Is discrimination moral?

[feral]

Is it moral or correct to discriminate against those who do things you don't approve of? By discrimination I mean anything from refusing to befriend or hire a person to enacting laws against them. If you are a Christian, for instance, and someone is committing adultery, which is wrong according to you personally and your religion, is it morally right for you to fire them from work, prohibit them from having the same rights as you or just be cruel to them?

Thoughts...?

 

[jayem]

I would distinguish between acting in the private and in the public sphere. If a person's actions or beliefs violate your personal moral code, then you have no obligation to associate with them privately. I think it's acceptable say, to not invite them to your house for dinner. But in the public sphere, such as hiring employees, conducting a business, renting property, etc, there are federal and local laws which prohibit discrimination. Though it's not always realistic, it may be most ethical to try and befriend such a person. Maybe, by example or exhortation you could modify whatever behavior you find objectionable. If you're a Christian believer, aren't you supposed to witness, in love, to the sinful and the unsaved?

 

[TheOriginalWhitehorse]

A qualified yes. It has been estimated that approximately 90% of our laws are unconsitutional. I wish I could remember the source-a congressman or senator; I cannot recall which-but it matters little since we can see the unconstitutionality of so many of these laws for ourselves.

 

[Crazy Liz]

I think discrimination based on behavior falls somewhere along a continuum. Would I discriminate against a child molester if I operate a school? Would I discriminate against a thief if I run a bank? Would I refuse to date an adulterer, rapist or murderer? Of course I would "discriminate" in order to avoid taking an unecessary risk.

OTOH, should I refuse to rent my house to an unmarried couple who take good care of the place and pay their rent on time? Would I have a cup of coffee with a gay person? Would I invite someone to my home who cheats on her taxes?

I wonder whether we could think of discrimination on "moral" grounds in terms of the risk it poses. In some cases, the degree of risk will be different for different people.

In the Christian community today, loo little value is placed on real courage. We need courage to be honest in assessing risks in such situations. I know some Christians who advocate rules such as a married Christian should never ride in a car alone with anyone of the opposite sex. I think they justify that primarily from the standpoint of protecting their own reputations, rather than from that of protecting their moral integrity. Some Christians probably should not trust themselves in such situations. Others are simply afraid of what some other people might think. Does anyone have the courage to say, "I discriminate because I don't trust myself in certain stuations?" rather than, "I discriminate because I think some other people shouldn't trust themselves in similar situations, adn I want to make it easier for them to discriminate without admitting they, personally, have a problem?"

OK, there's an analysis and a pet peeve WRT discrimination, FWIW.

 

[rwl]

Is it moral or correct to discriminate against those who do things you don't approve of? By discrimination I mean anything from refusing to befriend or hire a person to enacting laws against them. If you are a Christian, for instance, and someone is committing adultery, which is wrong according to you personally and your religion, is it morally right for you to fire them from work, prohibit them from having the same rights as you or just be cruel to them?

Thoughts...?

I personally feel that it's *totally* immoral. I can understand why persons wouldn't want to hangout with some people because of differences, but discriminating against them is just wrong. Using your example... By doing those things you're totally going against what the Bible teaches. Who the heck is anybody to judge another? I've said it before and I'll say it again. Jesus hung with the dirty not the clean. That’s just from a Biblical standpoint. Sadly there are many Christians that love to pass judgment and view themselves above others because of their faith when in fact it’s those people that need help the most.



However, from a non biblical standpoint, to intact laws, or hold judgments because someone is different from you is just plain ignorance. It happens, it's unfortunate, but you can only control yourself.

Edit ::

I think discrimination based on behavior falls somewhere along a continuum. Would I discriminate against a child molester if I operate a school? Would I discriminate against a thief if I run a bank? Would I refuse to date an adulterer, rapist or murderer? Of course I would "discriminate" in order to avoid taking an unecessary risk.

Liz, great point.

 

[Crazy Liz]

Is it moral or correct to discriminate against those who do things you don't approve of?

A qualified yes. It has been estimated that approximately 90% of our laws are unconsitutional. I wish I could remember the source-a congressman or senator; I cannot recall which-but it matters little since we can see the unconstitutionality of so many of these laws for ourselves.

Whitehorse, what does constitutionality have to do with morality?

 

[TheOriginalWhitehorse]

I personally feel that it's *totally* immoral. I can understand why persons wouldn't want to hangout with some people because of differences, but discriminating against them is just wrong. Using your example... By doing those things you're totally going against what the Bible teaches. Who the heck is anybody to judge another? I've said it before and I'll say it again. Jesus hung with the dirty not the clean. That’s just from a Biblical standpoint. Sadly there are many Christians that love to pass judgment and view themselves above others because of their faith when in fact it’s those people that need help the most.



However, from a non biblical standpoint, to intact laws, or hold judgments because someone is different from you is just plain ignorance. It happens, it's unfortunate, but you can only control yourself.

Edit ::
Liz, great point.

I understand what you are saying and you make some good points. But we can't allow corruption to overtake the country. To do so is to make it ripe for God's displeasure, and we all suffer when that happens. Moreover, we are called to be salt and light. If we're giving sinful behavior the nod, we're not fulfilling our Godgiven role.

Do we associate with people who do these things? Sure, if they're *not* professing to be believers. Do we take someone who will corrupt the minds of elementary school children, and make him a teacher? Or do we hire a buddhist to be a pastor? Do we appoint a homosexual to lead a boy scout troop?

It *does* take courage to stand up to our convictions. Love these people, yes. Allow them to propagate their deviations? No way.

 

[rwl]

...we can't allow corruption to overtake the country. To do so is to make it ripe for God's displeasure, and we all suffer when that happens. Moreover, we are called to be salt and light. If we're giving sinful behavior the nod, we're not fulfilling our Godgiven role.

Do we associate with people who do these things? Sure, if they're *not* professing to be believers. Do we take someone who will corrupt the minds of elementary school children, and make him a teacher? Or do we hire a buddhist to be a pastor? Do we appoint a homosexual to lead a boy scout troop?

It *does* take courage to stand up to our convictions. Love these people, yes. Allow them to propagate their deviations? No way.

I agree with you. But I look at it like this “Instead of letting corruption run rampant, do something about it". I'd never give sinful behavior the nod, but I'm a sinner and since I am there's no way I can convict someone for sinning when its something I do. That’s like a boss that writes up his employee's for being late once when he's late every day. I will however say my opinion on matters.



I do agree with your points and Liz's example. Ideally I/we would be able to forgive and forget what they've done. I am human however and can say I most likely wouldn't be able to.

 

[TheOriginalWhitehorse]

Whitehorse, what does constitutionality have to do with morality?

Liz, good question. It is these laws that prevent people from acting in accordance with their conscinces. Laws that try to force people to be all-inclusive, for example. Of course, we are still required by the higher law of God to act in accordance with His laws, but many people won't. They will buckle in to corrupt laws of a corrupt culture.

I'm saying, the laws that prevent people from acting in accordance with their consciences are just about always unconstitutional anyhow.

 

[feral]

I think discrimination based on behavior falls somewhere along a continuum. Would I discriminate against a child molester if I operate a school? Would I discriminate against a thief if I run a bank? Would I refuse to date an adulterer, rapist or murderer? Of course I would "discriminate" in order to avoid taking an unecessary risk.

OTOH, should I refuse to rent my house to an unmarried couple who take good care of the place and pay their rent on time? Would I have a cup of coffee with a gay person? Would I invite someone to my home who cheats on her taxes?

That is a good point. I am more referring to public/social discrimination such as refusing to hire someone or rent to someone based on something you personally disliked or disapproved of about them. I agree that in certain positions we need to discriminate...such as when hiring a babysitter or accepting a date.

 

[He put me back together]

The pure definition of discrimination is never evil of itself--if you wish to hire a worker, you discriminate according to which worker will give you the most benefit. When you marry, (disregarding issues of commands from God), you should choose the person that will make the best spouse for you--this readily rules out fornicators and adulterers. When you have coffee with someone, is there a line of people you are going to reject, and who you are going to accept? Is there rejection?

The question of discrimination in the workplace according to personal morality is simple--it's just not any of your business. It is improper for you to ask a person if he's a homosexual, or an adulterer, in a job interview. That's not why he's there, although asking him if he's committed a felony IS quite relevant. What a person does behind the walls of his home is irrelevant--what matters is how well he can perform the task you are going to pay him for. On the other hand, however, while I could care less about a person's sexual orientation in the workplace, if I'm a retail manager, I wouldn't think twice about throwing an application in the garbage if a male applicant showed up dressed as a woman. While the same standard doesn't apply for acceptance as a friend, or for all occupations, it is quite obvious that an individual who is in such a denial of himself would not be considerable for a position in that particular field. Of course, we cannot rule out those particular *christian* individuals who think that Christ's "tell the good news to all people" means that they are supposed to neglect the duties of their job to hand out leaflets. So, the bottom line is, as an employer your only concern should be those things that are relevant to your facilities, and nothing more.

Is it good to discriminate according to morality when one is looking for a spouse? OF COURSE IT IS! It is insane to say that it is not! Is it good to discriminate according to religion, when looking for a spouse? OF COURSE IT IS! The Bible itself says that we should do so. What about other things? Sure. There are some things that people do that are not wrong, but they do have an impact on whether or not the person in question would make a good spouse for one specific person. Furthermore, now leaving wisdom and speaking purely on morals, a person's hand in marriage is his to give. Unless there is a command from God, discriminating for any reason is not unjust when we are speaking about marriage. If I don't want to marry a lady because she has a funny laugh, that's my business. I have done her ABSOLUTELY NO moral wrong by refusing to date or marry her. (Of course, if I dated her for 10 years and was engaged to her, then suddenly decided to break it off because I didn't like her laugh, THEN there might be a moral issue.)

Now, concerning friends...ugh. I'll talk about friends later. Friends are different--Christ gave us an example to follow. Much of what I'd say about it has been said already, so I'll put my 2 cents in about friends next time. Blessings.

 

[Just]

I know some Christians who advocate rules such as a married Christian should never ride in a car alone with anyone of the opposite sex

Freak.

 

[Brimshack]

The meaning of the word "discrimination" just isn't the substance of the issue. Where people speak of discrimination as wrong they are actually engaging in elipses, that is leaving out part of the phrasing; "illegal discrimnation," "racial discrimination," etc. Your discovery of the fact that discrimination in itself is not a problem thus turns out to be somewhat Quixotic.

 

[Teh Wiccan]

Most circumstances, I would most liekly not discriminate. However, In the example of hiting someone, it may be necassary. For example, I know a completel backstabber. He never sticks to what he says, or his Philosophy that "matters so much" to him. I have great respect for buddhism. For him, I do not. In a case like that, he would be very likely to cause disruption among other workers. I have known hom to turn people against each other and make death threats. Cohesiveness wouldn't be maintained by hiring him. If, per chance, someone performed adultery, but didn't really disrupt the company, then I would probably hire them.

 

[He put me back together]

The meaning of the word "discrimination" just isn't the substance of the issue. Where people speak of discrimination as wrong they are actually engaging in elipses, that is leaving out part of the phrasing; "illegal discrimnation," "racial discrimination," etc. Your discovery of the fact that discrimination in itself is not a problem thus turns out to be somewhat Quixotic.

Well, there really is no discovery--the word simply means what it means. I didn't make an actual point around the definition, but rather made a single statement concerning the definition, and then went on to say that morality should be considered where it is relevant. I would like to hear what you have to say about the point of the post, rather than the introductory sentence.

 

[He put me back together]

Now, concerning friends, and love:

Christ was merciful to the murderers, the thieves, the drunkards, the heretics, and the adulterers, so why shouldn't we do the same? Christ was our friend, in the midst of our immorality. The love of Christ in us will extend the hand of friendship to others who are in the same position that we were in when Christ revived us from death. As for myself, I think myself neither starved nor too wealthy in friends--I will be a friend to he who will be a friend to me, and, hopefully by the grace of God, love those who will not. To reject the friendship of a man because he is a *sinner* <gasp!> is to be a hypocrite, as if you were the one who raised yourself from the dead.

That being said, is it morally acceptable for someone who does not know Christ to discriminate among those who would be his friends, according to his favor? Is he morally obligated to have coffee with anyone who asks him? If so, why?

 

[Sunbeam]

I would distinguish between acting in the private and in the public sphere. If a person's actions or beliefs violate your personal moral code, then you have no obligation to associate with them privately. I think it's acceptable say, to not invite them to your house for dinner. But in the public sphere, such as hiring employees, conducting a business, renting property, etc, there are federal and local laws which prohibit discrimination. Though it's not always realistic, it may be most ethical to try and befriend such a person. Maybe, by example or exhortation you could modify whatever behavior you find objectionable. If you're a Christian believer, aren't you supposed to witness, in love, to the sinful and the unsaved?

I agree with this pretty much.