Is it reasonable to believe there is a God? Conversation with Craig and Krauss

[Archaeopteryx]

Life, the Universe and Nothing: Is it reasonable to believe there is a God? - YouTube

 

[Eudaimonist]

What would you like to discuss?


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[ToddNotTodd]

What would you like to discuss?


eudaimonia,

Mark

Batman

 

[Davian]

Batman

How about, in a fight between Batman and Superman, who would win?

Back to the OP... I watched the video.

Craig goes first, and if you have ever seen any Craigian debate, you will see the same old script here.

Having dragged myself through that part, Kraus takes the stage. His presentation and following conversation is a bit uneven, but with Craig off script, Craig 's assertions and fallacies fell apart much like they did when Elio cut and pasted them into this forum.

Just my $0.05 (no more pennies in Canada).

 

[super animator]

His presentation and following conversation is a bit uneven, but with Craig off script, Craig 's assertions and fallacies fell apart much like they did when Elio cut and pasted them into this forum.

If your argument was never yours to begin with, expect it to be poorly defended.

 

[Davian]

If your argument was never yours to begin with, expect it to be poorly defended.

Indeed. I think Elio wanted a young Earth and a global flood, and WLC doesn't support those notions. The cognitive dissonance that resulted was interesting to observe.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

Indeed. I think Elio wanted a young Earth and a global flood, and WLC doesn't support those notions.

Are you sure? I distinctly remember that Elionai said that the universe is 13.7 billion years old.

 

[Davian]

Are you sure? I distinctly remember that Elionai said that the universe is 13.7 billion years old.

I never saw a clear response on that one. I do recall, after repeated evasions, this:

"The Genesis accounts are of such a nature that they can be interpreted in one of two ways. Either the flood was global as in the whole earth was flooded, or either it was a localized flood and the biblical author described it according to his relative position in the flood. Either view has potential pros and cons. I am open to both." - Elioenai26

I do not think I got a response to this:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7674415-79/#post63570954

 

[Lord Emsworth]

I never saw a clear response on that one. I do recall, after repeated evasions, this:

"The Genesis accounts are of such a nature that they can be interpreted in one of two ways. Either the flood was global as in the whole earth was flooded, or either it was a localized flood and the biblical author described it according to his relative position in the flood. Either view has potential pros and cons. I am open to both." - Elioenai26

I do not think I got a response to this:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7674415-79/#post63570954

Well, I think I did:
http://www.christianforums.com/t7671230-70/#post63573037

(I don't know about the flood though.)

 

[Gadarene]

Just my $0.05 (no more pennies in Canada).

Wait, really?

(sorry, it's a Craig thread, this is more interesting to me)

 

[Gadarene]

If your argument was never yours to begin with, expect it to be poorly defended.

Certainly sums up quite a lot of apologetics.

 

[Davian]

Well, I think I did:
http://www.christianforums.com/t7671230-70/#post63573037

(I don't know about the flood though.)

I've learned that you now have to ask when they believe (the process of) life appeared on this planet, or humans first appeared, so you don't get a old earth with only 6000 years of biological history on it. Go figure.

 

[Davian]

Wait, really?

(sorry, it's a Craig thread, this is more interesting to me)

Phasing out the penny

No more pennies. Cash transactions will be rounded, but not online/credit/debit. I haven't noted it myself, as I haven't made a cash transaction this year.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Phasing out the penny

No more pennies. Cash transactions will be rounded, but not online/credit/debit. I haven't noted it myself, as I haven't made a cash transaction this year.

I personally think that it is time to phase out cash altogether. We don't need it any more.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Davian]

In a debate between WLC and Arif Ahmed, Arif quoted from WLC's book Reasonable Faith:

"Even those who are given no good reason to believe and many persuasive reasons to disbelieve have no excuse, because the ultimate reason they do not believe is that they have deliberately rejected God's Holy Spirit." p. 37.

"We can know the truth, whether we have rational arguments or not." p.37

Arif Ahmed vs William Lane Craig: Is Belief In God Reasonable? (2 of 8) - YouTube

 

[Clairvoyance]

By Craig's own admission we don't need reason to believe in God. We just need faith. So to answer the OP: No, it's not "reasonable" to believe in God. How could it be? Reason means you need evidence; but belief in gods require FAITH.

 

[ranunculus]

By Craig's own admission we don't need reason to believe in God. We just need faith. So to answer the OP: No, it's not "reasonable" to believe in God. How could it be? Reason means you need evidence; but belief in gods require FAITH.

What's your definition of faith?

 

[Gospel Guy]

Are you sure? I distinctly remember that Elionai said that the universe is 13.7 billion years old.

And he found this on the universe's mattress tag

Doesn't trying to put an age on something like this require dropping a couple of hits of some good acid? You know, like some Orange Sunshine which was popular back in thy day?

 

[GabrielKnightSoul]

Wow, the comments in this thread...

Is everyone on this "Christian" forum an atheist or what?

We've got the atheists here ignoring that Krauss was a poor debater and defending him blindly to the death despite his ad hominem attacks, misplaced anger, moving of the goalpost and constant interrupting of Craig (something poor debaters do to try to get their opponent off-guard which I think is testament to the fact that Krauss had no logical answers to give other than insults).

We've got "Christians" saying that Craig's argument was about faith. Clearly they never watched the first several minutes of the first debate where Craig puts forth his argument for God. Something yet to be debunked by any atheist.

The comments here beg BELIEF!

But as always...

(It's either this or I'm calling poe on this entire forum)

youtube.com/watch?v=xwEFbzCYiII

 

[Lord Emsworth]

And he found this on the universe's mattress tag

Doesn't trying to put an age on something like this require dropping a couple of hits of some good acid? You know, like some Orange Sunshine which was popular back in thy day?

It doesn't require any such thing. It just requires having an opinion, an opinion formed in whatever fashion.

(As an aside, we were just taking about such an opinion of a former(?) member here.)