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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
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- Thread starter gitlance
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I don't feel like the faith is attacked. I think things in the ECUSA are going great and those who are being disruptive will either leave or fade away. I don't want to be in a church where everyone is told what to believe like the RC's. If some people think the "real presence" is just spiritual, and others insist on "transubstantiation" then fine. We have a broad church. Not mentioning the real presence on a visitor's web site is not anti-christian. My presbyterian and baptist friends are not anti-christian.gtsecc said:
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Gtsecc, "the fullness of the faith" is not a phrase that really every passes my lips. I would say that I think we are "righter" than they are -- *maybe*. Maybe I would say that. If they asked. But I don't feel a need to defend against anything. If they want to eat crackers and drink grape juice and use little tiny cups and have those holes in the back of the pews to store the little tine cups (which is how I grew up btw) then fine. I don't belong to that kind of church, though, because I want to have the Eucharist as it is in ECUSA churches. But why should I have to defend anything "against" them? It's just a different mentality I guess.gtsecc said:
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gtsecc said:
If you think you find fullness of faith in the Lord's Supper, you are sadly mistaken.
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Sure, but it isn't exactly a preference thing is it?higgs2 said:
It isn't like you have 31 flavors of Jesus, and you get to pick which one makes you feel the best is it?
We want Anglicans to know that we believe in the real presence, because that is the faith. It isn't a matter of style or personal choice.
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pmcleanj
Lord Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner
Could you expand on this, a bit, Naomi? What do you mean by "the fullness of faith" -- is it an emotive experience, an expression of conversion, an action, an intellectual understanding? How does the Lord's Supper fall short?Naomi4Christ said:
I am at heart a traditional low-churcher, but I take the Lord's Supper to heart as the most powerful central act of the worshipping community. Certainly, its meaning comes in part from the context of Word, Prayer, Community and Mission in which it is celebrated. Without those, it is relatively useless, like a diamond without a setting. But for me, it is the worship act that unites and centres all those other parts of the Christian Life and places them in their proper context of sacredness and community.
The Eucharist isn't something I get into many debates defending. It simply is -- but participating in it remains far from trivial in my worship life.
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gtsecc said:
Well as usual Pamela expressed it better than I ever could. Her description of the importance, the centrality of the Eucharist as well as her statement in the last 2sentences of the post.
What are we disagreeing about, gtsecc? I'm lost.
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pmcleanj said:
Well, it was Glen that brought it up. I was merely pointing out that there is far more to the Christian life than one part of a worship act.
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higgs2 said:
You and I may be agreeing.
I am saying:
What the Eucharist is, isnt a matter of personal opinion.
What the Eucharist is, is a central tenant of Christianity such that subtle differences are worth arguing about.
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pmcleanj
Lord Jesus, have mercy on me, a sinner
Actually, I wonder if I could shift the focus of that last sentence just a hair.gtsecc said:
The Eucharist is the central worship act, which is also a visceral and incarnational act, by which we are formed into a community. Like baptism, it is transformational and grafts us into God's family, because by it we become blood of His Blood and flesh of His flesh.
So, subtle differences are worth understanding and listening to. We might particularly care to understand how each of us is engaged and affected by participation in the Lord's Supper. "Arguing about" it could, I suppose, include that kind of listening discourse that builds understanding. When "arguing about" it starts to build hurt, alienation and misunderstanding, I'd say it destroys the very communion that is the highest manifestation of the Lord's Supper.
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BTW, I think I know why I can't replicate your formatting bug.
In your CF Control Panel "Edit Options", are you using the WYSIWYG option? My guess is, if you set it back to the "enhanced options" setting, your problem might go away. Of course, you also won't have the WYSIWYG feature, but then, you don't really have it now, either, right?
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