• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

If God loves us why is all reality an illusion?

Status
Not open for further replies.

wonderkins

Active Member
Jul 16, 2017
309
215
Winlock
✟166,468.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Just because you don't understand something in the Bible, that doesn't make t false. A verse I was recently reminded of is in Ecclesiastes:

Just as you do not know the path of the wind and how bones are formed in the womb of the pregnant woman, so you do not know the activity of God who makes all things. (Ecclesiastes 11:5, NASB)

Job 38 is another great reminder of how little we actually know when it comes to God.

What about in Joshua 10 when God made the sun stand still for a day ao the Israelites could win the battle?

Confessing to God that you struggle with a passage is not the same thing as calling him a liar. But you called him a liar when you accused God of deceiving everybody.
 
Upvote 0

Tayla

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Sep 30, 2017
1,694
801
USA
✟169,815.00
Country
United States
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Judges send people to prison based on data gathered about past events. It is the only thing available to us. We don't have time machines.
Yes, and how often are innocent people judged guilty from evidence based on past events?
 
Upvote 0

Kenny'sID

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Feb 28, 2016
18,194
6,997
71
USA
✟585,424.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I've tried very hard to find a way to reason around this but there is no way it is true unless this is intended to be poetic.

God creating it at all is magnificent enough, so to think he did it in 7 days is only a minor and very believable detail the way I see it.
 
Upvote 0

Serving Zion

Seek First His Kingdom & Righteousness
May 7, 2016
2,337
900
Revelation 21:2
✟223,022.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Hey bro, I have just two pieces of info to help you today, plus can I remind you of Matthew 13:24-30? Just stay patient - ask and it will be given, seek and you shall find. This is the last hour, and we know it is the last hour because many antichrists have come. They went out from us so that it can be made manifest that they were not of us.

Now, the two pieces of info are this: in Genesis 1, the original writing does not say "it was finished on day one", "it was finished on day two", "it was finished on day three", etc. It says that on the first day, God was ..., on the second day He was ..., on the third day, ... etc. I have attached a really good little article that I found on CF a while back, that I share quite a bit, so I made it into a pdf that can be printed as a little four-page booklet.

The other thing is, more directly what you asked, consider John 11:6-10. There's a spiritual concept of day and night, light and dark, just as there is spiritual concept of sheep and shepherds, mountains and trees etc. People's behaviours are essentially spiritual, so when we see that all the people are in good spirits, it's easy to walk around without stumbling. When we see that people are grouchy all around, it is more likely that something can go wrong (Proverbs 29:11). Thus, the greater light rules in the daytime, whereas the lesser light rules the night time. Crave for the pure spiritual milk (Hebrews 5:11-14).
 

Attachments

  • hebrew-english-language3.pdf
    88.2 KB · Views: 9
Upvote 0

Inkfingers

Somebody's heretic
Site Supporter
May 17, 2014
5,638
1,547
✟205,762.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single

Those who take Genesis literally have to explain how Jesus was literally small and woolly and went "baaa" (ie: literally a lamb).

Genesis as literal does not work. Genesis as poetry superbly displays how we sin because we rebel from God and that this divides us from paradise.
 
Reactions: DarkSoul999
Upvote 0

Sanoy

Well-Known Member
Apr 27, 2017
3,169
1,421
America
✟133,024.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
First I would like to that you do matter, because Christ died for you while you were a sinner.

I would like to also stress how important ViaCrucis post is to the problems you list.

Genesis definitely has poetic elements regarding temple building. Journal Article. It's a very short article if you skip the footnotes.

Genesis 1 doesn't even list a day for the creation of the world, so old/young earth isn't even a theological discussion. It is an established fact that Yom has a broad meaning, so 7 literal days is one interpretation among many. You know I actually take it more literally than anyone else. The difference is I take it literal to the text rather than literal to acquired tradition. When taken word for word there is nothing actually in conflict with mainstream science. If you are interested in that I have linked a paper I worked on but never finished, but it covers Genesis 1.

(If anyone likes the paper, feel free to use it without giving credit, but it hasn't been proofread for grammar or find tuned. It is unfinished.)
 
Last edited:
Reactions: DarkSoul999
Upvote 0

Denadii

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2017
710
300
77
Western
✟46,027.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
1 God does not follow the Julian calendar...He follows the Hebrew calendar....or rather the Hebrews follow His. A day is from sundown to sundown.

2 Just to keep it simple... Six days was six days...Consecutive. God is not a man who needs millions or billions of years to create a world...He speaks it and it is.

3 Genesis 1:3 to Genesis 1:31 was not the first time God made the earth. What you read in these verses was not God creating the world, but God rebuilding it....He created it in vs 1 of chapter 1

What do you mean when you say salvation is difficult?
And I also do not understand what you mean when you say there is evidence aplenty that the Earth is old...Which it is.....Are you thinking of the teaching that the Earth is only six thousand years old? That a teaching based on the age of man on the Earth...
I believe that your confusion is a result of faulty teaching and a misunderstanding of the Word.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single

The entire YEC "argument" consists of asking open ended questions "how did something come from nothing?" and "how did consciousness come from non-consciousness?" and then THREATENING ANYONE WITH DAMNATION if they attempt to answer those questions. I have never ever met a young Earth creationist who was genuinely interested in going through a textbook/journal and trying to figure out what it is saying.

They have no training in anything other than political/psychological warfare. Christianity in the west is often treated as an EXCLUSIVE CLUB for people with exactly the right thoughts and personal characteristics. You hate anyone who doesn't think exactly as you do.
 
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
The Holy Spirit is still working beyond our logic.
The mighty miracle of the Holy Spirit of Jesus

To understand about God we need to live in humility and forgiving hearts for many many years.

It is rare to get two Christians in the same room who believe exactly the same things about the Bible.

The Holy Spirit does NOT affect your mind automatically. I'm not entirely sure what it (he) does but perhaps the process is symbiotic. The person needs to figure things out to just the right extent in order to speak in the proper "language" with the Holy Spirit.
 
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single

You did not even bother to read through my post. You already decided the moment you clicked on it that I was an enemy of God who simply needs to drop dead.
 
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Huh? How does that follow?

I would encourage you to start attending some kind of denominational church, and to focus on Jesus, rather than on exactly how God created the universe.

I can't just walk into a local church and start revealing my thoughts. If they find out that I don't have exactly the correct thoughts to be a member of the club then there is no telling what they will do.

Just look at this very thread. Christians want me hanged from the highest tree...

whatever I'm used to it. Been hated my entire life.
 
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single

Who are you to God? Do you think that you are better than me?

You are just as messed up as me. You need Grace just as much. But it probably makes you feel pretty good to snub your nose and laugh at people who are in a place of pain.

"To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everyone else, Jesus told this parable: 10"Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: 'God, I thank you that I am not like other people-robbers, evildoers, adulterers-or even like this tax collector. 12I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.' 13"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.' 14"I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted." (Luke 18:9-14)
 
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single

God sent a curse in the form of yourself

Leave me alone
 
Upvote 0

Radagast

comes and goes
Site Supporter
Dec 10, 2003
23,896
9,864
✟344,531.00
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I can't just walk into a local church and start revealing my thoughts.

I was thinking that you should walk into a local church and have the pastor of that church explain the Bible to you.

Because, quite frankly, I don't think you're understanding it all correctly.

If you look at what the New Testament says, needing the Scriptures to be explained is the usual situation.
 
Upvote 0

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
39,595
29,158
Pacific Northwest
✟815,588.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
If they find out that I don't have exactly the correct thoughts to be a member of the club then there is no telling what they will do.

If it's a healthy, ordinary, mainstream church, the most likely scenario is that they'll listen to your thoughts in a respectful way, and try and answer your questions to the best of their ability.

Most clergy aren't ruthless fanatics eager to wage war against the "heathen", they're just pastors.

-CryptoLutheran
 
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single

90% on this forum are ruthless fanatics. Sorry to say it
 
Upvote 0

ViaCrucis

Confessional Lutheran
Oct 2, 2011
39,595
29,158
Pacific Northwest
✟815,588.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
90% on this forum are ruthless fanatics. Sorry to say it

CF doesn't necessarily fairly represent the reality of the Christian mainstream.

-CryptoLutheran
 
Upvote 0

DarkSoul999

Well-Known Member
Aug 5, 2017
437
163
40
New Britain
✟52,213.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
CF doesn't necessarily fairly represent the reality of the Christian mainstream.

-CryptoLutheran

The internet is safer. If I meet a religious fanatic in real life they might burn my house down.

So it is lose-lose either way....
 
Upvote 0
Sep 18, 2016
223
27
United States
✟20,043.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Pantheist
Marital Status
Celibate
Politics
US-Republican
Simply replying to the title alone, reality is not an illusion but what you are experiencing now is. You are not currently experiencing reality at all. God did not create your delusions, you did because your parents were also lost in their own delusional worlds. Who you think you are now, which does not exist in reality, has no idea what reality is.

Only when you have and can forgive anyone for anything would you possibly be able to begin to see what is real because in the state of eternal reality everything is always forgiven, its a law which now as a human you are choosing not to follow, effectively causing a total blindness. Anything that is not eternal does not exist, that's how you know what is and isn't real.

1 Corinthians 2:14
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Hawkins

Member
Site Supporter
Apr 27, 2005
2,689
419
Canada
✟307,189.00
Country
Canada
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married

It's literal to humans especially to ancient humans. However it is based on the fact that humans even today don't know exactly what time is. Human conception about time is proved to be mistaken or incomplete by science. In science such as quantum physics, time is more like a delusion. Einstein ever put that time is not a stable physics unit, instead speed is. It is because the relative speed of light is absolute that both time and space will "give way" to facilitate such an absolute. This behavior of time/space however is completely out of any human conception, as humans will treat time as stably and evenly advancing forward.

Earth is for God to provide a fair environment for humans to make a choice. Humans here will be assessed (judged) to see if they can live with God and His angels in a forever realm which we call Heaven. It's not a deception but a necessity instead.
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.