Is God moral

[ebia]

Pom?

Pom or pommy: mildly derogatory Australian slang for an Englishman, in the latter case usually followed by a word that calls into doubt the marital status of one's parents.

 

[MQTA]

ah, thanks. never heard pom or pommy before

 

[AgnosticMike]

G'day again MQTA

Yes POM Prisoner of Mother England.

Ebia could be an Aussie but just doesn't realise it yet. We're the second most multicultural nation outside of Israel. People come from all over the world to make this place home. I have friends who are iranian, Kurdish, Russian, English, German, Scottish, Irish, Arabic, Indian, Fijian, New Zealanders, Malaysian, Chinese, Taiwanese, Korean in origin, but now Aussie.

 

[AgnosticMike]

Pom or pommy: mildly derogatory Australian slang for an Englishman, in the latter case usually followed by a word that calls into doubt the marital status of one's parents.

Yeah, its becomming less derogatory. Funny thing about us Aussies. No where else in the world can you call a friend an "ol' *******" and it's considered a term of endearment. I love this place!

 

[Torchwood]

I don't view God in any sense actually, but I am curious about your thoughts.

So God's rules are different from ours you are saying. So I thought that being "holy" was all about being like God.

You talk about going to war to drive people from your land. What makes it yours? I thought it all belonged to God.

Look the point is that if we aim at being "holy" like God then we all become pshycopathic killers deciding who so stay and who should go. Have you read Numbers 34 for example. Kill all the Caananites but just keep the virgins for yourselves.

Hey Mike

I thought holy was trying to follow the laws and dictates that god laid down for his people, not aspiring to be like him. The land being mine from my point of view. Just a sematics area if we consider that god is suposed to have created and owns everything.

Also do not read to much into what I say. I belive the bible is a collection of stories and minor historys. I do not take any of it literally. I belive most of the old test is a abridged version of sumerian mythos for the most part.

I was trying to take the question from a religious standpoint. Somewhat difficult as I do not belive in literal religion. So my views on what the beliefs are might be skewed.

 

[Torchwood]

If God sets his own morality, then it's is meaningless to call him moral.


But both sets of rules are informed by the same morality.


Most parents are hypocrites, therefore God is a hypocrite?


So not only is it impossible for us to become Christlike, it is immoral for us even to aspire to it.

I get confused on the whole christ issue. I only take him into account as far as the writings about him in the bible. Was he moral in the human sense? No. He was an outlaw and put to death for breaking Roman laws. If he was the son of a god, albeit it with limited powers while in human form, then again morality does not apply to him.

What I was trying to say in a boiled down manner is this. If the bible is correct and he is our lord and master, then he is moral. If he has something higher he must answer to we do not know about it. Our concept of morality cannot be judged by religion alone though. It is mostly set by the society we live in. What might be moral for us, might not be moral for others.

 

[AgnosticMike]

G'day again

With a non committed view of God I cannot use God as a standard. Instead I use the term holy and sacred in a secualr sense. Sounds confusing I hear you say. I suppose there are many people like me who do not have their morals or ethics founded in a religious system. That doesn't mean that we are not moral or ethical. Yes society dictated to some degree what we accept as moral. Nudity is not immoral, but it is unacceptable to be nude in certain places. So we probably need to define morality. My morality stems from a respect of life. I believ that all humans should have equal rights to basic health, education as well as clean water and healthy food. We need to respect life and not indiscriminately destroy life as we are in the habit of doing. I believe that we can be selfish, just as long as it doesn't affect other life adversely.

So much of what we say is normal or right is just a manufactured opinion. People usually apply their understanding of morality to these prepackaged opinions. Many of the things that are proclaimed as immoral or wrong are simply things we do are are neither wrong or right.

So I do believe in holiness, but not in a religious sense. However, as an agnostic I am always open to propositions from any side. At the same time I believe all those propositions should be tested. If a person tells me I should just accept them by faith, I am usually concerned about their integrity.

 

[AgnosticMike]

If God sets his own morality, then it's is meaningless to call him moral.

That's an interesting point. So what is morality? I suppose there must be some absolute consistency if we are talking about God's dictating morality. If there is a God who does not live by its own standards, I'm not sure where that leads to.

As a father, I believe that my own standards that I "dictate" should be something I am and do live by. I would never set standards that I could not live by.

 

[AgnosticMike]

I get confused on the whole christ issue. I only take him into account as far as the writings about him in the bible. Was he moral in the human sense? No. He was an outlaw and put to death for breaking Roman laws. If he was the son of a god, albeit it with limited powers while in human form, then again morality does not apply to him.

What I was trying to say in a boiled down manner is this. If the bible is correct and he is our lord and master, then he is moral. If he has something higher he must answer to we do not know about it. Our concept of morality cannot be judged by religion alone though. It is mostly set by the society we live in. What might be moral for us, might not be moral for others.

There are so many possibilities. Maybe there is someone higher than God. Maybe there is no God. Maybe God is it and there is no other. Maybe God is not who we think he is. So many possibilities.

Maybe the 10 commandments were just copies of older codes like Hammurabi and Sumerian codes. Maybe the whole mountain story is a propped up fantasy of what really happened.

The thing is that it is impossible to know. All we have is the records which we need to judge the internal consistency. The same must be said for other Scriptures too. They all fall into the same boat as far as internal consistency goes.