I need help

[CruciFixed]

Okay sooo I am always trying to find the right words to debate people with when it comes to my conservative beliefs and Christian beliefs and I belong to another vbulletin based website where I am one of the only conservatives on there so its like liberals come at me at all ends.......poking me.

I dont always have the right words....anyone here want to help me if I get an example quote or two? Like not directly from the person but kinda just an idea of what is or has been said? I get stuck. I am smarter than this I know it but I am also a newbie conservative. I used to be a liberal. blech.:o

 

[Zecryphon]

Sure, I'll help ya out. Let's see what they're hittin' you with.

 

[GQ Chris]

Okay sooo I am always trying to find the right words to debate people with when it comes to my conservative beliefs and Christian beliefs and I belong to another vbulletin based website where I am one of the only conservatives on there so its like liberals come at me at all ends.......poking me.

I dont always have the right words....anyone here want to help me if I get an example quote or two? Like not directly from the person but kinda just an idea of what is or has been said? I get stuck. I am smarter than this I know it but I am also a newbie conservative. I used to be a liberal. blech.:o

Congratulations. I was Never a liberal, I just didn't really find out that I was officially a Conservative until the 9-11 attacks happened.

 

[Blank123]

what exactly is the issue you're discussing? is it political or theological?

 

[Nadiine]

Sure, I'll help ya out. Let's see what they're hittin' you with.

that was nice

Okay sooo I am always trying to find the right words to debate people with when it comes to my conservative beliefs and Christian beliefs and I belong to another vbulletin based website where I am one of the only conservatives on there so its like liberals come at me at all ends.......poking me.

I dont always have the right words....anyone here want to help me if I get an example quote or two? Like not directly from the person but kinda just an idea of what is or has been said? I get stuck. I am smarter than this I know it but I am also a newbie conservative. I used to be a liberal. blech.:o

I used to be liberal too- God helped me see the light

I've seen some other boards out there & I have to say it just looks
like lynching mobs on witch hunts (the witches in this case are Christians & conservatives or both).

Yesterday I browsed some other forum site links & literally saw people saying that they HOPED Christians committed suicide after Obama got elected. (referring to a link about suicide over Obama)....
I about fell over seeing the seething hatred they had.

I tried to even start my own thread to expose how evil it looked, but the potty language & filth was so bad that I would of gotten a violation for linking their posts... I couldn't believe my eyes. (& one of them on there was a former "Christian" CF member)

If what you're going thru is anything like that, I wouldn't waste my time trying to defend myself to their hatefilled groups. Outside of an utter miracle by God, many of those types of people are no doubt turned over to their own depravity as Romans 1 explains.
Sad and irritating at the same time.

What's even worse is those same people TRY to preach to us about what true love is! :o Kinda hard for the blind to lead the supposedly blind while they're in their own ditches.

 

[sealacamp]

I have been debating on another site for over three years now. The anti-Christian and anti-conservative sentiment accompanied by "poking" as you called it is certainly outside the bounds of appropriateness. In the conservative arena there are a least a few others beside myself so we put up a good and reasonable offense. Unfortunately most of it falls on deaf ears and dull minds. Still we try. As for the Christian area of that forum it is filled with seething hatred that is beyond anything I have ever experienced before. Being online has opened my eyes for sure.

I could not think of what advice to give anyone when debating like this other than to try to remain calm, state your case, support it with evidence, and then stick to the truth no matter what. If the truth changes then it should come from the Lord no any other person otherwise you may find you have been deceived. I wish you good fortune in your endeavors and pray that God will give you the words you seek.

Sealacamp

 

[Nadiine]

I have been debating on another site for over three years now. The anti-Christian and anti-conservative sentiment accompanied by "poking" as you called it is certainly outside the bounds of appropriateness. In the conservative arena there are a least a few others beside myself so we put up a good and reasonable offense. Unfortunately most of it falls on deaf ears and dull minds. Still we try. As for the Christian area of that forum it is filled with seething hatred that is beyond anything I have ever experienced before. Being online has opened my eyes for sure.

I could not think of what advice to give anyone when debating like this other than to try to remain calm, state your case, support it with evidence, and then stick to the truth no matter what. If the truth changes then it should come from the Lord no any other person otherwise you may find you have been deceived. I wish you good fortune in your endeavors and pray that God will give you the words you seek.

Sealacamp

Yes, and one other thing I learned in years of online debate is at some point to heed God's advice -
not to throw pearls to those who trample them repeatedly and treat them as common & unclean.
We end up doing a HUGE disservice in hanging around to preach to those who are refusing to hear. I believe we do more damage in many cases when we hang around wolves and continue preaching at them.

There comes a time to shake the dust - the more they hear, the more they harden and hate.
(harming them more for their judgment).

 

[sealacamp]

There comes a time to shake the dust

I agree totally. I'm still having trouble trying to figure out just when that time comes. Although it has been shown to me that it is obvious at times. Especially when people become more and more agitated with the truth to the point that their language is vile, violent, and degrading. When that happens it should be obvious that it is time to shake and go.

Sealacamp

 

[CyberPaladin]

Rlunatic I would be happy to try and help you out.

 

[Zecryphon]

I agree totally. I'm still having trouble trying to figure out just when that time comes. Although it has been shown to me that it is obvious at times. Especially when people become more and more agitated with the truth to the point that their language is vile, violent, and degrading. When that happens it should be obvious that it is time to shake and go.

Sealacamp

It varies. But I think a good rule of thumb is this. When you're tempted to sink to their level and exchange insult for insult, that's a good time to bow out of the thread or the debate. My problem is that I usually sink to their level, exchange insult for insult and THEN bow out of the thread.

 

[CruciFixed]

I told someone that said she doesn't believe there are any unforgivable sins (but she's Christian)

"Jesus says there is"
quoted the bible on blasphemy of the Holy Spirit:
Said "How do you, as a Christian, defend your belief that there is no unforgivable sin at all?"

She went on a rampage. It was ridiculous.

 

[Blank123]

well without seeing what her rampage was based on i'd say you don't have anything left to do with this person. She stated her belief, you stated yours and provided Scripture and now the onus would be on her to come up with a Biblical argument to refute the verse you gave to back up your position. If her reaction to being confronted with Scripture is just to lash out at you then she's pretty much just proven she has nothing else to argue and she's just frustrated that you proved her wrong. I'd let it drop.

 

[CruciFixed]

Someone started a poll at our board that said "pro-life or pro-choice? and why?"

So I said

Pro-life and only in the case that a mother's life was endager would abortion be acceptable imo.

The reason:
Quote:
"If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine."

-Exodus 21:22
Quote:
As you do not know what is the way of the spirit, or how the bones grow in the womb of her who is with child, so you do not know the works of God who makes all things (Ecclesiastes 11:5)
Quote:
For You have formed my inward parts; You have covered me in my mother’s womb. I will praise You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; marvelous are Your works, and that my soul knows very well. My frame was not hidden from You, when I was made in secret, and skillfully wrought in the lowest parts of the earth. Your eyes saw my substance, being yet unformed. And in Your book they all were written, the days fashioned for me, when as yet there were none of them (Psalm 139:13-16).
Wait...there's more
Quote:
Then the word of the Lord came unto me, saying: ‘Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; before you were born I sanctified you; and I ordained you a prophet to the nations' (Jeremiah 1:4-5).
Yep sounds pretty clear to me.

Quote:
Thou shalt not kill. Exodus 20:13
But just to be sure this is considered killing lets take a look at the facts:

killing: the act of terminating a life


I'm Christian and being a believer cannot stand by a pro-choice vote.

Before anyone says forgiveness....we were saved and forgiven for the intent and purpose to walk and lead a holy Christ like life. NOT so we can indulge in excuse, and even condone sinful and immoral acts.

 

[CruciFixed]

They said

*sigh* And that is exactly why I've chosen Buddhism as my path - thats all fine for YOU to be a Christian, but life isn't black and white and extremism in either direction is just not my cup of tea. Not to mention, Christians only make up 30% of the world, so I guess like the Muslim religion is trying to trump my beliefs now I have to contend with Christians trying to tell me how to live my life and that I should live by their religion.

*shakes head* And I'm not against Christians, but for goodness sakes, let me live my life. There is all this talk about "Its not my place to judge" well the above looks like judging to me.

 

[CruciFixed]

and

Wow, I have a similar God who said something about not judging... Don't remember exactly what, but I think someone wrote it down in a book somewhere.

 

[Blank123]

ahhh... well it gets a little more complicated when talking about this sorta stuff with nonChristians - they don't recognize the authority of Scripture the same as Christians so trying to use that to prove your point is usually going to fall on deaf ears, the only real way to get them to recognize the authity of Scripture is to work with them in an evangelistic frame of mind and reach out to them with the gospel - but thats next to impossible when you're arguing with them. When they're regenerated through the Holy Spirit then they'll take a far different view of Scripture but until then no amount of quoting the Bible is going to help matters, especially when talking about a highly contoversial and polarizing subject such as abortion.

the best way to approach the subject with unbelievers is stick to your basics. keep asking questions about the actual topic, get them to actually think through their responses without relying on the age old responses that the fetus isn't alive and its not human - ask things like well what human mother carries or gives birth to a nonhuman child? what would DNA evidence say about whether or not its human? etc... try to get them thinking about the topic in a different way, keep the conversation focused solely on the topic at hand - don't allow your anger to get the best of you and stoop to personal attacks or comments (not saying i think you are, but just a reminder) and don't react when the person you're arguing with tries to make the discussion personal (which she's definitely trying to do) - always keep and steer the conversations (when it starts getting off topic) on the subject at hand. Just remember the person you're talking with *is not* the enemy so temper your posts and responses to her with love

 

[CruciFixed]

Also, as a person seriously studying Christianity right now, you are so off the mark. Your quotes are all from the Old Testament and Jesus changed a lot of that.

I just got this.

 

[Nadiine]

I just got this.

Actually He didn't CHANGE it, He fulfilled the demands of law for atonement (for believers), and brought grace ... grace only means judgment is postponed for sin.

All moral laws remained & are reiterated into the NT.

I get perturbed reading people's statements on OT law vs. NT grace as if
we have a new God & bible somehow.

 

[desmalia]

They said

*sigh* And that is exactly why I've chosen Buddhism as my path - thats all fine for YOU to be a Christian, but life isn't black and white and extremism in either direction is just not my cup of tea. Not to mention, Christians only make up 30% of the world, so I guess like the Muslim religion is trying to trump my beliefs now I have to contend with Christians trying to tell me how to live my life and that I should live by their religion.

*shakes head* And I'm not against Christians, but for goodness sakes, let me live my life. There is all this talk about "Its not my place to judge" well the above looks like judging to me.

Well what you've got is at least three debates going on here. One is about abortion, one about the Bible and it's authority, and one about tolerance between religions. I'm sure there are more. That's where these kinds of discussions can become so impossible. As soon as you start to make a point about one part, others can and will jump in with various tangents to keep you from the initial subject. So you almost have to split it up.

The world does not like exclusivism, because that means making a choice. And it means admitting that there is a "wrong way". Relativism is the name of the game these days. Just ask Oprah. You'll note they'll tell you that you're intolerant for believing Christ is the only way. But in saying that, they prove themselves intolerant of anything other than what they have decided to believe.

It's interesting that poster thinks that 30% of the world's population is Christian. In reality it's far smaller than that.

In discussions like the one you're having there, I personally like to look for other posters who are willing to have an actual conversation instead of just casting judgment and attitude. And when responding to the ones who are trying to push your buttons, be very careful to pray about the situation and for them as individuals before you reply. Be salt and light to them and do not stoop to their level. There's nothing wrong with taking a little time to think and pray about your responses first. In fact I highly recommend it.

 

[CruciFixed]

Thank you I knew he didn't change it and in fact He followed the law of God the whole time he was on Earth. I just couldn't think of where to look in my bible to find proof that He kept to the Word. Like when Satan tested Him and Jesus just kept referring back to God's word instead of falling into temptation.