i want to believe. struggling

[steffie575]

Hi all. I'm a 28 yr old woman. As a teen I was involved in church etc but don't know If I "cared" at the time what I believed. As I got older I read some things and experienced some things that have made me think. For a time I considered myself atheist but as of now I would say I am agnostic. Here is my problem. I want so badly to believe in God . It seems like everytime I try to open myself Up to christianity I immediately remind myself of all the scientific "proof" I have that he doesn't exist.

Furthermore I believe in ideals that I know the Bible says are wrong. I am a supporter of gay people and am pro choice and generally a lot of things the christian religion doesn't believe in. I can't ever change those opinions so I feel that as a christian I would be a hypocrite? I don't know. I sound so clueless.

The point is....I want to have faith in something bigger than evolution...bigger than the world.....bigger than myself. But how can I when my own mind shoots me down?

I've even researced visiting a church but nwvwr follow thru. Im just lost.

 

[intojoy]

Hi all. I'm a 28 yr old woman. As a teen I was involved in church etc but don't know If I "cared" at the time what I believed. As I got older I read some things and experienced some things that have made me think. For a time I considered myself atheist but as of now I would say I am agnostic. Here is my problem. I want so badly to believe in God . It seems like everytime I try to open myself Up to christianity I immediately remind myself of all the scientific "proof" I have that he doesn't exist.

Furthermore I believe in ideals that I know the Bible says are wrong. I am a supporter of gay people and am pro choice and generally a lot of things the christian religion doesn't believe in. I can't ever change those opinions so I feel that as a christian I would be a hypocrite? I don't know. I sound so clueless.

The point is....I want to have faith in something bigger than evolution...bigger than the world.....bigger than myself. But how can I when my own mind shoots me down?

I've even researced visiting a church but nwvwr follow thru. Im just lost.

Check out Ariel.org

 

[intojoy]

Did you know that salvation is absolutely free? and that we do not have to do anything to get saved? Well what do the Scriptures teach? Lets see.

Well, John 3:16 is the most famous verse ever quoted in the world but I want you to see and hear what Jesus said just two verses earlier in verse 14 Jesus is pointing to a historical event to make a point about God's love.

And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up; (John 3:14 ASV)

The event happened when God led the Jews out from Egypt. As was their habit the people grumbled and sinned while out in the wilderness on their way to the promised land. God responds by judging and disciplining them and on this occasion God sent serpents into their midst:

And Jehovah sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died. (Numbers 21:6 ASV)

The people of Israel then do their normal thing - they ask Moses to pray for them for forgiveness from The Lord. Moses prays and God forgives them:

And the people came to Moses, and said, We have sinned, because we have spoken against Jehovah, and against thee; pray unto Jehovah, that he take away the serpents from us. And Moses prayed for the people. (Numbers 21:7 ASV)

God forgives the people but on one condition: Moses is to hold the serpent up for the congregation to gaze upon.

Then the Lord said to Moses, "Make a fiery serpent, and set it on a standard; and it shall come about, that everyone who is bitten, when he looks at it, he will live." (Numbers 21:8 NASB)

It was not how guilty they felt or how long they stared at it in the heat of the desert sun, it was simply the look of faith.

And Moses made a bronze serpent and set it on the standard; and it came about, that if a serpent bit any man, when he looked to the bronze serpent, he lived. (Numbers 21:9 NASB)

If they were hard hearted and stiff necked they died in their sins.

Let's continue on now with Jesus's words:

so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. (John 3:15, 16 NASB)

God has lifted up our object of faith, Jesus the Messiah on a cross. We are to humble ourselves, coming to the realization that personal righteousness and holiness is outside of our capabilities, and look to our God and Father who said:

so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. (John 3:15, 17 NASB)

If we refuse to believe that salvation is by grace alone thru faith alone in Messiah alone plus nothing then we are not really believing on Him that was sent and are under the following judgement:

so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (John 3:15, 18 NASB)

If you have followed the teachings of any other variation from what the bible clearly states concerning the content of faith for salvation then you have accepted the accusation of other religions teaching concerning not only these simple words of Christ but all of the other passages of scripture concerning God's free offer of imputed righteousness.

 

[parsley]

I immediately remind myself of all the scientific "proof" I have that he doesn't exist.

I can see how you might have problems with the creation story, but are you sure that's what you meant? Scientific proof that an intelligent creative being doesn't exist? I don't think scientists generally have claimed to say that a god doesn't exist -- their issue is in whether a supreme being could have created what we see before us.

If one didn't, what did. If it all grew from nothing, how did it start? Where did God come from, if He came before the atom.... no one has been able to resolve these things. Eternity in all directions is hard to comprehend.

This is an immense universe. We don't even know all the insects that exist on the earth, let alone other planets. We can push our rationale to incredible lengths, but still be humbled by the chicken:egg dilemma. That's fine.

About rights and policies... you grew up in an era where you saw a lot of conflict, and were compelled to take sides. The topics were in front of you continually, and you saw people treated unjustly on both sides of the conflict. One side seemed to receive less understanding, and you worked to bring greater understanding.

It is not wrong to try to provide equity and justice among people.

When I was growing up, both of those topics were just hinted at when teachers wanted to get discussions going. They were not hot topics in churches back then, and not representative of what Christians talk about. Even now -- I only see the rigid convictions online and in the news, not in conversations with people. Which makes me conclude that someone is trying to divide, who might not even be involved in taking a stance.

The lifestyle topic comes up when churches need to decide what their stance will be in hiring ministers. The life:choice topic comes up when people volunteer to tangibly support women who want to deliver their babies. Most people do not have the time or energy (or interest) to pursue these issues with a passion.

Jesus spoke of how it was important to come as a child. Set down the analysis, striving, worry about being right/wrong, painful words you might have heard spoken, the bad examples that some Christians have been, the confusion, the statements that don't match up.

Then address Jesus as a person who has tried to reach you on a friendly level.

Look at what bothers you about how gays are sometimes treated. Are you treating Jesus the same way? Ask yourself if you are concluding things about Him that you don't agree with, so you have chosen not to talk with Him...

What I see in people these days, is a frustration with all the competition. In every realm of life. People are so abrasive, that it is hard to listen to anyone any more. Everyone wants to win, and very few sit back quietly to listen. Hurt or be hurt.

Jesus willingly went to His trial. When asked to defend Himself, He chose not to open His mouth.
That's why He died -- He chose not to argue His case.

 

[lesliedellow]

I immediately remind myself of all the scientific "proof" I have that he doesn't exist.

The fact that you put the word proof in quotation marks suggests that you know full well that there is no scientific proof that God doesn't exist. What is more, there can't be, because the physical sciences concern themselves exclusively with the observable universe, and they can have nothing to say about the existence, or otherwise, of a God who transcends that universe.

If creationists had been as prevalent in Britain as they apparently are in America, the chances are that I would never have become a Christian, because I would not have been prepared to commit the kind of intellectual suicide their type of Christianity seems to demand. However, outside of America they are a small minority.

It may be that part of your problem is the psychological one of identifying yourself with a group of people you had previously thought were at least a bit naff. I have had that problem, more than once, but if there is a voice which keeps banging away at the back of your mind, eventually you give in.

 

[paul1149]

I would put any secondary issues aside for the time being. God can deal with them when it is their time. Focus on why you think there is or should be a God and on why you need Him, and on the main impediment, whatever it may be. If it's the scientific thing, that's not so hard to overcome, because the Architect of all that is is not against science, He's against the false religion that worships man's scientific ability disproportionately and shuts God out, because that's a lie that harms us. Find authors and speakers who understand this - there are plenty of good ones.

 

[dhh712]

Hi all. I'm a 28 yr old woman. As a teen I was involved in church etc but don't know If I "cared" at the time what I believed. As I got older I read some things and experienced some things that have made me think. For a time I considered myself atheist but as of now I would say I am agnostic. Here is my problem. I want so badly to believe in God . It seems like everytime I try to open myself Up to christianity I immediately remind myself of all the scientific "proof" I have that he doesn't exist.

Furthermore I believe in ideals that I know the Bible says are wrong. I am a supporter of gay people and am pro choice and generally a lot of things the christian religion doesn't believe in. I can't ever change those opinions so I feel that as a christian I would be a hypocrite? I don't know. I sound so clueless.

The point is....I want to have faith in something bigger than evolution...bigger than the world.....bigger than myself. But how can I when my own mind shoots me down?

I've even researced visiting a church but nwvwr follow thru. Im just lost.

I felt so much the way you did. I was raised Catholic, though once I began actually studying the Bible it was under a non-denominational teacher. I wanted to believe, but when reminded of how there was no evidence for God and how much of it can be described only as a feeling, my desire to believe faded; eventually my interest in studying Scripture fell away.

I don't think I can give you any advice that will be of any effect to you though and only write in response because I feel that I could have written very nearly precisely what you have written when I was your age (five years ago).

My own conversion came about very specifically, and in a very radical way which I just don't think is going to be the "answer" for everyone. I just could be pessimistic, I don't know. I'll tell you what happened though and how faith was given to me, by the Holy Spirit.

It came about when I was drawn to the study of the Presbyterian faith. God made sense to me through the reading of their doctrine (the Confessions of Faith); the best way I can describe it is that everything just "clicked". I really feel I was called to this faith, though I realize not everyone may be called in this specific way (if it doesn't sit right with one's conscience, it is my opinion that it is not something which should be accepted by that person then).

I feel that it probably isn't a very popular belief though because it seems to me to be very antithetical to how we are naturally. It involves amongst other things complete submission to God, the realization of the emptiness of the world, an unnatural willingness to degrade the self--the fleshly self--and acknowledge the pre-eminence of God over every aspect of our lives.

What you say really strikes a cord with me though--about wanting faith. I wanted it so badly some years ago. It just didn't happen for me, and I realize now that what was going on when I was studying the Bible some years ago was that I was doing it on my own without God's help. You can't force faith. It has to be given to you, and then you can receive it if you want to--that is always your choice.

I also would like to say though that I really feel that once those he calls accepts Him, there will be a radical transformation in their lives; and I don't feel this is a thing which should be feared. I say this because I once I also had very liberal ideas too and never could imagine thinking any other way (though I'm not saying that having faith will change everyone's thinking; I feel mine has changed because it was not the way He wanted me to be--the way I was living was not pleasing to Him so He gave me the ability to change it).

Well, I hope I haven't offended you. I never intend to do that. I just try to express honestly how I feel, my experience with faith, and how it has affected my life. My prayers are always for God's will over my own and any others; and I hope that He will guide you to what He has planned for you and that it may be a life filled with His love and grace.

Sincerely,
Anne

 

[FutureAndAHope]

Hi if you are after proof of God then this link may help, it is a website that records scientifically verifyable cases of divine healing, healing in Jesus name. WCDN

Also consider the experiences I have had at Have you ever asked yourself about the existence of God it records all the miracles God has done for me like, speaking to me, telling me the future, healing the sick, providing for my needs. Below is one of my favorite stories off the site.

One morning I got up and walked into the hall and I heard a voice that I believed was God say "How would you like to be stabbed in the Valley". The Valley was known as the rough end of town, and the voice scared me a little, I wondered if I had done something to offend God. I had planned to go down to the Valley to ask people out to church as was my habit at the time. In the end I went anyway regardless of the fear. I walked up to the first person I met and asked him if he would like to go out to church. He said to me "I am an atheist, I don't believe in God". I just said "fine", but hoped to change his mind. He then proceeded to unbutton his shirt and showed me scar marks up and down his chest and stomach. He said to me, "I was attacked by a knife wielding man in the Valley some time ago and spent months recovering in hospital, How could God allow that to happen to me". Then I knew why God had said in the morning "How would I like to be stabbed?". God understood this man, but had a good plan for him. Some weeks latter this man came out to church and became a Christian.

 

[Iosias]

Come and have a chat with us here: http://www.christianforums.com/f401/

 

[Jb9]

Hi all. I'm a 28 yr old woman. As a teen I was involved in church etc but don't know If I "cared" at the time what I believed. As I got older I read some things and experienced some things that have made me think. For a time I considered myself atheist but as of now I would say I am agnostic. Here is my problem. I want so badly to believe in God . It seems like everytime I try to open myself Up to christianity I immediately remind myself of all the scientific "proof" I have that he doesn't exist.

Furthermore I believe in ideals that I know the Bible says are wrong. I am a supporter of gay people and am pro choice and generally a lot of things the christian religion doesn't believe in. I can't ever change those opinions so I feel that as a christian I would be a hypocrite? I don't know. I sound so clueless.

The point is....I want to have faith in something bigger than evolution...bigger than the world.....bigger than myself. But how can I when my own mind shoots me down?

I've even researced visiting a church but nwvwr follow thru. Im just lost.

I feel ya. I've had many times struggling to seek God. Currently i am following Him and I don't ever want to lose Him. Once you find Him, He will never back down on those who are desperately searching for Him. Man chase God, He chases too. Man falls from God, He chases you.
And for all the scientific stuff, forget it. Yea some of them are real but Altus part of evolution and Big Bang theory is all fraud. When I had hard times believing, I relied on one of my favorite verse that helped me come to God.

Proverbs 3:5
"Trust in The Lord with all your heart, and lean not on your own understanding."

Yea that means whatever you think that's preventing you to come to God our Father isn't worth it. Because us compared to our God, is a speck of dust compared to our God. So all that scientific "proof" you can put that aside and follow Jesus. Just trust Him. That's all.

 

[FreeinChrist]

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[fishing]

May I recommend John Shelby Spong?

johnshelbyspong.com

 

[FutureAndAHope]

Hi Steffie,

I am glad that you are exploring faith again God is always pleased when his children seek him. As for scientific proof that God exists, the following website lists sicentifically verifiable accounts of people who were healed using prayer in Jesus name WCDN if you are just after some general examples of God at work in healing, speaking, predicting future events, see my personal website it lists encounters I have had with God since becoming a Christian Have you ever asked yourself about the existence of God

As for your issue to do with homosexuality. God does not want Christians to discriminate against gays. He wants us to show them love and care. Remember the woman who Jesus caught in the act of adultery, it was punishable by death, yet Jesus pardoned her and showed her love. Sure he said to her go and sin no more, but he did not judge her with criticism. We are to lovingly show homosexuals that God's desire for them is to have wives, and children, not unbridled sexual desire. But we are not to judge.

John 15:17 These things I command you, so that you will love one another.

 

[Etheri]

I'm an ex-atheist too.

I had problems with faith too (like I was always unsure if I just believe in nothing), but hey evolution is just a theory -(theory = thinking, mind). I heard Darwin died with Bible in his hands.

God make your faith STRONG! Amen.

 

[Receiver]

...Furthermore I believe in ideals that I know the Bible says are wrong. I am a supporter of gay people and am pro choice

Jesus understood people, he promoted God's ways which are best for mankind, he converted people, changed their heart & mind, unlike the law which "made nothing perfect".

and generally a lot of things the christian religion doesn't believe in.

Jesus didn't come to bring religion. In the beginning, man walked with God as a friend / son. There was no religion between them. Jesus came to restore that.
What you and most people call "church" are lost middlemen (and women).

The point is....I want to have faith in something bigger than evolution...bigger than the world.....bigger than myself. But how can I when my own mind shoots me down?

The testimony of God through people that had received what all the disciples got (Acts 2:4, 33, John 14:17-20) so impacted my heart that my mind had to admit I didn't know anything but that God's way worked.
The questions I had didn't need answering before I called on God to receive what I realised I needed - direct input from Him - His Spirit, who I received soon after and have "never thirsted again", that was 27 years ago.

I've even researced visiting a church but nwvwr follow thru. Im just lost.

But honest and seen by Jesus who says "you didn't choose me, I chose you", or "God doesn't call the equipped, he equips the called", "come as a child".

 

[singpeace]

Hi all. I'm a 28 yr old woman. As a teen I was involved in church etc but don't know If I "cared" at the time what I believed. As I got older I read some things and experienced some things that have made me think. For a time I considered myself atheist but as of now I would say I am agnostic. Here is my problem. I want so badly to believe in God . It seems like everytime I try to open myself Up to christianity I immediately remind myself of all the scientific "proof" I have that he doesn't exist.

Furthermore I believe in ideals that I know the Bible says are wrong. I am a supporter of gay people and am pro choice and generally a lot of things the christian religion doesn't believe in. I can't ever change those opinions so I feel that as a christian I would be a hypocrite? I don't know. I sound so clueless.

The point is....I want to have faith in something bigger than evolution...bigger than the world.....bigger than myself. But how can I when my own mind shoots me down?

I've even researced visiting a church but nwvwr follow thru. Im just lost.

Steffie,
I think you are awesome, and I so appreciate your frankness and honesty.

I hope I can help you find some answers.

As far as scientific proof goes, please visit the following site - it is made up of many astrophysicists and other scientists with impressive fellowships and degrees - they are all Christian and they show how science actually confirms what is in the Bible.

Reasons To Believe : Where Modern Science & Faith Converge


As far as supporting gay people; I would say that Christ loves them as much as He loves anyone. Being gay is no greater nor lesser sin than lying, stealing, and gossiping. So let God direct you one day at a time - one baby step at a time - to where He wants you to be on that subject. Believe me, He does not hate them.

As far as pro choice goes; once again I say that God loves every woman who aborts her baby, though I believe with all my heart that abortion hurts the Lord's heart. Still, nothing can stop him from loving - especially loving hurting, confused women. Allow God to guide you in this area also - one little step at a time until He brings you to where He wants you to be on this topic as well.

God loves you. He sees you. He understands. Give him a chance and I believe He will truly surprise you to find out just how little He is religious and how Great He is in love, forgiveness, understanding, and friendship.

Keep searching, my girl, and God bless you richly!!!