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I wonder where all those seminaries came from?
You know, western missionaries????
You're crediting the West for the seminaries in the East?
You know, western missionaries?
You do know that Christianity is an eastern religion.
Let's make this a teachable moment, what did you have in mind?They may have started some, but certainly not all.
Ok what do you believe they mean in context?The mean what they say.
Actually, only Thomas only made it as far as India, and it wasn't very effective in changing the culture.
Christianity in Asia didn't really happen until the colonial to post colonial era.
Christianity began in the middle east, was spread in the greek language and is basically a Western religion.Christianity began in the East. Hence, it is an eastern religion.
I am aware of the missionaries to Asia. I studied them in university and seminary. Moreover, my grandmother's cousin and said cousin's daughters were missionaries to Korea.
In our time, much missionary work is being done by missionaries from Asia. There are even missionaries from Korea in America and Canada. They are evangelizing to the postmodern west in which Christianity is fading.
Children are in need of a savior... they just have no concept of that.. thus they are covered.. Nothing I do, a priest or minister can do... will change that.... It is up to God and His mercy and grace...
Sprinkling water on it's forehead just makes the parents sleep better..
Someday, down the road, the child will reach a mental maturity at which it can be held accountable for it's sin.. and accept or deny Christ....Baptized or not.....
I know that you support infant baptism, you must be conditioned to assume someone disagrees with you whenever someone quotes your post. Now go back and reread those posts knowing thatDo you perhaps have me confused with someone else Tiggy? I support infant baptism.
Irrelevant, bc its normative to include infants under the consept of household when there are infants within the household and not to exclude them. Especially when the Lord never excluded anyone due to age particularly children.You know for sure 100% the households had infants?
Galatians 5:2 King James Version (KJV)Colossians 2:11-12
-CryptoLutheran
What?!? You think that bringing a child up in a Christian home, exposed to Christ's teachings in the Gospels and taught to pray to God, taught to confess sins and to receive Christ in the Eucharist etc... can have no effect on the life of the child, or whether or not they will ever turn to God, and Live?Still... no matter.. The child isn't even aware of the day, week, weather, or the fact that it is going to grow up or anything...
So, we cannot do anything.. not even any "ceremony" or action or sprinkling.. that will have any effect on the child's eternal home when it dies.
And.... Not sprinkling or baptizing will not condemn the child either... It's a nice thought... but..nope.. That child will have to grow up and make it's own choice to accept Christ.
There's no guarantee that the born once will be born again.What?!? You think that bringing a child up in a Christian home, exposed to Christ's teachings in the Gospels and taught to pray to God, taught to confess sins and to receive Christ in the Eucharist etc... can have no effect on the life of the child, or whether or not they will ever turn to God, and Live?
I strongly disagree, and so does God (Proverbs 22:6).
Agreed that I cannot. It's God who saves.
So faith to you is mere intellectual assent - being able to check off a list of doctrines? Where do you find that notion in Scripture?
Wow Jacksy, where do you find that in the Bible?
Again, chapters and verses please.
And here I thought we were saved through Faith..... hmmm.God grants faith through Baptism.
We can choose to reject it, but our salvation has nothing to do with some "choice" we make. We are saved by the grace of God alone, through faith, on Christ's account alone.
No more and no less than an adult. Salvation is by grace alone.
-CryptoLutheran
None of this is even close to mentioning or insinuating that babies need to be baptized or go to hell.Together, various passages gradually draw together a fuller picture:
1At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, “Who, then, is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”
2 He called a little child to him, and placed the child among them. 3 And he said: “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 And whoever welcomes one such child in my name welcomes me."
(Mt 18)
13Then people brought little children to Jesus for him to place his hands on them and pray for them. But the disciples rebuked them.
14 Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.” 15 When he had placed his hands on them, he went on from there.
(Mt 19)
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though it may not be needed, we can gain yet more broader context:
5 “See, I will send the prophet Elijah to you before that great and dreadful day of the Lord comes. 6 He will turn the hearts of the parents to their children, and the hearts of the children to their parents; or else I will come and strike the land with total destruction.”
(Malachi 4)
13But the angel said to him: “Do not be afraid, Zechariah; your prayer has been heard. Your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you are to call him John. 14He will be a joy and delight to you, and many will rejoice because of his birth, 15for he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even before he is born. 16He will bring back many of the people of Israel to the Lord their God. 17And he will go on before the Lord, in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of the parents to their children and the disobedient to the wisdom of the righteous—to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”
(Luke 1)
Why this special emphasis on loving our children, in particular? Consider: it might have plausibly been a different wording that would seem ok: "...to turn the hearts of the people to their neighbors" ('love your neighbor') for instance. But it was not that, but instead it was "to turn the hearts of the parents to their children".
He says "the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these", and we can sense right off I think that there is something about children that is the right way, the way we should be, and which is acceptable to God, as He wants us to be, as confirmed further in Matthew 18.
But, for myself, I'm already content with the straightforward wording of the Matthew 19 quote by itself. It's conclusive to me.
Yeah, cuz you see, babies are actually born on fire, so if you go SPLOOSH! it totally puts those hellfires outNone of this is even close to mentioning or insinuating that babies need to be baptized or go to hell.
Which is no different than what the Church has always done, except that children in the Church grow up in the fullness of the Life of the people of God, because they are initiated into this. Whether or not they choose to remain is the same choice we all have, even those baptized as adults.So..... kinda like we did for our three children. Knowing that I can do nothing to save their soul or even guarantee that they will some day accept Christ....my wife and I dedicated our infants to God..
We basically stand in front of our fellow congregation, and before God.. we dedicate the child to God, accepting that this child is a gift from Him and we will do all things in our power to raise it to know the way of God...
Then, permission is given to the congregation to advise us in this task and help us on this road.
It is also, up to the child, under this guidance and teaching.. to some day.. of their own accord.. accept Christ.. or deny Him if that is what they chose.
True... but only God has the power to guarantee, so we just bring our children up in the fullness of the faith, if we are God-fearing fathers and mothers, and place them in God's hands, hoping that by His grace they will be numbered among the just in His Heavenly Kingdom.There's no guarantee that the born once will be born again.
People can go through the motions, with an underlying and invisible motive of being approved of, and appear to everyone as a Christian since it has been their culture their entire life.
Where did you get that idea from?What?!? You think that bringing a child up in a Christian home, exposed to Christ's teachings in the Gospels and taught to pray to God, taught to confess sins and to receive Christ in the Eucharist etc... can have no effect on the life of the child, or whether or not they will ever turn to God, and Live?
I strongly disagree, and so does God (Proverbs 22:6).
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