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Like CJ, I'd give her all of the qualities my mom had...What qualities would you give her?
Do you think this song is off then?Used.
hmmmmm.
That's not saying much for how much God loves us, if you suggest He uses us.
It doesnt make sense to save us if we are nothing more than useful critters.
He can and did.You are limiting God.
You are suggesting, imho, that He cannot make anyone sinless.
Is this how i am to understand?
Oh brother.. God Used a human woman so Christ could become flesh..
This has strayed away from the Apostolic Teaching. For this is not recorded in any of the scripture. OT nor NT.. Mary was a mere handmaiden of the Lord awaiting the promise of the savior.. Whom was prophecied about.. She was born into the same sin stained world by the same means as any other person.. Only one was born of the Seed of God.. This is His ONLY begotton Son.
By definition, human nature means we are born in Adam (ie. corrupted). All humans are 'born in Adam' (with a sin nature) because we are from the 'seed of Adam' (ie. we have human fathers and mothers). Mary was born in the 'seed of Adam' also.....However, Jesus came from the Holy Spirit and the 'seed of woman' (Gen 3), which seems strange because women don't have seeds, men do. But this theologically could explain why He was not born with a sin nature. And it was His God nature that kept Him from sinning. Anybody have thoughts about Jesus coming from the 'seed of woman'?But don't you believe that God would have wanted His Son to inherit the very best human nature that He could have?
Centuries?..I hope we all agree He could create anything in a heartbeat with just His spoken word. All God needs throughout the O.T. and N.T. (and now) is the Spirit of God indwelling in His chosen vessels to accomplish His sovereign purposes.It took God many centuries to create a woman holy enough to give Him His humanity?
nada, toma tomalo.Do you think this song is off then?
I am sure that Jonah disagrees with you.He didn't "use" her. She voluntarily chose to conceive the Son of God in the flesh. I've seen people write that Mary didn't have to say "yes" because God could have "used" her anyway, since He is all-powerful. Certainly, He has the power to do anything He wants, but He never forces people to do things against their will. God does respect our free will.
By definition, human nature means we are born in Adam (ie. corrupted). All humans are 'born in Adam' (with a sin nature) because we are from the 'seed of Adam' (ie. we have human fathers and mothers). Mary was born in the 'seed of Adam' also.....However, Jesus came from the Holy Spirit and the 'seed of woman' (Gen 3), which seems strange because women don't have seeds, men do. But this theologically could explain why He was not born with a sin nature. And it was His God nature that kept Him from sinning. Anybody have thoughts about Jesus coming from the 'seed of woman'?
There is no box. Yes we are born with a sin nature ie. the inability to not sin....I was asking about a theological thought on the 'seed of woman'. But getting back to corruption of our souls, yes we are born corrupt, which BTW I believe your orthodox church teaches also. But as far as theology of sin goes, I lean toward Augustine's teaching that we are born in Adam (corrupt), we are spiritually separated from God (unable to to communicate with His Spirit), and thus we are unable not to sin (can't discern His will). Augustine said pre-fall, Adam had free choice in that he had both the 'ability to sin' and the 'ability to not sin' and unfortuanately he chose the former. Note, once we are 'in-Christ', ie. 'born-again' with our 'new nature', we now are spiritually enabled and reunited with God and thus have the 'ability to not sin' again. The only difference between us now and Adam pre-fall is the Blood of the Cross of Christ has put a claim on us. He has purchased us and claims us righteous in His eyes and thus He will sanctify us throughout our trials and tribulations. Count it all joy. Now, getting back to Jesus, since Jesus was born God in the flesh, He obviously was spiritually connected to the FATHER AT ALL TIMES, He knew the Father's will, AND THUS He knew Truth (and was/is Truth) and never had the urge to sin.Looks like your trying to work yourself out of corner"Born with a sin nature" - how does that happen? I would say sin is unnatural, so how could we be sin by nature? If Christ's humanity was sin by nature, but just "kept" from sinner against his nature by his divinity, then how are we redeemed? This wouldn't seem to accomplish anything...
This has strayed away from the Apostolic Teaching. For this is not recorded in any of the scripture. OT nor NT.. Mary was a mere handmaiden of the Lord awaiting the promise of the savior.. Whom was prophecied about.. She was born into the same sin stained world by the same means as any other person.. Only one was born of the Seed of God.. This is His ONLY begotton Son.
Yes, He can and yes He did...Like CJ, I'd give her all of the qualities my mom had...
Sweet, cheerful, loving, considerate, generous, humble,
thoughtful, self sacrificing, dependable, easy to talk to,
smart, calm, soothing, .. all that and so much more
wrapped in a pretty package as well.
I cry when I thank God for mom, He is so wonderful
to have given me the best mom in the world.
Do you think this song is off then?
When I sing it, it's right from the heart.
He can and did.
Is Mary 'clothed' with the righteousness of God or not? If she was born sinless and remained sinless, then the blood of Christ that covers us sinners is not needed or meant for her. Right?!! Thus, for those who believe she is the 'woman clothed with the sun' in Rev 12, what does this 'clothing' stand for?
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He didn't "use" her. She voluntarily chose to conceive the Son of God in the flesh. I've seen people write that Mary didn't have to say "yes" because God could have "used" her anyway, since He is all-powerful. Certainly, He has the power to do anything He wants, but He never forces people to do things against their will. God does respect our free will.
By definition, human nature means we are born in Adam (ie. corrupted). All humans are 'born in Adam' (with a sin nature) because we are from the 'seed of Adam' (ie. we have human fathers and mothers). Mary was born in the 'seed of Adam' also.....However, Jesus came from the Holy Spirit and the 'seed of woman' (Gen 3), which seems strange because women don't have seeds, men do. But this theologically could explain why He was not born with a sin nature. And it was His God nature that kept Him from sinning. Anybody have thoughts about Jesus coming from the 'seed of woman'?
Centuries?..I hope we all agree He could create anything in a heartbeat with just His spoken word. All God needs throughout the O.T. and N.T. (and now) is the Spirit of God indwelling in His chosen vessels to accomplish His sovereign purposes.
Think about why the distinction was made.
For if Mary carried sin, then Jesus would have been born from Adam's seed as well.... Being that it says a seed of a woman, it shows us the distinction of the seeds.
Whereas Adam's seeds are all fallen, Mary's seed was set apart.
Apostolic teaching hasnt stopped in 2000 years and we were not suddenly enlightened in 1900 + years.
It has continued and continues that Mary was not born with nor applied to being sinful.
God made Adam and Eve without sin, so its not impossible for God to do as He so chooses.
I also would like to be shown anything before 108Ad concerning that.Your statement requires 3 things ....
1. Identify which of the Apostles taught this; when and where.
2. That the Immaculate Conception of Mary has been taught as such since BEFORE 108 AD
3. It has been taught continuously since at least 108 AD (I suspect universally - meaning in the EO, OO and everywhere else). Therefore, you'd need to show it's universal teaching before 108 AD and then for every year thereafter.
Thank you!
Pax
- Josiah
Your statement requires 3 things ....
1. Identify which of the Apostles taught this; when and where.
2. That the Immaculate Conception of Mary has been taught as such since BEFORE 108 AD
3. It has been taught continuously since at least 108 AD (I suspect universally - meaning in the EO, OO and everywhere else). Therefore, you'd need to show it's universal teaching before 108 AD and then for every year thereafter.
Thank you!
Pax
- Josiah
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Show me one single person on that list who would conceive Christ in their womb, then we will discuss the merit of being sinless for that cause.
Since it's not impossible for God to do as He so chooses, does that make it dogma that Luther was immaculately conceived? Me? You? Pope Benedict? Joseph Smith?
Is it possible for God to make 10 zillion little fuzzy creatures on the Moon of Endor? If so, it such therefore dogma?
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I also would like to be shown anything before 108Ad concerning that.
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