I don't get it?

[JohnR7]

"The light we see today, as the cosmic microwave background, has traveled over 13 billion years to reach us. Within this light are infinitesimal patterns that mark the seeds of what later grew into clusters of galaxies and the vast structure we see all around us today."

http://www.scienceblog.com/community/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=999

I don't get it. 13 billion years ago, the light would have had to travel about 2 feet to get to us. Now they claim that 13 billion years later, the light has traveled 13 billion years to get here?

 

[notto]

Another falsification of creation theory.

13 billion years ago, our earth, solar system, and galaxy were NOT the center of the universe (in fact, they probably did not exist).

The light has been playing "catch up" with the expansion of the universe to get to us from another point in the expanding universe.

Just to clarify your question based on your past posts here, do you mean "I don't get it?" or "I don't accept it?".

 

[LewisWildermuth]

What is there not to get? sounds pretty simple to me.

 

[lithium.]

Today at 03:07 PM LewisWildermuth said this in Post #3 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=651242#post651242)

What is there not to get? sounds pretty simple to me.

Yep, very simple.

 

[JohnR7]

Today at 04:03 PM seesaw said this in Post #4

Yep, very simple.

According to the theory, the light took 13 billion years to get here. But 13 billion years ago, the universe was smaller than the size of a peanut. So what is moving faster, the expansion of the universe of light?

 

[JohnR7]

Today at 03:04 PM notto said this in Post #2

Another falsification of creation theory. 

So, just how does this falsify creation theory?

 

[notto]

Today at 09:47 PM JohnR7 said this in Post #6 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=651472#post651472)

So, just how does this falsify creation theory?

Sorry, should have said
"Another falsification for Young Earth creation theory"
(God creating the universe and everything in it some 10,000 year ago).

 

[David Gould]

Today at 08:46 AM JohnR7 said this in Post #5

According to the theory, the light took 13 billion years to get here. But 13 billion years ago, the universe was smaller than the size of a peanut. So what is moving faster, the expansion of the universe of light?

The universe expanded much faster than the speed of light - thousands of light years in a fraction of a second. I am unsure at exactly what rate the universe is expanding today but I suspect that it is still faster than the speed of light.

 

[notto]

How fast is the universe expanding?

How can the universe expand faster than the speed of light?

If the universe is 15 billion years old, how can it be larger than 15 billion light years across?

 

[notto]

Today at 09:46 PM JohnR7 said this in Post #5 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=651469#post651469)

According to the theory, the light took 13 billion years to get here. But 13 billion years ago, the universe was smaller than the size of a peanut. So what is moving faster, the expansion of the universe of light?

What gave you the idea that 13 billion years ago, the universe was smaller than the size of a peanut?

 

[Lacmeh]

John, you realize, that room and time are not seperable? Look up Einstein´s theories.
Gravity also affects the room, light won´t be able to excape if gravity is high enough. Hence the term Black Hole...(Light goes in but can´t escape anymore)

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Yesterday at 10:33 AM JohnR7 said this in Post #1 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=651045#post651045)

"The light we see today, as the cosmic microwave background, has traveled over 13 billion years to reach us. Within this light are infinitesimal patterns that mark the seeds of what later grew into clusters of galaxies and the vast structure we see all around us today."

http://www.scienceblog.com/community/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=999

I don't get it. 13 billion years ago, the light would have had to travel about 2 feet to get to us. Now they claim that 13 billion years later, the light has traveled 13 billion years to get here?

Let me see if I can explain this simply…

Say I had a car that’s speed was like the speed of light, when put in gear it instantly reached it’s speed and brakes stopped it instantly. We will ignore inertia since it does not apply to light either.

The distance I can go in this car per hour is always the same because the speed is always the same so I measure distance traveled by car-hour.

I take my car for a drive on elastic world, a world where the surface is stretching out in all directions at a rate faster than a car-hour lets say 2 car hours per hour. Now towns on elastic world are held together by gravity so one end of town does not stretch away from the other end, but in between towns this is not the case.

I decide to visit my friend that lives in another town on elastic world so I head out of town A and leave for town B. As soon as I leave town A it starts to recede quite quickly, to some one standing at the edge of town A it would look like I was moving three times as fast as I was even though my car is not going any faster. From town B I would look like I was going backwards but not as fast as town A. I will never reach town B and I can never make it back to town A unless I can somehow exceed the speed at which elastic world is streaking.

Does that help any?

 

[lucaspa]

Yesterday at 04:46 PM JohnR7 said this in Post #5

According to the theory, the light took 13 billion years to get here. But 13 billion years ago, the universe was smaller than the size of a peanut. So what is moving faster, the expansion of the universe of light?

Part of your problem is that the radiation was generated 300,000 years after  the Big Bang. By that time the universe was not the size of a peanut but was several thousand light years across.  It took that long for the universe to cool to the point where matter could condense and the universe become transparent to light.

If the space we occupy were moving faster than the speed of light, the light could never catch us.  However, notice how redshifted the background radiation is: way down into the microwave (radar) end of the spectrum. Yet at the time it was generated it was generated by very hot matter and was up in the cosmic ray end of the spectrum.  Since the universe is expanding close to the speed of light (and accelerating), it took 13 billion years for the light to catch up, being redshifted in the process.

 

[JohnR7]

Yesterday at 06:22 PM notto said this in Post #10

What gave you the idea that 13 billion years ago, the universe was smaller than the size of a peanut?

That is just the popular theory right now, that the universe started off about 12 to 14 billion years ago from something smaller than a mustard seed.

 

[JohnR7]

Today at 11:08 AM lucaspa said this in Post #13

By that time the universe was not the size of a peanut but was several thousand light years across. 

So it took 13 billion years for light to travel a distance of several thousand light years?

 

[MartinM]

Today at 07:26 PM JohnR7 said this in Post #15 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=653248#post653248)

So it took 13 billion years for light to travel a distance of several thousand light years?

No, it took 13 billion years for light to travel a distance which started off at several thousand lightyears.

 

[Nathan David]

John, right in the article you linked to it says the radiation they are talking about is from "380,000 years after the big bang". Yes, at the time immediately after the big bang the universe was smaller than a peanut (actually, much smaller than a peanut). But 380,000 years later it was much bigger. When the light started traveling the universe was (I think) 300,000 or so light years across, but the universe has been expanding since then.

To put it another way, if astronomers want to see 13 billion year old radiation, they have to look 13 billion light years away.

 

[LewisWildermuth]

Today at 11:26 AM JohnR7 said this in Post #15 (http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?postid=653248#post653248)

So it took 13 billion years for light to travel a distance of several thousand light years?

Did you read the post I made on elastic world?

Light traveled a distance of 13 billion light years but the univers is expanding even faster so light will never get from one side to the other no matter how long it travels.

 

[lucaspa]

Today at 02:26 PM JohnR7 said this in Post #15

So it took 13 billion years for light to travel a distance of several thousand light years?

If you have a car traveling 60 miles an hour half a mile ahead of a car traveling 61 miles an hour, how long does it take for the second car to catch the first? A half a mile? Think it thru, John.

By the time the light had traveled 380,000 light years, the point in space to be occupied by earth was a lot further away.

 

[JohnR7]

Yesterday at 06:34 PM lucaspa said this in Post #19 By the time the light had traveled 380,000 light years, the point in space to be occupied by earth was a lot further away.

Ok, I get it now. Everything is traveling at the same speed. So as we travel away from the "big bang" the light that first appeared is pretty much traveling right along with us.