Is Paul Yonggi Cho Word-Faith?

Tamara224 · May 18, 2009

Do our resident WoFers think he is?

Do non-WoFers think he is?

probinson · May 18, 2009

Not having any idea who he is, I Googled him, which led me to his bio and Wikipedia;

Welcome to Full Gospel Television

David Yonggi Cho - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He seems to have some WoF leanings, but I don't know that I would consider him WoF from what little I read.

Always in His Presence · May 18, 2009

probinson said:
Not having any idea who he is, I Googled him, which led me to his bio and Wikipedia;

Welcome to Full Gospel Television

David Yonggi Cho - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He seems to have some WoF leanings, but I don't know that I would consider him WoF from what little I read.

Dr. Cho is like a country unto himself. Having Quinten Edwards and Tommy Reid on staff in the past has given him ties with a number of movements through the years. Unless he has changed his position in the last ten years or so, his theology is more towards the kingdom camp (Pat Robertson - John Giminez - Tommy Barnett). He was a major voice in the Assemblies of God for quite a number of years.

The few times I heard him referred to in the Word of Faith circles, was, while respectful, not completely supportive.

But, anyone with 750,000 members in his church might just have something worth listening too!

BenAdam · May 18, 2009

I think in some ways he could be considered. But like Balance said, more like a country unto himself.

Tamara224 · May 18, 2009

Balance said:
But, anyone with 750,000 members in his church might just have something worth listening too!

Is this serious or sarcasm?

Always in His Presence · May 18, 2009

Tamara224 said:
Is this serious or sarcasm?

No, I'm quite serious - Dr. Cho has the largest church in the world. I actually heard him speak at Tommy Barnett's when the church was just over 350,000 people. They meet in a soccer stadium.

Beginning in the 1980s, Full Gospel Central Church decided to establish satellite churches throughout the city of Seoul and further afield, as it would not be able to keep on expanding indefinitely. Despite the expansion of the auditorium to seat 12,000 in 1983, seven Sunday services were insufficient to accommodate the entire membership. As exponential growth continued, reaching 700 000 by 1992, the need for satellite churches became more pressing. Despite the drain of members to the satellite churches, however, new recruits by the mother church - brought in through the vast cell network - have made up for the losses, and membership stood at 780,000 in 2003. The church was renamed Yoido Full Gospel Church in the 1990s. Its founder, Mr David Yonggi Cho, has retired as head pastor several times, but the church has run into immediate infighting among the remaining ministers, causing him to come out of retirement, most recently late in 2006. As of 2007, membership stands at 830,000, with seven Sunday services translated into 16 languages.

YouTube - Yoido Full Gospel Church http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoido_Full_Gospel_Church#cite_note-economist-0

Always in His Presence · May 18, 2009

I'm an old fart - I remember when he took the name Paul Yongi Cho -

I don't recall the reason for the change to David.

Tamara224 · May 18, 2009

Balance said:
No, I'm quite serious - Dr. Cho has the largest church in the world. I actually heard him speak at Tommy Barnett's when the church was just over 350,000 people. They meet in a soccer stadium.

I know he leads (arguably) the biggest church in the world. That's not what I was asking you.

I was wondering if you were serious that you believe the size of his church makes him "worth listening to".

Although, it appears you have answered that question as well, if indirectly.

IMHO, that's a terrible reason to give credence to a person's words or doctrine. There are a lot of itchy ears out there...

victoryword · May 18, 2009

Tamara224 said:
Do our resident WoFers think he is?

Do non-WoFers think he is?

It all depends on who you listen to. Hank Hanegraaf believes he is a Word-Faith teacher and very much worthy of his attack on WoF in his infamous CinC book. He is criticized primarily for his teachings on visualization.

On the other hand, some scholars in the Assemblies of God "defend" Dr. Cho against being WoF and make every attempt to disconnect him from Kenneth Hagin's "Phantom Organization" as one poster put it who shall remain nameless though his initials are "JimBeauX"

You can find more in an article titled "Yonggi Cho’s Theology of the Fullness of the Spirit: A Pentecostal Perspective" that was in the Asian Journal of Pentecostal Studies.

I have personally read several of his books and I would say much of his theology lines up with the WoF teachings, especially his views on divine healing and faith confession. But he appears to be more comfortable with Third Wavers (though he is very good friends with Marilyn Hickey). Nonetheless, I have always been blessed by his books.

I appreciate him most for the fact that my father-in-law was saved after reading his book, The Fourth Dimension.

Tamara224 · May 18, 2009

And is Marilyn Hickey Word-Faith, VW?

victoryword · May 18, 2009

Balance said:
I'm an old fart - I remember when he took the name Paul Yongi Cho -

I don't recall the reason for the change to David.

From what I recall when I read about this in either Ministries Today or Charisma possible 18 or so years ago (and I am coming completely from memory), the reason for the change was due to his praying for revival. God told Cho that He could not answer his prayer while there was still division between him and another church or denomination (can't recall which). His desire to reunite with another church or denomination caused much consternation between some of his family members who were pastoring/serving in churches under his leadership and this caused a family rift.

He changed his name from "Paul" to "David" in order to "die to the old self" and the family ties.

Those who know the story better or who might have the actual story in print can correct me on some of what I wrote but I think I got the basic facts straight.

victoryword · May 18, 2009

Tamara224 said:
And is Marilyn Hickey Word-Faith, VW?

Most would say so. She and her husband was influenced by Kenneth Hagin (though, contrary to popular belief, not all WoFers trace their roots to Hagin nor do all who were influenced by Hagin in some measure would consider themselves WoF).

Always in His Presence · May 18, 2009

Tamara224 said:
And is Marilyn Hickey Word-Faith, VW?

She certainly was at one point very much point. There was a time that she sat third row at Rhema during Winter Bible Seminar. Dad Hagin referred to her more than once as "my girl".

Not sure what happened but she broke all ties in the late 90's, emoving all references to the Word of Fairh from her website.

I don't think she thinks she is Word of Faith.

KingZzub · May 18, 2009

Changing the topic of conversation slightly: is Oral Roberts Word of Faith?

Always in His Presence · May 18, 2009

Tamara224 said:
I know he leads (arguably) the biggest church in the world. That's not what I was asking you.

I was wondering if you were serious that you believe the size of his church makes him "worth listening to".

Although, it appears you have answered that question as well, if indirectly.

IMHO, that's a terrible reason to give credence to a person's words or doctrine. There are a lot of itchy ears out there...

You will note that little word MIGHT in my sentence.

Saying someone MIGHT be worth listening to is, IMO, not lending credence to anything.

The man has preached the gospel all over the earth for almost 60 years. Anyone who has done that, IMO, is worth checking out.

A large following does not in itself validate a ministry.

It also does not invalidate it.

I've learned from a variety of ministers:
Kenneth Hagin
John MacArther
Billy Gram
David Jeremiah

I've learned from each of them. I've learned from your posts and insight.

It doesn't mean I completely agree or validate any of them. It just means they were worth (of value) listening to. Hope that clarifies my stance.

Leimeng · May 18, 2009

~ Cho Yonggi is a Christian. Are you? He believes the Word of God. Do you? TO the extent that you one believes in the Word of God (Bible), and to the extent that one confesses the Lordship of Jesus Christ, one is a Christian.
~ The desire for sects (cults?) to ascribe names to others for the purpose of belittling them or critisism is childish and needs to stop. The so called "Word of Faith" needs to be replaced by "Word of God" when referring to others. Baptists need to start referring to themselves as Christians. AoG and Vineyard need to refer to themselves and their Christian brothers and sisters as Christians. Christians need to learn to call each other Christian! There is no denominationalism in the Bible in a positive way.
~ Cho Yonggi has Yoido Christian Center on an island in downtown Seoul, the section of the town is called Yoido. When I was living in Korea, I knew Jehovah Witnesses who were afraid to go near that section of town because of the church facility.
~ It seems to be quite common for East Asians to change their western names from time to time for a large variety of reasons. Probably 50% of my associates and friends from East Asia have changed their western/Christian name at least once or twice. Several have asked me for suggestions. I knew one girl (from Taiwan/Free China) who even changed her Chinese name because she her family fortune teller told her that if she kept her name as it was, she would cheat on the guy she was getting married to...
~ I have yet to find a teacher I agree with 100% on everything. So take what you can from each one, compare it to the Word, and press on.
~ Continue to discuss amongst yourselves...

Peace,

Leimeng

Flatulo Ergo Sum ~~~

(***Insert Personal One Liner Here***)

Tamara224 · May 18, 2009

Leimeng said:
~ The desire for sects (cults?) to ascribe names to others for the purpose of belittling them or critisism is childish and needs to stop.

And ascribing bad motives to people who ask a simple question is very mature, right?

The so called "Word of Faith" needs to be replaced by "Word of God" when referring to others. Baptists need to start referring to themselves as Christians. AoG and Vineyard need to refer to themselves and their Christian brothers and sisters as Christians. Christians need to learn to call each other Christian! There is no denominationalism in the Bible in a positive way.

Please take this to another thread and don't hijack mine.

~ Cho Yonggi has Yoido Christian Center on an island in downtown Seoul, the section of the town is called Yoido. When I was living in Korea, I knew Jehovah Witnesses who were afraid to go near that section of town because of the church facility.

Interesting.

~ It seems to be quite common for East Asians to change their western names from time to time for a large variety of reasons. Probably 50% of my associates and friends from East Asia have changed their western/Christian name at least once or twice. Several have asked me for suggestions. I knew one girl (from Taiwan/Free China) who even changed her Chinese name because she her family fortune teller told her that if she kept her name as it was, she would cheat on the guy she was getting married to...

Very interesting.

~ I have yet to find a teacher I agree with 100% on everything. So take what you can from each one, compare it to the Word, and press on.

I agree.

JEBrady · May 18, 2009

Balance said:
Dr. Cho is like a country unto himself. Having Quinten Edwards and Tommy Reid on staff in the past has given him ties with a number of movements through the years. Unless he has changed his position in the last ten years or so, his theology is more towards the kingdom camp (Pat Robertson - John Giminez - Tommy Barnett). He was a major voice in the Assemblies of God for quite a number of years.

The few times I heard him referred to in the Word of Faith circles, was, while respectful, not completely supportive.

But, anyone with 750,000 members in his church might just have something worth listening too!

Whoa, I had no idea John Giminez had died. That's a blow. I lived in south Hampton Roads for more than 40 years. Rock Church was a major influence on the whole area.

victoryword · May 19, 2009

If a person has been able to reach a large number of people then I personally think they are worth listening to. We might learn from the Jehovah's Witnesses the effectiveness of door to door evangelism. Doesn't by any means say that I should accept their doctrine.

However, I have great love and respect for Dr. Cho and I know that he is worth listening to as far as church growth and some of his doctrine.

TasManOfGod · May 19, 2009

PYC is famous for the statement "I pray and I obey "
(Think of that said in an oriental accent )

Is Paul Yonggi Cho Word-Faith?

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