I am righteous

[reeann]

All4Christ, I ask the same of you and others. Sorry for my part in this debate. For what its worth All4, I enjoyed the exchange with you and would be happy to discuss it further on the appropriate forum

Blessings to you.

 

[Gerry]

Yesterday at 10:40 PM All4Christ said this in Post #37




First off...i thought we weren't arguing about anything anymore on this thread.  Second off.....this is the definition of merriam webster's "sin"  (the second of the 2 definitions

EITHER

a: transgression of the law of God

OR 

b: a vitiated state of human nature in which the self is estranged from God


Sin can mean a state too....henceforth that could mean we cannot live in the state of sin anymore...just a thought.

I'm not trying to argue.  I'm just trying to point out that there are more than one definitions of sin, and depending on which one you use could determine which way you interpret it.

GOD BLESS YOU AND KEEP YOU!

 

I would love to answer this since it is a reply to a question I asked. But since it has been ruled a debate, I have no choice but to let it go. Too bad.
I did have a valid theological point to make, and I think that is what leads to a deeper fellowship. Nevertheless...

 

[reeann]

arggg, lets start a new thread in.... what is the appropriate forum?

This one was blessing me

 

[endure]

no disrespect to the administrator, your the man and what you say goes. thats all cool.

but i mean, having deeper fellowship isnt just huggin and pattin people on the back and crying on shoulders.
and im not saying we need to be fussing either.
but i mean, what can christians fellowship over if it isnt the word of God? i completely agree that it shouldnt get out of hand.
what kind of fellowship is there if we cant discuss our diffrent veiws? and whats the point if you cant do it over the scripture?

i dont think anything got out of hand. well, i do disagree with some peoples thoughts and sayings here, but i mean, we really havent done anything wrong.

all were doing is discussing our beliefs and trying to explain why we believe this way.
and im sorry, i do get a little fustrated at times and sometimes people get on my nerves, but i mean...thats ok.

 

[endure]

altya,

im sorry, this was your thread, if you didnt like something i was doing at any moment i wished you had told me, in respect for you and your thread i would have stopped whatever you didnt like.
im sorry.

hey yall,
lets go the uhm theology, soteriology forum.
ill make a new thread there were we can discuss this freely.
(no disrespect or mock is meant to you blackwing)

 

[reeann]

Ok endure, link your thread here. I get lost in those other forums there is so much out there

 

[altya]

Today at 05:49 AM endure said this in Post #45

altya,

im sorry, this was your thread, if you didnt like something i was doing at any moment i wished you had told me, in respect for you and your thread i would have stopped whatever you didnt like.
im sorry.

hey yall,
lets go the uhm theology, soteriology forum.
ill make a new thread there were we can discuss this freely.
(no disrespect or mock is meant to you blackwing)

It's ok - this forum is not a place to debat. Yes start a thread about this topic there - God bless you

 

[Chris†opher Paul]

altya-

Jesus says you have to remain in Him to not come to judgement. Remember the parable of the vine...

 

[nomad]

5th April 2003 at 11:30 PM altya said this in Post #16

The righteousness of Christ implanted in us, fortifies the heart against the attacks of Satan. We cannot walk now in our own righteousness because we are still babies in Christ. We are learning how to obtain our own righteousness. We do have to remember that Christ did a perfect work on the cross and we cannot do anything to get rid of our sins. It’s already gone. We have to let go of the condemnation that the demons preach to us. Often our own flesh condemns us. We need to snap out of this condemnation even when we really failed to be perfect.

Romans 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

We have all sinned and come short of the glory of God. God’s grace is so enormous that He did not make provision only for our sins of the past but also for future sins. This gave us no permission to go on sinning but it is to help us to get free from sinning. God is faithful to forgive us our sins but we will bear the consequences of it.

Romans 5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so, by the righteousness of one the gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

God's righteousness helps when Satan sets up a trap and we in our flesh commit sins, we can just go to our Father and ask forgiveness. We walk in the righteousness of Jesus. It is like a buying something on credit. I will use the symbol of buying a lunch suit on credit. You only pay a deposit and then a monthly installment. You repent of your sins and accept the blood of Jesus to clean you form all unrighteousness. The shop owner will deliver the lunch suit. This item is not paid in full but you have the use of it. You get righteousness from Jesus although you are not righteous at all. You are working on it like the monthly installment “bit by bit” no one gets it all at once. When we lack to pay our bills, the shop will send us warnings and if we still refuse to pay, we will lose our stuff. The very same with righteousness if we stop moving in the direction to become righteous we will lose our salvation. But the Spirit of God will remind us and keep on working on us to move in this direction. When you buy on credit, there is a clause that when you die, the bought item will be paid in full. The same with you if you die before achieve the point of righteousness you are covered with Jesus righteousness.

Righteousness is also working two ways. We use the righteousness of Jesus to walk in while we are busy to get our own righteousness in line with the word of God. It’s like borrowing a “garment” while we are busy to make our own once.

After rereading this post through a couple of times I have come to somewhat of a conclusion that those whom I have heard speaking of loosing their "salvation" in the past must have been refering to what you have written here.  I remember the conversation that was taking place when the "loss of salvation" came into the conversation.  I was not a partaker just a listener.  I aligned it with what you have said here and now understand what they were referring to.

The language barrier we have in using words or phrases to point out a specific idea or thought can cause a great deal of problem.  I pray for the day we all come of "one" language" with each other.

Good parable.  I enjoyed it.

 

[altya]

11th April 2003 at 09:03 PM Chris†opher Paul said this in Post #48

altya-

Jesus says you have to remain in Him to not come to judgement. Remember the parable of the vine...

Please explaine

 

[altya]

Nomad I am glad you enjoyed the parable but I am not quite sure about what you mean. I'm sorry that my English is not so good.

 

[endure]

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/41868.html

theres the link.

but really its easy to find.

go the home page of the forums.
then  go to theology.
then go the soteriology or however you spell it.

and the thread is called "the perfection thread continued"

 

[altya]

Thanks - I will join you there

 

[nomad]

Yesterday at 03:33 AM altya said this in Post #51

Nomad I am glad you enjoyed the parable but I am not quite sure about what you mean. I'm sorry that my English is not so good.

Don't feel bad.  My native language is English and I still have yet to master it.

I was referring to what you were saying about



 

if we stop moving in the direction to become righteous we will lose our salvation

Backsliding as some would call this.  We never loose the eternal gift of going to heaven but we can loose our redemption.  When I say redemption I mean the same as what you are referring to with the word "salvation" in your parable.  Certain bodies of believers develop their own language to define biblical things.  I believe when I heard these gentlemen speaking of loosing there "Salvation" they were referring to the redemption or also what you were referring to. 

It's okay I understand.  The beautiful part of being a Christian is the ability to ask God to interpret for us what others say in case we don't understand fully.  It eliminates misunderstandings caused by language barriers.

God Bless

 

[OracleX]

Redemption is our salvation. If you are redeemed you are saved.

Matthew 20:28 Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

Acts 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

1 Corinthians 6:19-20 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

Once you are placed in Christs hands, once He has paid the price, you are saved. Nobody can take that away from you.

John 10:26-30 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one.

As Christians we need to certain of our placement in Gods hand and that there is nothing that come between us.

Romans 8:35-39 "Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord."

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/41150.html

 

[altya]

Today at 08:34 AM nomad said this in Post #54

It's okay I understand.  The beautiful part of being a Christian is the ability to ask God to interpret for us what others say in case we don't understand fully.  It eliminates misunderstandings caused by language barriers.

God Bless

Yes I love this - if we ask God there will be no problems.