Is being Wiccan moral?

TheOriginalWhitehorse · May 8, 2004

I'm just curious: How do you think God feels about "flaunitng scripture around to change other people's minds"? I'm also curious about why you preface free will, something you're discussing in the context of the worship of false gods, with "God-given."

2 Timothy 3:16-17

3:16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

3:17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

So, where is the scripture that says not to use scripture?

Sola Scriptura · May 8, 2004

transientlife said:
I'm not an atheist, obviously, nor am I a Pagan...I think that's quite obvious. But I don't flaunt scripture around in order to change other people's minds. Though if you think allowing people to exercise their God-given free will is pagan like, and respecting their choices, then maybe I am.

In other words you do not take the Word of God as seriously as you take freindship with pagans and athiests. You prefer to hold hands and fellowship with those who do not know Him rather than cherish His words to go forth and preach to all nations making disciples; restoring them in love, pronouncing the new world to come, warning them of the coming wrath, and the coming King. Also, do you respect all "God-given...choices"? In your mind are there evil choices? choices that endanger others? Choices that imperil the soul? Is christianity to you a mere social convention or revolutionary force? Does being a christian make you feel superior to the pagans which abound in your midst or does thier presence help you to disolve its convictions, its prophetic utterances, its salty values? Are serial murders excercising free will or are they slaves to evil? Are militant Islamists rejoicing in their God-given freedoms and choices or are they the servants and practitioners of evil? Though you don't flaunt scripture you most certainly flaunt your antagonism toward those who love Jesus and take Him seriously. So which is better to flaunt scripture or to flaunt your continous bitter thoughts?

Greetings

Sola Scriptura · May 8, 2004

Whitehorse said:
I'm just curious: How do you think God feels about "flauntng scripture around to change other people's minds"? I'm also curious about why you preface free will, something you're discussing in the context of the worship of false gods, with "God-given."

2 Timothy 3:16-17

3:16All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

3:17That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

So, where is the scripture that says not to use scripture?

WhiteHorse=brilliance

Volos · May 8, 2004

The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose.
An evil soul producing holy witness
Is like a villain with a smiling cheek,
A goodly apple rotten at the heart.
O what a goodly outside falsehood hath!
--The Merchant of Venice, I:3

Sola Scriptura · May 8, 2004

Volos said:
The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose.
An evil soul producing holy witness
Is like a villain with a smiling cheek,
A goodly apple rotten at the heart.
O what a goodly outside falsehood hath!
--The Merchant of Venice, I:3

So you believe in the devil and scripture! how interesting.

_____________________________________________________________
"As to homosexuality making an untenible society please check out the Spartans...Or even the Roman and Greek societies where the love of a beautiful lad was the purest love around ...while you may not be happy about it, there are millions and millions of Americans who do not find such "acts"disgusting." -mpshiel-

"...God is not as absolute on what marriage HAS to be as many Christians are..." -mpshiel-

"I have a few 18+ movies in my DVD collection. Actually I think "Better than Chocolate"
(available at most internet retailers near you) is an 18 plus..." -mpshiel-

"Before the groans, I do not normally post from gay365.com but..." -mpshiel-

"...can anyone please bring a scripture saying that gender alteration is sin?" -mpshiel-

Brevity and proper grammar are the core of comprehension

transientlife · May 8, 2004

I respect your conservative opinions, I really do, but the caring, love, mercy, humility and forgiveness that I was taught about our religion I seem to find lacking in your stances.
God gave us free will to believe in him or not, or so I was taught. I don't think I'm too off the mark with that, or we wouldn't have the mulitudes of religions that we do today. Everyone would automatically be a Christian. And wouldn't that make your job a whole lot easier. Interacting with these different beliefs actually reinforce my own and make me appreciative of them. And if you want to be an optimistic evangelical christian, you could say perhaps these nonbelievers would find their way to God through my example. But who's to say, and who's business is it other than theirs - and if they're wrong, then they'll deal with it upon their judgement with God. If they want to know, I'll tell them about Jesus and Christianity- but I will not force it down their throats. You can't force someone to believe, period. (Freedom of religion...sucks, doesn't it? ) Just because I choose not to force my beliefs upon others does not mean I do not take my religion seriously. As far as being a Christian amongst nonChristians making me feel superior? That's just ridiculous. I'm not out in this life to be superior to anyone, it's an absurd pursuit. Not to mention moot, since we all die equal. As far as your comment on serial murderers, maybe it's a bit of free will, a bit of evil influence and a bit of "faulty wiring". They did a complete dissection on Charles Whitman earlier this century and his brain structure was no different than a "normal" humans. So we both could be right, or we both could be wrong. Who's to say but the superior power?
And bitter thoughts? I'm not bitter, just frustrated.

Kira Faye · May 10, 2004

Wow some people have never heard of tongue in cheek, my post wasn't very serious if at all, it was funny to see the reactions though.

Volos · May 10, 2004

Originally posted by :

Sola Scriptura

So you believe in the devil and scripture! how interesting.

I also believe in the the Bhagavad Gita, the Mabinogi, the Kalevala, the Tao Te Ching, the Tibeten Book of the Dead and many other religious and spirtiual text.

katherinethegreat · May 10, 2004

sola scripta..please stop accusing me of liking hitler....my gradnfather alomost died in one of his camps..do you think i adore someone who almost killed my ancestors? i am jsut saying that free thought is okay, but when it goes to the extreme it is dangerous, eveything has two oppposing sides, the yin and the yang, and negative and the positive, and the same is with freedom to think for ones self..but the mintue you start hurting others in order to express your ideas, then you go to far... no i don't believe hitler was good or his ideals, and stop getting off topic, this is a wiccan site...not a "hey lets condemn people and say they are nazis with no proof" site adn i am not saying you are wrong, i am just trying to say to not condemn someone before you understand their ideals and their priniciples...the wiccans don't hurt anyone, unlike hitler, so leave them alone and don't condemn them to hell for not believing in the same thing you do

katherinethegreat · May 10, 2004

transientlife..do not feel bad about them calling you a nonchristian..and don't let it bend your ideals....they do not understand that people haev different levels of faith, you are an awesome debatist..and keep it up for me cause i haev given up on this thread, you can't teach an old dog new tricks

Schism · May 10, 2004

Heil Whitehorse and Sola Scripture; leaders of the Christian revolution back to the arcahic age. While I see in my presence both have managed their post counts even higher, I fail to see any reason or self-thought, but I see a small relationship in development. Cute.

For the sake of simplicity, I ask all; To what purpose is it to post scripture? You may post the entire Bible you want, it will not make anybody listen to it or think you any wiser. By now I've learn to skip quotes and go directly to what you say, which in some cases is purely foolish. If you use a book to judge another, that is foolish. This is similar to Darwin's book against the Bible. Also similar is the reasonable conclusion; the two books are not written to destory the other-they are nearly there to further the mind.

However, to anybody who calls other Christians non-christians; you are the Hitler and Stalin here. Either refrain from oppression, or realize differences in the world. Forever there will be different people of all cultures. Sad that some here think themselves such fine expertise on the bible, I remember even my own pastor dwelling that it takes a lifetime to learn a small segment of what there is to know.

TheOriginalWhitehorse · May 10, 2004

Sola Scriptura said:
WhiteHorse=brilliance

Sola scriptura, thank you for your incredibly kind comment. I'm humbled. Your generous encouragement is very refreshing. As it is written:

Proverbs 11:25

11:25The generous man will be prosperous, And he who waters will himself be watered. NAS

Thank you for your kindness.

Blessings,
Whitehorse

TheOriginalWhitehorse · May 10, 2004

For the sake of simplicity, I ask all; To what purpose is it to post scripture? You may post the entire Bible you want, it will not make anybody listen to it or think you any wiser.

THis has already been addressed. For the sake of the newcomers, I will repeat it: YOu don't stop using the truth because someone else doesn't want to accept it, or especially because they're trying to pry you away from the authority of truth. If they don't accept it, that's their problem. But we will affirm it still because it is the truth.

By now I've learn to skip quotes and go directly to what you say, which in some cases is purely foolish. If you use a book to judge another, that is foolish. This is similar to Darwin's book against the Bible. Also similar is the reasonable conclusion; the two books are not written to destory the other-they are nearly there to further the mind.

As it is written:

I Corinthians 1:20-25

1:20Where is the wise man? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

1:21For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.

1:22For indeed Jews ask for signs and Greeks search for wisdom;

1:23but we preach Christ crucified, to Jews a stumbling block and to Gentiles foolishness,

1:24but to those who are the called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.

1:25Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

However, to anybody who calls other Christians non-christians; you are the Hitler and Stalin here.

I will allow this statement to speak for itself.

Either refrain from oppression, or realize differences in the world. Forever there will be different people of all cultures.

And you feel you have a right, still, to tell us what to do? May I ask why you feel you have this right?

TheOriginalWhitehorse · May 10, 2004

Sola Scriptura said:
So you believe in the devil and scripture! how interesting.

Good point.

Sola Scriptura · May 10, 2004

In every persons mouth there is a book forcing its way out, an opinion being thrust onto others, and an absolute point of view heralded; no exceptions. To state others wise is disingenuity and or self deception at best.

_____________________________________________________________
"As to homosexuality making an untenible society please check out the Spartans...Or even the Roman and Greek societies where the love of a beautiful lad was the purest love around ...while you may not be happy about it, there are millions and millions of Americans who do not find such "acts"disgusting." -mpshiel-

"...God is not as absolute on what marriage HAS to be as many Christians are..." -mpshiel-

"I have a few 18+ movies in my DVD collection. Actually I think "Better than Chocolate"
(available at most internet retailers near you) is an 18 plus..." -mpshiel-

"Before the groans, I do not normally post from gay365.com but..." -mpshiel-

"...can anyone please bring a scripture saying that gender alteration is sin?" -mpshiel-

Brevity and proper grammar are the core of comprehension

Havoc · May 10, 2004

Sola Scriptura said:
In every persons mouth there is a book forcing its way out, an opinion being thrust onto others, and an absolute point of view heralded; no exceptions. To state others wise is disingenuity and or self deception at best.

Glad you've got us all figured out Sola.

Where would we be if we didn't have you to tell us what we think and believe?

ROFLMAO

transientlife · May 10, 2004

I have yet to see a facade here. I see genuine caring and respect for other people and their privacy, choices and lives in general.

transientlife · May 10, 2004

Sola Scriptura said:
In every persons mouth there is a book forcing its way out, an opinion being thrust onto others, and an absolute point of view heralded; no exceptions. To state others wise is disingenuity and or self deception at best.

hmm I do believe you called Whitehorse brilliant. Want to try that last line again? Or am I misinterpreting?
and as far as a book "forcing it's way out"...some are able to stifle that enough to allow some courtesy to others and their opinions.

TheOriginalWhitehorse · May 10, 2004

Sola Scriptura is saying that everyone has an absolute they believe in, even if they say they're relativists. So, coming to a Chrisitan forum and expecting Christians to accept a pagan worldview is every bit the intolerance, only moreso: it comes onto Christian turf to tell Christians to be quiet. I've had this done to me in the last few posts, for example.

Sola isn't saying scripture is less valid because we have a worldview. He's saying you have one too, so it's impossible to cal toerh people intolerant when you're doing the exqact same thing you're condemning.

Except, you claim Christianity and you're finding kinship with pagans.

And when you think about it, there's no magic to gaining a strong knowledge or understanding of scripture. It just requires spending time in the word. Why not reserve an hour every night, and read the Bible cover to cover. You'll be glad you did. My guess is that you have probably some limited experience with Christianity, maybe from a relative or an acquaintance, and you see the truth in what you know, but maybe you don't have a comprehensive system of active Christian support. It's worth the effort to establish.

transientlife · May 10, 2004

I'm not asking for accpetance of pagan worldviews, or even the respect of the religion itself. I'm asking for respect of the people practicing it. That's all. I'm not condemning your views, as I said before, I respect your opinion in disagreeing with pagans, etc., I am merely frustrated by the lack of courtesy you present to them in substitute of judgement and condemnation. You can tell them Jesus is the way and the truth, but you can't force them to believe it - by either repeating it or posting verse after verse.
A great quote I found on a Bible help site " If you are respectful and fair in the way you treat someone, they will be open to what you have to say. If, on the other hand, you are unfair and disrespectful to those around you, they will not be interested in what you have to say, including the gospel."
Which illustrates my opinion even further.
My experience with Christianity is love, mercy and humility. Not complete condemnation of differences. As far as I've been taught, love is not just reserved for other Christians, but for all. (and I'll play your game here love thy neighbor as thyself --- brought up innumerable times throughout the bible - must I enter all the verses? )
Not to mention, I sincerely wish you would stop calling the level of my faith into question (and in a roundabout way accusing me of not being a "real" Christian) just based on the fact that I do not believe exactly as you do.

I've said all I can say, it's getting redundant when there are no new arguements really being presented. So I would rather agree to disagree at this point.
Obviously you are steadfast in your opinions as am I, congrats.

Take care

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