If evolution is not true, what was the process of creation?

dms1972 said:

Is not evolution also based on speculation? Its an interpretation (one interpretation) of certain observations in nature, seems to go against other areas of study (such as animal breeding) which suggest organisms say true to type. Now we have yet other observations (bacterial flagellum seemingly irreducibly complex) that we did not have back in Darwin's day and we have to interpret those also.

I don't think the book of Genesis is revealing nuts and bolts science, but I don't think should go against science if its inspired and that has been the view for thousands of years. It says somewhere in the Talmud 'God spoke them, and Moses wrote them with tears.' The question for me is whether Darwian evolution is compatible with the book of Genesis. Some people seem to think its not.

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No, the evolution of life is based in part on the fossilized remains of the many epochs of the living history of the earth spanning hundreds of millions of years.

Genesis is a nationalist, religio-political document finalized during the second captivity of Abraham’s descendants intended to maintain the faith of an ethno state.

Darwin is just one of many evolutionist.

dms1972 said:

Just to know where you are at, may I ask do you believe in a personal God who speaks, do you believe there is such a thing as revelation?

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Yes, I believe in revelations both large and small. I have a personal relationship with God.

dms1972 said:

If you believe evolution is false, what then do you think or believe was the process of creation? Fair enough if you disagree with darwinian evolution, but think some other sort of theistic evolution process was involved, but if you don't agree with any kind of evolutionary theory how then did birds, animals, fish, humans, come into existence. I am asking about how God created these? Can that be found out by science?

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The process of creation....
1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was unformed and void, darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God hovered over the surface of the water. 3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. So there was evening, and there was morning, one day.

6 God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the water; let it divide the water from the water.” 7 God made the dome and divided the water under the dome from the water above the dome; that is how it was, 8 and God called the dome Sky. So there was evening, and there was morning, a second day.

9 God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered together into one place, and let dry land appear,” and that is how it was. 10 God called the dry land Earth, the gathering together of the water he called Seas, and God saw that it was good.

11 God said, “Let the earth put forth grass, seed-producing plants, and fruit trees, each yielding its own kind of seed-bearing fruit, on the earth”; and that is how it was. 12 The earth brought forth grass, plants each yielding its own kind of seed, and trees each producing its own kind of seed-bearing fruit; and God saw that it was good. 13 So there was evening, and there was morning, a third day.

(A: ii) 14 God said, “Let there be lights in the dome of the sky to divide the day from the night; let them be for signs, seasons, days and years; 15 and let them be for lights in the dome of the sky to give light to the earth”; and that is how it was. 16 God made the two great lights — the larger light to rule the day and the smaller light to rule the night — and the stars. 17 God put them in the dome of the sky to give light to the earth, 18 to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good. 19 So there was evening, and there was morning, a fourth day.

20 God said, “Let the water swarm with swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth in the open dome of the sky.” 21 God created the great sea creatures and every living thing that creeps, so that the water swarmed with all kinds of them, and there was every kind of winged bird; and God saw that it was good. 22 Then God blessed them, saying, “Be fruitful, multiply and fill the water of the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth.” 23 So there was evening, and there was morning, a fifth day.

(A: iii) 24 God said, “Let the earth bring forth each kind of living creature — each kind of livestock, crawling animal and wild beast”; and that is how it was. 25 God made each kind of wild beast, each kind of livestock and every kind of animal that crawls along the ground; and God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, “Let us make humankind in our image, in the likeness of ourselves; and let them rule over the fish in the sea, the birds in the air, the animals, and over all the earth, and over every crawling creature that crawls on the earth.”

27 So God created humankind in his own image;
in the image of God he created him:
male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them: God said to them, “Be fruitful, multiply, fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea, the birds in the air and every living creature that crawls on the earth.” 29 Then God said, “Here! Throughout the whole earth I am giving you as food every seed-bearing plant and every tree with seed-bearing fruit. 30 And to every wild animal, bird in the air and creature crawling on the earth, in which there is a living soul, I am giving as food every kind of green plant.” And that is how it was. 31 God saw everything that he had made, and indeed it was very good. So there was evening, and there was morning, a sixth day.

MoneyGuy said:

Coming from a believer who also believes evolution is fact, I disagree. If one didn't believe in God the idea of a supreme creator would be crazy ridiculous and would require more faith, I'd say, than a theist believing in evolution.

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How can you be a believer and not take Gods word as He said it? God said! And it was. God said! And it was. He SPOKE it into existence.

Denadii said:

How can you be a believer and not take Gods word as He said it?

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He does. He just doesn't take it as you said it.

I was on the Temple Mount 2 weeks ago. Over time things change. Like Jesse said, “not one stone will be left on top of another.” The first two temples are entirely gone, a mosque stands where they stood.

The Barbarian said:

He does. He just doesn't take it as you said it.

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Does he take it as the bible says it?

Denadii said:

Does he take it as the bible says it?

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From what he's said, it's entirely consistent with the Bible.

The Barbarian said:

From what he's said, it's entirely consistent with the Bible.

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And...is his typing finger broken?

Denadii said:

How can you be a believer and not take Gods word as He said it? God said! And it was. God said! And it was. He SPOKE it into existence.

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The question remains "How?" not uncertainty as to the efficacy of God's spoken commands. A reading of Genesis 1 with sufficient delicacy (GKC) offers a distinct interpretation for an "evolutionary" process....

There are divisions among Christians as to the way life's diversity happened. It's not an essential doctrine of Christianity, and while the evidence indicates evolution, those who deny evolution are no less Christians than those who accept it. We need to keep that in mind.

Jamsie said:

The question remains "How?" not uncertainty as to the efficacy of God's spoken commands. A reading of Genesis 1 with sufficient delicacy (GKC) offers a distinct interpretation for an "evolutionary" process....

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The Word is clear. He created. That's past tense. Done deal. Finished. It was a complete work. It was finished as you see it.

Denadii said:

The Word is clear. He created. That's past tense. Done deal. Finished. It was a complete work. It was finished as you see it.

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Do you think God created you?

Denadii said:

The Word is clear. He created. That's past tense. Done deal. Finished. It was a complete work. It was finished as you see it.

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I've posted these thoughts before... I agreed with you that God's initiative in creation was "And God said,...". So we agree that on each day it is clear that God has not Done something but rather Said something, not to have made something but rather to have commanded something. So what Genesis one states is that God spoke and commanded the Land, Water, etc. to produce/bring forth..."And it was so". What follows must be explanatory or post-fulfillment because we must all agree that God spoke...not immediate or otherwise made. It would seem rational to me that the fiat to the created matter invokes a process....

The Barbarian said:

Do you think God created you?

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Of course...Like you, I am a spirit, I have a soul, and I live in a body.

Your body is also you.

Jeramias 1:5 Before I formed thee in the bowels of thy mother, I knew thee: and before thou camest forth out of the womb, I sanctified thee, and made thee a prophet unto the nations.

So, as St. Augustine noted, there was an initial creation, from which every other created thing came to be as it developed over time.