Is "forgiveness" related to Salvation ?

[sapman]

Hi all,

I am not sure where to post this, but I think here would be a good start.

Jesus said something like "If you do not forgive your brother, your Heavenly Father would not forgive you of your sins"

How does that statement relate to Salvation ?

Also, there is another verse that goes something like..."If you love me, you would obey my commands, and my Heavenly father would love you,....".

Does this mean that if a Christian dies, with unforgiveness in his/her heart, that Christian may go to hell, since he/she did not forgive others, and in doing so, did not obey Jesus's commands ?

My understanding of salvation is: Accepting Jesus, then repentance and obedience (i.e. forgiving other of their sins)


thanks for your advice !!

 

[newlite]

jesus says if you believe in me i wont turn you away (i think i just fused two different versus together...) ill try again. if you believe in me and confess with your mouth jesus is lord, tyou'll enter the kingdom of god. i forget the versus really. its something like that. but i dont see how if you have unforgiveness in your heart you'll be booted out of heaven. im sure jesus wont be as pleased with the fact you didnt fully obey him but...yah...

 

[He is Yahweh]

I think if you truly believe in jesus and what he did and what he teaches then you will do your upmost to forgive people, and when you don't you'll repent to him and pray for forgiveness and it'll all be fine

 

[carmi]

Jesus said something like "If you do not forgive your brother, your Heavenly Father would not forgive you of your sins"

How does that statement relate to Salvation ?

I found two passages - are these the ones you are referring to?

"But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." (Math. 6:15)

"So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses." (Math. 18:35)

Since I got saved there has not a day gone by I have not sinned/trespassed in one way or the other. It does not help you in your walk with the Lord, if you have unconfessed sins in your life. Unconfessed sins are a great hinderance in your walk and your fellowship with the Lord.

Either you are ignorant of the sin (that is possible - at least temporarily) or you are aware of the sin but your heart is hardened (to use the Biblical expression). Either way, your relationship with God is effected negatively.

And you can feel a similar effect if you are unable to forgive someone else or someone else refuses to forgive you. It's impossible to be reconciled - there is a barrier, there are hard feelings.

Not always but sometimes when believers experience silence from God then an unconfessed sin in that believer's life might be the cause. God wants us to level with Him ... to level with someone implies to be honest.

 

[Christ's Minister]

You're absolutely correct about the biblical threat of hell if we do not forgive others.Jesus even put His teaching on forgiveness in the Lord's Prayer.It sure would be nice if all those "once saved always saved" people would pay attention to Jesus' repeated threats of hell for those who continue to sin.But here is something important to keep in mind;Jesus alone makes the decision about who will go to heaven or hell and His decision will be based on the complete record of our personal lives.Therefore no human can assure you of salvation or hell as many members of the clergy do.They are usurping Jesus' authority.Those who violate biblical teachings but fully repent still may receive salvation but only Jesus Himself will make that decision at the end of our lives.

 

[carmi]

Therefore no human can assure you of salvation or hell as many members of the clergy do.They are usurping Jesus' authority.Those who violate biblical teachings but fully repent still may receive salvation but only Jesus Himself will make that decision at the end of our lives.

And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand."
John 10:28

I am huMAN, I can't pluck myself out of His hand. This is what I believe.

Even so, considering the subject at hand, I forgive any huMANs, any of His ministers, who try to make me doubt in my Lord's and Saviour's promises.

 

[bethanyellen]

Also, there is another verse that goes something like..."If you love me, you would obey my commands, and my Heavenly father would love you,....".

Does this mean that if a Christian dies, with unforgiveness in his/her heart, that Christian may go to hell, since he/she did not forgive others, and in doing so, did not obey Jesus's commands ?

Is this the verse you were looking for? John 14:15- If ye love me, keep my commandments. (KJV)

If so, I believe that this means that if we love God than we will try to keep His commandments. God knows that we are not perfect, and He does not expect perfection! He does expect us to ask forgiveness for what we have done wrong. I do believe that you would not be obeying Jesus' commandments however;whether or not that will cause someone to go to hell is God's decision! I hope this helps! ~Bethany

 

[sapman]

Hi everyone,

I asked my pastor, and he said that "forgiveness" should not be "mixed" with salvation.
He said that the bible teaches only about accepting Jesus, repentance and a godly life, and that this issue of "unforgiveness" should be taken as a separate issue.

I somehow still feel a little uneasy....

any comments anyone ?

thanks !

 

[carmi]

Hi everyone,

I asked my pastor, and he said that "forgiveness" should not be "mixed" with salvation.
He said that the bible teaches only about accepting Jesus, repentance and a godly life, and that this issue of "unforgiveness" should be taken as a separate issue.

I somehow still feel a little uneasy....

any comments anyone ?

I try. In your op you wondered whether someone goes to hell because of unforgiveness in his/her heart.

I believe that through Jesus Christ I have forgiveness. If I would not believe that, would not believe that I can have only forgiveness in Christ Jesus, in other words if I would not believe that Jesus Christ is my Saviour - then I'd be in terrible shape. I was there, but since the day I believed on Him and put my trust in Him, I am not heading in the same old direction ... I am now on His Way.

A person who has not been forgiven by God, a person who never asked God to forgive Him, never believed that through Jesus Christ he/she can have forgiveness ... let's say I'd be worried about that person and I would be praying for that person's salvation.

But after a person believed on the Lord Jesus Christ and put his/her trust in Him ...

- there was a time, actually for quite a few years after I got saved, I did not even know that something I did was a sin in God's eyes. I realized this when I read a commentary on a certain Bible passage. I was shocked first, then I asked for God's forgiveness but the fact remains ... for a couple of years after I got saved I had this unconfessed sin in my life for which I never asked God's forgiveness and it was something I continued to do after I got saved.

- and even now I notice again and again that hours pass by until I realize I have to ask for God's forgiveness.

I do believe that this will and does effect my fellowship and my walk with the Lord and my testimony ... and that I will and do suffer consequences here in this life whenever there is an unconfessed sin in my life. But as far as my salvation goes, I don't believe I will get send to hell. I do believe I will be terribly ashamed when I am face to face with my Saviour ... that is the worst.

As to not forgiving others: again, it does take me often hours until I calm down, stop being angry and be able and willing to forgive the other. If anything would happen to me (an accident, a heart attack) from the moment I think our say out loud to someone: I'll never forgive you for that until hours, days later until I simmer down and realize the need to forgive that person and the need to ask God for His forgiveness about my temper and irrational behaviour ... I don't believe that would send me right into hell.

I am not a Bible scholar - I read the Bible from cover to cover many times - I cannot recall one verse where we are warned or explicitly told to forgive immediately, i.e. within seconds, and/or to ask for God's forgiveness immediately, i.e. within seconds. And let's face it, all it takes is one blot clod, one driver losing control over his car and we will be gone.

 

[Rafael]

If the Bible says that we have to forgive, then we have to. It isn't always an easy thing to do, but with God's help we can, and must.
That scripture is very very plain and easy to understand. Salvation is not based upon forgiveness, but those that receive the Spirit of God will be convicted of the sin of unforgiveness and have to deal with it by repentance. There is no way around not following the will of God and His word to forgive as He forgave us at a terrible high price in blood and suffering.

Mt 6:9 ¶ After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.
13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
15 "But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions.

Mt 18:21 ¶ Then Peter came to him and asked, "Lord, how often should I forgive someone who sins against me? Seven times?"
22 "No!" Jesus replied, "seventy times seven!
23 "For this reason, the Kingdom of Heaven can be compared to a king who decided to bring his accounts up to date with servants who had borrowed money from him.
24 In the process, one of his debtors was brought in who owed him millions of dollars.
25 He couldn’t pay, so the king ordered that he, his wife, his children, and everything he had be sold to pay the debt.
26 But the man fell down before the king and begged him, ‘Oh, sir, be patient with me, and I will pay it all.’
27 Then the king was filled with pity for him, and he released him and forgave his debt.
28 "But when the man left the king, he went to a fellow servant who owed him a few thousand dollars. He grabbed him by the throat and demanded instant payment.
29 His fellow servant fell down before him and begged for a little more time. ‘Be patient and I will pay it,’ he pleaded.
30 But his creditor wouldn’t wait. He had the man arrested and jailed until the debt could be paid in full.
31 "When some of the other servants saw this, they were very upset. They went to the king and told him what had happened.
32 Then the king called in the man he had forgiven and said, ‘You evil servant! I forgave you that tremendous debt because you pleaded with me.
33 Shouldn’t you have mercy on your fellow servant, just as I had mercy on you?’
34 Then the angry king sent the man to prison until he had paid every penny.
35 "That’s what my heavenly Father will do to you if you refuse to forgive your brothers and sisters in your heart."

 

[TruthSetsYouFree]

Hi there!

I have a few verses that come to mind concerning forgiveness and salvation.

There are a whole flurry of verses that tell us how vital it is to love one another (love is the opposite of unforgiveness). One of my favorites is 1 John 3:14, "We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death." (Of course, it's talking about spiritual life and spiritual death)

In Matthew 18:23-35, Jesus tells us a parable about the servant who didn't forgive, and his master turned him over to the tormentors, then He goes on to say, "So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses."

Mark 11:23 tells us that if we don't forgive, we won't be forgiven. Unforgiveness can block God's forgiveness of our sins.

I hope this helps! I believe that Jesus gave us the gospel of reconciliation, and He wants us to continue (pass along) the love that He has shown us. We are to be the light of the world!

In Christ,
Bobby

 

[RED that's ME]

And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand."
John 10:28

I am huMAN, I can't pluck myself out of His hand. This is what I believe.

Even so, considering the subject at hand, I forgive any huMANs, any of His ministers, who try to make me doubt in my Lord's and Saviour's promises.

Good verse.

All through the Bible you see the Parent/child relationship. When a child break a parent's rule doesn't mean they are not longer the parent's child but a disobedient child in need of discipline.

God is our Heavenly Father just because we break one of his rules doesn't mean we are not longer his child but a disobedient child in need of discipline. What Jesus did on the cross was a one time deal that sealed all who come to him in faith receiving what he has done for them and making Jesus Christ their Savior and Lord.