Matthew 1:23 says, that Jesus (the messiah) would be called Immanuel, which means "God with us." Yet no one, not even his parents, call him Immanuel at any point in the bible.
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Immanuel
- Thread starter ShatterSphere
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"Called" Immanuel or "named" Immanuel? That'd be interesting. Can you find out the use of word in Greek (there's passage, Isaiah 7:14, in Hebrew, too)?
If it does not use name, I dunno how useful your argument is. For example, I'm "called" Curly by some of my friends because of my hair, and I'm "called" something else by my sister (I'm not going to tell you, because it's her pet name for me. And it's embarassing
), but those are not my names, but what I'm "called". My "nicknames", if you like.Many Christians may understand it as a description of Jesus, rather than a name.
But if it does use the word "name", I dunno where they stand.
Isaiah 7:14 uses the word "name", I think. My Hebrew isn't so strong.
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"Called" Immanuel or "named" Immanuel? That'd be interesting. Can you find out the use of word in Greek (there's passage, Isaiah 7:14, in Hebrew, too)?
If it does not use name, I dunno how useful your argument is. For example, I'm "called" Curly by some of my friends because of my hair, and I'm "called" something else by my sister (I'm not going to tell you, because it's her pet name for me. And it's embarassing
Many Christians may understand it as a description of Jesus, rather than a name.
But if it does use the word "name", I dunno where they stand.
Isaiah 7:14 uses the word "name", I think. My Hebrew isn't so strong.
All I know is that the translation uses the name Immanuel. According to theologians, church, whatever, every word in the bible is right where it belongs--what it is meant to say. That may be it, that christians accept it as a description but who says one thing (interpretation) says "this" and another says "that". For the most part we only see what we want to see, especially in scripture. I can think of quite a few "prophecies" that christians claim Christ fulfilled but are totally taken out of context; but I'll save that for a different post.
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jamiel
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I believe there is a difference between someone (or something) being "called" or "named" (or both even!)
I can't speak for the literary tradition when Isaiah was written -- but in Genesis for instance when the verb call is by itself it does not mean naming. Only when it's joined with the noun name does it become part of a naming formula.
For example:
And Adam knew his wife again, and she bore a son and called his name Seth (Gen. 4:25).
Also:
At that time men began to call upon the name of the Lord (4:26b).
I don't know Hebrew well myself, but perhaps this tradition has continued and there is indeed a difference between being called, and called and named. If true, then it appears this verse in Isaiah is meant to be taken as a description but not His actual name.
God Bless.
I can't speak for the literary tradition when Isaiah was written -- but in Genesis for instance when the verb call is by itself it does not mean naming. Only when it's joined with the noun name does it become part of a naming formula.
For example:
And Adam knew his wife again, and she bore a son and called his name Seth (Gen. 4:25).
Also:
At that time men began to call upon the name of the Lord (4:26b).
I don't know Hebrew well myself, but perhaps this tradition has continued and there is indeed a difference between being called, and called and named. If true, then it appears this verse in Isaiah is meant to be taken as a description but not His actual name.
God Bless.
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S
solarwave
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They my not have said that name, but if you say God come to earth as the human Jesus, I think that counts as saying God is with us.
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DailyBlessings
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It seems to me that this verse is pretty much reflexively true. Matthew calls Jesus Immanuel. Therefore someone is calling him Immanuel. He doesn't say who was going to call him that.
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ReverendDG
Defeater of Dad and AV1611VET
it has to do with the author of matthew reading a badly translated bible and picking a verse out that would get pagans to believe jesus was the son of god.
i find it funny that people are trying to build ad hoc arguments on why jesus is never called immanuel
by the way immanuel means "god is with us" not god with us"
the name was meant to be a sign to ahaz about gods support, as it says in isaiah 7
11Ask thee a sign of the LORD thy God; ask it either in the depth, or in the height above.
the hebrew word translated as "virgin" in greek was young woman, not virgin
isaiah 8 is evidence that the woman in question is not a virgin and its not about jesus.
the prophecy is fulfilled by isaiah
the author of matthew must have been scrambling for validity for his beliefs to tell others
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