Inheriting sin

[ChristianPilot]

blunt: Did we inherit our father's sin?

thorough: I'm involved in another discussion this time involving inheriting sin. I understand how Adam sinned. But was that sin passed on to his kids, and so on and so on, and on to Moses, and so on and so on to my father? Therefore to me?

 

[Take up the Cross]

blunt: Did we inherit our father's sin?

thorough: I'm involved in another discussion this time involving inheriting sin. I understand how Adam sinned. But was that sin passed on to his kids, and so on and so on, and on to Moses, and so on and so on to my father? Therefore to me?

Inherited depravity, to put it in a simple way, is not our fault, but certainly our misfortune. Adam sinned because he was lured by the Satan to 'know the ways of God,' and doubt Him. Adam was created with moral free will, to walk in fellowship with God willingly. But instead, Adam sinned willfully, and the results were pretty bad. Evil entered into the world, and a 'curse' was put upon man.

Man was created good, and as long as he was in fellowship with God He would be good. But because Adam sinned, he was instilled with a nature 'bent to sin.' (original sin, sin-nature, total depravity, etc). It is worthy to note, however, that we did not inherit the guilt or responsibility of Adam's sin. God did not declare all of Adam's descendents 'guilty' because of his sin. We do, however, inherit a sinful nature which is bent towards evil. We are not guilty of Adam's sin, but given time, we all willfully rebel against God and His grace. (for all have fallen short of the glory of God).

We do inherit this 'depravity' or 'sinful nature.' However, where sin abounds, grace abounds much more. God is now drawing us back to Him, through Christ.

Kyle

 

[ChristianPilot]

And Jesus didn't inherit this "bending towards sin" because his father wasn't man right?

 

[Knight]

And Jesus didn't inherit this "bending towards sin" because his father wasn't man right?

Yes, though it's more accurate to say that Jesus didn't inherit sin because He is God. However, you've got the right idea.

 

[Take up the Cross]

Yes, that is correct

His father was the Holy Spirit

Kyle

 

[TWells]

I wouldnt say that its simply our bad luck that God is going to punish for what Adam did.

Basically Adam had total free will, to choose to sin or not to sin. When Adam sinned his nature completely changed and was corrupted, Genesis states (cant remember where) that his first son was made in HIS image, therefore another Human was born but now made in the sinfull nature of Adam.

So the next question is why does God hold us responsible if we are born into a nature we cant help? I think the theological term is "federal headship", it works the same way that Christ is the head and through Him we are imputed rightesnouss. Jesus was able to represent us on the cross perfectly. Likewise God looked upon Adam as OUR perfect representation concerning sin. RC Sproul says the basic complaint is "No damnnation with representation!" But when we get to the heart of it we realize its really that we think had it been I in the Garden I wouldnt have sinned. But God says otherwise, He thinks Adam represented our actions perfectly. Basically when he sinned we sinned.

 

[Knight]

Yes, that is correct

His father was the Holy Spirit

Kyle

Not exactly. The Holy Spirit is the third person of the Trinity but it's inaccurate to say that He is Christ's Father. The Father is the father.

Remember, Christ was not created through Mary. He was before though through Mary He added human nature to Himself. This gets us into the subject of the incarnation.

 

[Take up the Cross]

Not exactly. The Holy Spirit is the third person of the Trinity but it's inaccurate to say that He is Christ's Father. The Father is the father.

Remember, Christ was not created through Mary. He was before though through Mary He added human nature to Himself. This gets us into the subject of the incarnation.

Yes, I suppose you are right. I meant it in a 'metaphorical' way. Christ did exist before, and was incarnated (human nature). What I meant was Mary was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit.

Kyle

 

[Take up the Cross]

I wouldnt say that its simply our bad luck that God is going to punish for what Adam did.

Basically Adam had total free will, to choose to sin or not to sin. When Adam sinned his nature completely changed and was corrupted, Genesis states (cant remember where) that his first son was made in HIS image, therefore another Human was born but now made in the sinfull nature of Adam.

So the next question is why does God hold us responsible if we are born into a nature we cant help? I think the theological term is "federal headship", it works the same way that Christ is the head and through Him we are imputed rightesnouss. Jesus was able to represent us on the cross perfectly. Likewise God looked upon Adam as OUR perfect representation concerning sin. RC Sproul says the basic complaint is "No damnnation with representation!" But when we get to the heart of it we realize its really that we think had it been I in the Garden I wouldnt have sinned. But God says otherwise, He thinks Adam represented our actions perfectly. Basically when he sinned we sinned.

God isn't going to punish us for something Adam did. I said this before - we are not literally guilty of Adam's punishment. You can't "impute" sin like some magical transfer. I cannot impute my sin to you anymore than you can impute wisdom to a fool.

I also said, in agreement with you, that we inheret a sinful nature. And I would agree that anyone would have sinned in Adam's stead. But still, we are not personally guilty of that sin. "Seminally," maybe, but not personally

God's solution for sin was grace through Jesus, but not in the way you stated. Jesus was a provision for forgiveness. God does not simply 'blind' Himself to sin because of Jesus. No, forgiveness is now possibly because of the death of Christ. His attitude towards sin can never change - He will always hate it. But Jesus suffered in our stead, giving Himself willfully as a sacrifice for the provision of our sins. We can now obtain forgiveness. And when we accept Him, we also obtain the Holy Spirit which empowers us to righteousness.

Yes, Adam was made in God's image. He then sinned, and all of his offspring (the human race) inherits a sinful nature. But no one is going to hell for the sinful nature they received. God has provided a Divine Remedy (grace through Jesus Christ) so that man may believe on Him and be saved. The Holy Spirit strives with all men, enabling them to respond to grace, but obviously not all make the favorable choice. So man is still ****** by his own actions, original sin or not. "Where sin abounded, grace abounded much more," giving us all a chance to receive the wonderous unmerited favor God provided for each and every one of us, provided we recieve by faith.

Kyle

 

[ChristianPilot]

Ok, I think I understand now. Thanks everybody.

 

[TWells]

Hey TUTC

God isn't going to punish us for something Adam did. I said this before - we are not literally guilty of Adam's punishment. You can't "impute" sin like some magical transfer. I cannot impute my sin to you anymore than you can impute wisdom to a fool.

I also said, in agreement with you, that we inheret a sinful nature. And I would agree that anyone would have sinned in Adam's stead. But still, we are not personally guilty of that sin. "Seminally," maybe, but not personally

Ok, then how is the sin nature passed to us? I dont know and dont claim to but you seem to be saying that we inherit it but we dont share the guilt...

God's solution for sin was grace through Jesus, but not in the way you stated. Jesus was a provision for forgiveness.

I think there are many, many meanings behind the Cross and the atonement, one of them is the imputed rightenouss of Christ.

God does not simply 'blind' Himself to sin because of Jesus.

Nor, did I ever say he did...

No, forgiveness is now possibly because of the death of Christ. His attitude towards sin can never change - He will always hate it. But Jesus suffered in our stead, giving Himself willfully as a sacrifice for the provision of our sins. We can now obtain forgiveness. And when we accept Him, we also obtain the Holy Spirit which empowers us to righteousness.

When did I claim otherwise?

Yes, Adam was made in God's image. He then sinned, and all of his offspring (the human race) inherits a sinful nature. But no one is going to hell for the sinful nature they received.

Yes they will, God saw Adam as a perfect representative for them and they are responsible for their sin. Only those with faith in Christ will be saved.

God has provided a Divine Remedy (grace through Jesus Christ) so that man may believe on Him and be saved. The Holy Spirit strives with all men, enabling them to respond to grace, but obviously not all make the favorable choice. So man is still ****** by his own actions, original sin or not. "Where sin abounded, grace abounded much more," giving us all a chance to receive the wonderous unmerited favor God provided for each and every one of us, provided we recieve by faith.

Kyle

Not sure what you were getting at with this. You seem to agree we inherit sin, would have done the same in the garden but dont believe we were imputed that because of Adams action.

In Christ,

Travis