Is a slang term for homosexuals appropriate in a sermon?

[stubbornkelly]

A homosexual is a man or woman that is attracted to the same sex BUT doesnt act on the emotions and attraction and stays celebit [ i didnt spell that right sry ]

A Gay is someone that acts on the emotions and attraction and goes out and haves sex, and so on.

Yeh, I agree that that's a distinction purely in your own mind.

As to the OP, well, I think it was completely inappropriate for your pastor to use that word. Someone should talk to him about it privately.

 

[kiwimac]

Its just as appropriate as calling a black person a '[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]' or an Asian a 'slant' in a sermon. NOT APPROPRIATE AT ALL. Frankly, I'd would have stood and called him on it then and there!, Why, because it happened in a public forum and leaves a very bad taste in everyone's mouth, it needed to be dealt with then.

Kiwimac aka Rev. R. J. McIntyre

 

[dignitized]

What exactly do you mean by "place it on the level of the people?"

Quite simply, when you are preaching to street people, different langauge is required than that which one whould use when preaching to mensa.

 

[dignitized]

Its just as appropriate as calling a black person a '[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]' or an Asian a 'slant' in a sermon. NOT APPROPRIATE AT ALL. Frankly, I'd would have stood and called him on it then and there!, Why, because it happened in a public forum and leaves a very bad taste in everyone's mouth, it needed to be dealt with then.

Kiwimac aka Rev. R. J. McIntyre

Why is it when a member of the group uses the word its acceptable, but if anyone else uses it, it makes them racist or sexist or heterosexualist . . . . It was not the best verbiage, but I'd never label that preacher over one wrong word. I once heard a preacher when he was trying to described how upset people get when some things happen slip and say "what the F" which is exactly what the audience he was speaking to would say when something amazingly wrong happens so it wasn't so bad, but as soon as he said it, he looked as if he were about to swallow his tongue. Poor guy.

So, I guess my stance is, bad form but lets not kowtow to political correctness here either.

 

[FR0G]

Quite simply, when you are preaching to street people, different langauge is required than that which one whould use when preaching to mensa.

True, but is it acceptable in your book for that to include offensive language? Would it be acceptable for a pastor in a largely racist town with a largely racist congregation, to use the "n" word simply as a means of "placing it on the level of the people?"

 

[dignitized]

Melani: It is never acceptable to perpetuate hate. Now, if it were a black preacher preaching in a black ghetto neighborhood - THAT'S another story Agreed?

 

[FR0G]

Well, we'll have to agree to disagree when it comes to certain words, like "[bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]" and "***." I don't like them at all, and it breaks my heart to hear people call each other that, no matter their race or sexual orientation.


I'm off to bed - have a blessed night.

 

[Arnold_Philips]

Why is it when a member of the group uses the word its acceptable, but if anyone else uses it, it makes them racist or sexist or heterosexualist . . . . .

I think it's a matter of reclaiming dignity. Blacks have effectively reclaimed the 'n' word and popularized it among themselves. Gays are presently pursuing to reclaim the word "queer" and strip it of its negative connotations, just as blacks stripped the 'n' word of its negative connotations. Of course, its ultimately a matter of your sentiment behind the words.

 

[dignitized]

Of course, its ultimately a matter of your sentiment behind the words

Actually it's a matter of the perceived sentiments behind your use of the words. In this issue, perception is all in all.

 

[FR0G]

Oh my goodness. Tonight he used the word "retarded" to refer to something he thought was stupid. He is usually an excellent orator and gives relevant, excellent sermons. I don't understand why he's making these major faux pas. I'm too timid to talk to him about it, I think. Could it be a spiritual attack thing? I guess since I can't get up the nerve to talk to him, I will pray for him.

 

[Arnold_Philips]

Oh my goodness. Tonight he used the word "retarded" to refer to something he thought was stupid. He is usually an excellent orator and gives relevant, excellent sermons. I don't understand why he's making these major faux pas. I'm too timid to talk to him about it, I think. Could it be a spiritual attack thing? I guess since I can't get up the nerve to talk to him, I will pray for him.

Wait until he calls something "totally gay" to approach him.

 

[Blackhawk]

I do not think that how the pastor used the word "***" was acceptable. However Andrew Peterson uses it one of his songs and I think although it was shocking it was appropriate in that song. Below is some information about the song and why Andrew wrote it.


That's not to say that all Peterson's songs are flowery celebrations of God's glory. The song Come Lord Jesus was written out of an angry heart. Peterson reports, 'There was a guy named Matthew Shepherd, about two years ago who lived in Wyoming, in the Northwest, who was picked up in a gay bar by some guys, who took him out and they beat him to death. It was all over the media... so it raised a lot of issues in America and there was this article in People magazine I ended up reading. It had a picture of his parents hugging each other at his funeral. And in the foreground were pickets and a woman holding two signs, one saying "God hates ****", and the other, "Matt in hell". The caption said that Christian organisations were standing outside picketing', Andrew shakes his head as he recalls the story. 'It was very discouraging and I remember being really frustrated with the fact that, after two thousand years, there are still people who miss the point so drastically...I guess the prayer that I had at that time, at least what I felt like saying was, "Maybe if the world ended now, it wouldn't be that bad"! So it's a very critical song of the Church, but then I hopefully redeemed it a little bit in the second verse by being very critical of myself, because I'm as guilty. If Jesus can love me, He can love the stupid woman holding the picket sign... He died for us both'!

http://www.premieronline.co.uk/pages/feature/feature_andrewpeterson.htm

 

[Blackhawk]

Here are some of the lyrics to the song Come Lord Jesus by Andrew Peterson. (I am not sure if this is all of them.)


"Tonight in the line of the merchandise store
While they were packing up my bags
I saw the pictures of the prophets with the picket sign
screaming, "God hates ****."
And it feels like the church isn't anything more
Than the second coming of the Pharisees
Scrubbing each other 'til their tombs are white
They chisel epitaphs of piety.
Oh, there's burning down inside of me
'Cause the battle seems so lost
And it's raging on so silently
We forget it's being fought
It's taken me years in the race just to get this far
Still there's no end in sight, no end in sight
'Cause I've carried my cross into the dens of the wicked
And you know I've blended in just fine
Well, I'm weak and weary of breaking his heart
With the cycle of my sin, of my sin
Still He turns His face to me and I kiss Him
Just to betray Him once again
Well, I've got oceans down inside of me
I can feel the billows roll
With the mercy that comes thundering o'er the waters of my soul
Tonight in the light of the gathering rain
I could hear creation groan
And a sign rose up from the streets of the city
To the foot of heaven's throne
Oh, and the people hear the sound of a sweet refrain
An absolution in the fray, in the fray
It tells of the death of the One for the lives of the many
More than any picket sign could say
So, Amen,
Come, Lord Jesus."

 

[FR0G]

Well, I had a meeting with the youth pastor today, and I mentioned to him my unease. He said I am not the only one to have concerns about this, and that the topic has been discussed with the senior pastor. Guess that's all I can do for now.

 

[FR0G]

Blackhawk, I appreciate the lyrics, but wouldn't you agree that using the word as a direct quote is an entirely different thing?

 

[Blackhawk]

Blackhawk, I appreciate the lyrics, but wouldn't you agree that using the word as a direct quote is an entirely different thing?

Sure I just wanted to let y'all see it. I think it is a cool song and it does show that sometimes using bad language is appropriate.

 

[La Bonita Zorilla]

I do not think that how the pastor used the word "***" was acceptable. However Andrew Peterson uses it one of his songs and I think although it was shocking it was appropriate in that song. Below is some information about the song and why Andrew wrote it.


That's not to say that all Peterson's songs are flowery celebrations of God's glory. The song Come Lord Jesus was written out of an angry heart. Peterson reports, 'There was a guy named Matthew Shepherd, about two years ago who lived in Wyoming, in the Northwest, who was picked up in a gay bar by some guys, who took him out and they beat him to death. It was all over the media... so it raised a lot of issues in America and there was this article in People magazine I ended up reading. It had a picture of his parents hugging each other at his funeral. And in the foreground were pickets and a woman holding two signs, one saying "God hates ****", and the other, "Matt in hell". The caption said that Christian organisations were standing outside picketing', Andrew shakes his head as he recalls the story. 'It was very discouraging and I remember being really frustrated with the fact that, after two thousand years, there are still people who miss the point so drastically...I guess the prayer that I had at that time, at least what I felt like saying was, "Maybe if the world ended now, it wouldn't be that bad"! So it's a very critical song of the Church, but then I hopefully redeemed it a little bit in the second verse by being very critical of myself, because I'm as guilty. If Jesus can love me, He can love the stupid woman holding the picket sign... He died for us both'!

http://www.premieronline.co.uk/pages/feature/feature_andrewpeterson.htm

Very good post, Blackhawk.

 

[La Bonita Zorilla]

The use of this sort of epithet is wrong and ultimately damaging to the church and Christianity when an official spokesman like that does it.

It's interesting that almost everyone can identify such a term as wrongful, but, subtle hateful things are just as wrong and just as damaging, like the slur that gay men all molest boys, or discredited psychological mumbo jumbo like homosexuality is caused by having a weak father and a strong mother.

 

[Arnold_Philips]

I do not think that how the pastor used the word "***" was acceptable. However Andrew Peterson uses it one of his songs and I think although it was shocking it was appropriate in that song. Below is some information about the song and why Andrew wrote it.


That's not to say that all Peterson's songs are flowery celebrations of God's glory. The song Come Lord Jesus was written out of an angry heart. Peterson reports, 'There was a guy named Matthew Shepherd, about two years ago who lived in Wyoming, in the Northwest, who was picked up in a gay bar by some guys, who took him out and they beat him to death. It was all over the media... so it raised a lot of issues in America and there was this article in People magazine I ended up reading. It had a picture of his parents hugging each other at his funeral. And in the foreground were pickets and a woman holding two signs, one saying "God hates ****", and the other, "Matt in hell". The caption said that Christian organisations were standing outside picketing', Andrew shakes his head as he recalls the story. 'It was very discouraging and I remember being really frustrated with the fact that, after two thousand years, there are still people who miss the point so drastically...I guess the prayer that I had at that time, at least what I felt like saying was, "Maybe if the world ended now, it wouldn't be that bad"! So it's a very critical song of the Church, but then I hopefully redeemed it a little bit in the second verse by being very critical of myself, because I'm as guilty. If Jesus can love me, He can love the stupid woman holding the picket sign... He died for us both'!

http://www.premieronline.co.uk/pages/feature/feature_andrewpeterson.htm

The same organtization (Fred Phelps') is pushing to erect a monument in Laramie, Wyoming. The proposed monument will read: "Matthew Shepard entered hell October 12, 1998, at age 21." The town, of course, rejects it, but there are some loopholes which allow them to legally erect it. Also, on their website (godhatesf*gs.com), they have a counter that reads "Matthew Shepard has been in hell 1853 days. I nearly vomited the first time I saw it.

 

[Blackhawk]

The same organtization (Fred Phelps') is pushing to erect a monument in Laramie, Wyoming. The proposed monument will read: "Matthew Shepard entered hell October 12, 1998, at age 21." The town, of course, rejects it, but there are some loopholes which allow them to legally erect it. Also, on their website (godhatesf*gs.com), they have a counter that reads "Matthew Shepard has been in hell 1853 days. I nearly vomited the first time I saw it.

And you should have. That is so anti-Christian and I think anti-human that I could spit. I think that God has a special place in hell for those who claim that they are his but spew hate like Phelps is doing. Christ did not come to condem the world but instead to love it and save it. Sometimes Christians are so much concerned with the nonChristian influence outside of the church that we do not deal effectively enough with the anti-Christian influence inside the church.

John 3:17
17 "For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
(NAU)