think not, but the Lord said that the day was going to come when some people would no longer endure sound doctrine, but instead because of their own lust filled desires, they would raise for themselves those that would preach to their itching ears.........

Well...this is that! (unfortunately)

2 Timothy 4:3-4
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Is this really a question that needs to be addressed?

 

[IamRedeemed]

What makes you think I havent? Me thinks you assume to much.

Umm.... the fact that you have the same understanding as Islamic Apologists who try to use that Scripture to discredit the Bible and the men of God?

The Scripture is talking about a wayward Judah, and the vanity of the Word of God, to them. Because they wouldn't hear it anyway. It isn't that the Scribes recorded falsely , so the pen wasn't lying. But men taught it falsely, thinking they know better than God.
Wise in their own eyes. And God will hold accountable those who lead any little ones astray.

 

[Floatingaxe]

What's a jezebel? Is Jeffsgirl a jezebel?

Anyone can have a jezebel spirit.

holo: Where did Jeffsgirl's "I decided to have a baby" translate to "I decided to have casual sex"?

No fifteen-year-old GIRL should be making such decisions. If they are, then there is something wrong in her life that compels her to it. She needs mature counsel.

 

[IamRedeemed]

Okay, let's try this again Holo. This time, do not chop up my sentences to make them say what you want to reply instead this time actually reply to what is being asked.

Here is my post again for your convenience.

No, you don't have to run anywhere to obtain mercy. You are already breathing and living in grace.
I see, so you say a sinner's prayer and then you never have a thing to repent for anything ever again? You can sin freely and be as wicked as you want, and never need to be cleansed and being conformed to the image of Christ is optional? You don't have to renew your mind, so that your thoughts are no longer carnal but rather spiritual? You don't have to submit to God, in order to resist the devil, so He will flee from you? You do not have to wear the armor of God, because you are not in a battle. It is just a free for all party and the devil is invited? Walk after the Spirit in Word, but in deed walk after the flesh?

My Bible doesn't say that at all, in fact it says do not sin any more, that we are no longer bondslaves to sin, but bondslaves to God, but if you do, you have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ. If we will confess our sins He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us of all unrigteousness.
It says that we are to make NO PROVISION for the flesh.

That means stop licensing your flesh. And do not present yourself before God as a heathen living with a whimsical attitude toward sin and spend your life serving God's enemy satan who brought sin,
so you won't be in danger of trampling the blood of Jesus underfoot and have need of redemption again. Because there remains no sacrifice for such a one.

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God."
Hebrews 10:26-31


We do right, because we love the Lord. The Scriptures are life to those that find them and health to all their flesh. Without the Scriptures, you cannot train your ears to hear the voice of the Lord, nor know Him or His ways.

Read Psalm 119 to see what I mean.

It's not about a "sinner's prayer" or some sort of magical line of words that we say. It's about believing.

I don't want to sin. Why should I sin? The question is all wrong, because it assumes that unless you're threatened with punishment, your natural reaction would be to sin wildly.

I can't be wicked. I'm born again. I'm righteous.

I have already been cleansed. And should I get som dust on my feet, the blood is cleansing me continually.

Well, it is up to us how much we focus on Christ. It's by looking on him that we are conformed to his image. A lot of christians will focus on all kinds of other stuff, like sin or tradition or meetings or heresies or the law etc etc. They shouldn't, but God's grace covers them still.

I don't renew my mind. Christ does

Yes I do.

Yes I do.

It is free for all, yes.

No.

No. Of course not.

Mine neither.

Mhm.

Yes, and we love him because he loved us first.

 

[IamRedeemed]

hmmm...."quoting a lot of Scripture......"

"......a verse here and a verse there."

Which one is it again that I am doing?

I see you quoting a lot of scripture to demonstrate what God thinks about this and that, that's all. But God's will isn't demonstrated by a verse here and a verse there. Rather, our understaning and use of those verses tend to say more about OUR views than God's.

 

[Gwenyfur]

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