WinBySurrender
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The marriage bed is undefiled. Do you understand what that means? Stop making generalizations about "most Christians" that you can't back up with facts, please.
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Is masturbation a sin?
- Thread starter Lik3
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1. Yes, I know that the marriage bed is undefiled, and I fully understand what that means. I am not talking about the marriage bed. I am talking about the issue of sexual thoughts of individual married people and individual single people.
2. I say "most Christians" based on what most Christians that I meet say or write. You're telling me not to make generalizations about most Christians, and then you go and prove the point I was making by suggesting that only married people are allowed to think sexual thoughts. You seem to think that because the marriage bed is undefiled, that the sexual thoughts of a married person are pure as well. So the opposite must be true of the sexual thoughts of the single person, they are inherently impure. My point is that sexual thoughts that derive from a person's God given desire to marry and have sex with one's spouse are not dirty, whether the person having them is single or married. I don't believe it's even possible for God to give a human being a sexual nature that affects them psychologically, physically, and emotionally, and for them to avoid thinking about sex. (ie. When your stomach growls and you feel yourself getting dizzy from low blood sugar, how can you not think about eating food?) I really believe this is a part of human nature, not sinful nature.
I understand your point, I simply disagree with it. But I think I've shared all of the thoughts I'm going to share on this subject. But I look forward to reading other people's views. Peace.
2. I say "most Christians" based on what most Christians that I meet say or write. You're telling me not to make generalizations about most Christians, and then you go and prove the point I was making by suggesting that only married people are allowed to think sexual thoughts. You seem to think that because the marriage bed is undefiled, that the sexual thoughts of a married person are pure as well. So the opposite must be true of the sexual thoughts of the single person, they are inherently impure. My point is that sexual thoughts that derive from a person's God given desire to marry and have sex with one's spouse are not dirty, whether the person having them is single or married. I don't believe it's even possible for God to give a human being a sexual nature that affects them psychologically, physically, and emotionally, and for them to avoid thinking about sex. (ie. When your stomach growls and you feel yourself getting dizzy from low blood sugar, how can you not think about eating food?) I really believe this is a part of human nature, not sinful nature.
I understand your point, I simply disagree with it. But I think I've shared all of the thoughts I'm going to share on this subject. But I look forward to reading other people's views. Peace.
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U
UnamSanctam
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The problem isn't that it isn't procreative, but that it's sexuality outside of marriage, and (mentally) directed against someone who isn't your spouse.
To everyone else: (no offence Rhamiel, but I know what the RC position is on this
) Hmm...how about a married person "doing it" while thinking of his/her spouse?
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Are you kidding? Masturbation is AWESOME! The people that scare me are the ones that don't and go crazy. We have sexual urges and rather than sin with someone, release it yourself and go about your day. No big deal. Everybody does it, though we don't talk about it as often as we probably should.
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Jonathan95 said:
Lol are you serious! I know you're quoting someone else, but That person cant pass the buck like that!
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It really leaves an impure feeling to oneself afterwards. We are to be pure. I don't believe many do it out of faith either, but are uncertain about it, while doing it. Therefore it also becomes sin, because whatever is not of faith is sin (Rom 14:23).
It's really a trap. It opens up for sexually immoral thoughts and lust. We shouldn't be getting into willful temptations like that. "And lead (bring) us not into temptation...." (Matt 6:13).
Mark 14:37-39
37 And He came back and found them sleeping, and He said to Peter, Simon, are you asleep? Have you not the strength to keep awake and watch [with Me for] one hour?
38 Keep awake and watch and pray [constantly], that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.
39 He went away again and prayed, saying the same words.
1 Peter 2:11
Beloved, I implore you as aliens and strangers and exiles [in this world] to abstain from the sensual urges (the evil desires, the passions of the flesh, your lower nature) that wage war against the soul.
It certainly wages war against the soul!
2 Timothy 3:2
For people will be lovers of self and [utterly] self-centered, lovers of money and aroused by an inordinate [greedy] desire for wealth, proud and arrogant and contemptuous boasters. They will be abusive (blasphemous, scoffing), disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy and profane.
Masturbating, is a type of substance abuse. (The brain chemicals activated by arousal and [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] are a specific chemical substance that can become addictive. There is no recovery from substance without giving up "using.")
Masturbation makes us begin to live according to the dictates of the flesh and to become slaves to the "misdeeds of the body." Scripture warns us about this kind of activity, "For if you live according to the flesh (by giving in to its desires), you will die" and tells us how to stop, "but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live" (Romans 8:13).
In reality, masturbation is a high expression of loving self and of sexual self-idolatry. It is deceiving and enslaving. Let us see these truths from Scripture:
"Just as you used to offer the parts of your body in slavery to impurity and to ever-increasing wickedness, so now offer them in slavery to righteousness leading to holiness. When you were slaves to sin, you were free from the control of righteousness" (Romans 6:19-20).
This verse teaches that "offering leads to slavery." When we "offer the parts of our body" to sin we become a slave to sin. Masturbation only "relieves the pressure" temporarily. The pressure will soon be back and masturbation will need to occur again and again, and again. But if we offer the parts of our body for righteousness, we will become slaves of righteousness.
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That is blasphemous. That's carnal mind, Jesus didn't think like that. Also look at my post above.
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My question is, who is it hurting?
If it doesn't cause you to violate the two great commandments, then I say go for it.
That doesn't make sense. It's sin even if it doesn't break those two. Read my post(s) above.
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WilliamB said:My question is, who is it hurting?
If it doesn't cause you to violate the two great commandments, then I say go for it.
Agreed mate!
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Sure it does. What doesn't make since is trying to operate under Grace and the law at the same time. You can't operate under two covenants. Well, you can but that makes you lukewarm.
There are times where MB could be in violation. For instance, if you are denying your wife to MB instead, that's not loving one another as yourself. But, MB in and of itself, I can't see how it could be in violation.
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I consider breaking fellowship with God as failing to operate under the two great commandments. God is love, so when we stop loving one another, that's when we break fellowship with God.
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No. Sin is separation from God. It's as simple as that. What you believe isn't biblical.
Just because we are saved doesn't mean we can freely Sin. We can't go on deliberately and willingly sinning after once acquiring the knowledge of the Truth. (Heb 10:26).
A Christian's life is to be characterized by practicing righteousness, purity and (Hebrews 12:14)
Strive to live in peace with everybody and pursue that consecration and holiness without which no one will [ever] see the Lord.
Etc...
John 3:36
And he who believes in (has faith in, clings to, relies on) the Son has (now possesses) eternal life. But whoever disobeys (is unbelieving toward, refuses to trust in, disregards, is not subject to) the Son will never see (experience) life, but [instead] the wrath of God abides on him. [God's displeasure remains on him; His indignation hangs over him continually.]
1 Peter 2:16
[Live] as free people, [yet] without employing your freedom as a pretext for wickedness; but [live at all times] as servants of God.
Hebrews 10:26-30
26 For if we go on deliberately and willingly sinning after once acquiring the knowledge of the Truth, there is no longer any sacrifice left to atone for [our] sins [no further offering to which to look forward].
27 [There is nothing left for us then] but a kind of awful and fearful prospect and expectation of divine judgment and the fury of burning wrath and indignation which will consume those who put themselves in opposition [to God].(A)
28 Any person who has violated and [thus] rejected and set at naught the Law of Moses is put to death without pity or mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses.(B)
29 How much worse (sterner and heavier) punishment do you suppose he will be judged to deserve who has spurned and [thus] trampled underfoot the Son of God, and who has considered the covenant blood by which [/B]he was consecrated common and unhallowed, thus profaning it and insulting and outraging the [Holy] Spirit [Who imparts] grace (the unmerited favor and blessing of God)?(C)
30 For we know Him Who said, Vengeance is Mine [retribution and the meting out of full justice rest with Me]; I will repay [I will exact the compensation], says the Lord. And again, The Lord will judge and determine and solve and settle the cause and the cases of His people.
1 John 3:6-9
6 No one who abides in Him [who lives and remains [a]in communion with and in obedience to Him--deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] commits (practices) sin. No one who [habitually] sins has either seen or known Him [recognized, perceived, or understood Him, or has had an experiential acquaintance with Him].
7[a]Boys (lads), let no one deceive and lead you astray. He who practices righteousness [who is upright, conforming to the divine will in purpose, thought, and action, living a consistently conscientious life] is righteous, even as He is righteous.
8 [But] he who commits sin [who practices evildoing] is of the devil [takes his character from the evil one], for the devil has sinned (violated the divine law) from the beginning. The reason the Son of God was made manifest (visible) was to undo (destroy, loosen, and dissolve) the works the devil [has done].
9 No one born (begotten) of God [deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] practices sin, for God's nature abides in him [His principle of life, the divine sperm, remains permanently within him]; and he cannot practice sinning because he is born (begotten) of God.
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I am free from the law, thus sin is dead. Operating in love, doesn't lead to sin. So to say you can't go on sinning is true because that would mean the Spirit (love) is not in you. By following the two great commandments, I'm not lead into sin, I am led into righteousness. I only know sin because of the law and I can only judge sin if I'm still under the law. But I'm free so...
You're trying to put me back under the law but Christ's yoke is light as its requirement is, love for God and love for others. Do this and you shall live. Simply put....read my signature. God bless!
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My question is, who is it hurting?
If it doesn't cause you to violate the two great commandments, then I say go for it.
Jesus was God in the flesh.
No, Jesus wouldn't be most likely to spit out curse words like that. One of the fruits of The Holy Spirit is self-control (Gal 5:23). He got angry at people, but he didn't Sin because of that. He didn't spit out curse words like that, that would be Sin.
Jesus NEVER sinned. This verse is talking about Jesus.
Hebrews 4:15
For we do not have a High Priest Who is unable to understand and sympathize and have a shared feeling with our weaknesses and infirmities and liability to the assaults of temptation, but One Who has been tempted in every respect as we are, yet without sinning.
Are you pointing to Romans 13:10 in your signature?
You are taking it out of context then if that's what you're pointing to. Then you misinterpret that verse too.
Read the verse before Rom 13:10
Romans 13:9
The commandments, You shall not commit adultery, You shall not kill, You shall not steal, You shall not covet (have an evil desire), and any other commandment, are summed up in the single command, You shall love your neighbor as [you do] yourself.
Romans 13:12-14
12 The night is far gone and the day is almost here. Let us then drop (fling away) the works and deeds of darkness and put on the [full] armor of light.
13 Let us live and conduct ourselves honorably and becomingly as in the [open light of] day, not in reveling (carousing) and drunkenness, not in immorality and debauchery (sensuality and licentiousness), not in quarreling and jealousy.
14 But clothe yourself with the Lord Jesus Christ (the Messiah), and make no provision for [indulging] the flesh [put a stop to thinking about the evil cravings of your physical nature] to [gratify its] desires (lusts).
Especially, the part that I bolded in verse 14, I believe it's another good verse against masturbation.
Well that's not biblical, there's a lot of Sins listed in both NT and OT.
James 4:17
So any person who knows what is right to do but does not do it, to him it is sin.
Romans 14:23
But the man who has doubts (misgivings, an uneasy conscience) about eating, and then eats [perhaps because of you], stands condemned [before God], because he is not true to his convictions and he does not act from faith. For whatever does not originate and proceed from faith is sin [whatever is done without a conviction of its approval by God is sinful].
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IisJustMe
He rescued me because He delighted in me (Ps18:19)
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Great! Now everyone has a reason to ignore God and sin anyway, because "He always forgives!" Well, sure, but why would you want to break fellowship with the Creator of the universe? So you can have five minutes of pleasure? Judas Priest!
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It's a lie straight from hell, that one can Sin here and there.
If these verses doesn't put a bit of fear of God in you, I don't know what.
Hebrews 10:26-30
26 For if we go on deliberately and willingly sinning after once acquiring the knowledge of the Truth, there is no longer any sacrifice left to atone for [our] sins [no further offering to which to look forward].
27 [There is nothing left for us then] but a kind of awful and fearful prospect and expectation of divine judgment and the fury of burning wrath and indignation which will consume those who put themselves in opposition [to God].(A)
28 Any person who has violated and [thus] rejected and set at naught the Law of Moses is put to death without pity or mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses.(B)
29 How much worse (sterner and heavier) punishment do you suppose he will be judged to deserve who has spurned and [thus] trampled underfoot the Son of God, and who has considered the covenant blood by which he was consecrated common and unhallowed, thus profaning it and insulting and outraging the [Holy] Spirit [Who imparts] grace (the unmerited favor and blessing of God)?(C)
30 For we know Him Who said, Vengeance is Mine [retribution and the meting out of full justice rest with Me]; I will repay [I will exact the compensation], says the Lord. And again, The Lord will judge and determine and solve and settle the cause and the cases of His people
1 John 3:7-9
7[a]Boys (lads), let no one deceive and lead you astray. He who practices righteousness [who is upright, conforming to the divine will in purpose, thought, and action, living a consistently conscientious life] is righteous, even as He is righteous.
8 [But] he who commits sin [who practices evildoing] is of the devil [takes his character from the evil one], for the devil has sinned (violated the divine law) from the beginning. The reason the Son of God was made manifest (visible) was to undo (destroy, loosen, and dissolve) the works the devil [has done].
9 No one born (begotten) of God [deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] practices sin, for God's nature abides in him [His principle of life, the divine sperm, remains permanently within him]; and he cannot practice sinning because he is born (begotten) of God.
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Jonathan95 said:
So what you're saying is that once you have accepted Jesus and you, for arguments sake, steal a movie from the store, you cannot be forgiven because you know it's a sin?
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