How many ppl did God create in the beginning?

[DavidPT]

Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Genesis 2:6 But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.


If women already existed before what is recorded in Genesis 2, IOW, what is recorded in Genesis 1:26-27 is not referring to what is recorded in Genesis 2:7 and Genesis 2:21-23, what were they called at the time since Genesis 2:23 records she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man?

 

[topher694]

Why do some try so hard to over complicate things? Gen 1 and 2 are telling the same story about the same people from slightly different perspectives. We do it all the time in our everyday lives when we tell stories.

 

[DavidPT]

Why do some try so hard to over complicate things? Gen 1 and 2 are telling the same story about the same people from slightly different perspectives. We do it all the time in our everyday lives when we tell stories.

And that is the exact same point I'm trying to bring out in the OP, that Genesis 1 and 2 are telling the same story but from different perspectives. Yet, some would still have us believe that God created more than just 2 ppl in the beginning, meaning Adam and Eve, and that He created them before He created Adam and Eve. If that is true, why then does Genesis 2:23 record that the human female species shall be called woman, because she was taken out of man?

 

[topher694]

And that is the exact same point I'm trying to bring out in the OP, that Genesis 1 and 2 are telling the same story but from different perspectives. Yet, some would still have us believe that God created more than just 2 ppl in the beginning, meaning Adam and Eve, and that He created them before He created Adam and Eve. If that is true, why then does Genesis 2:23 record that the human female species shall be called woman, because she was taken out of man?

Well, then we are in agreement.

 

[Trusting in Him]

Why is that a problem that woman was taken out of man? It a picture of the blood and water which flowed from the side of Jesus Christ on the cross, when the spear pierced His side. We are washed clean from sin by His shed blood. God knows how to made a woman from Adams rib. Yes! God created two people, Adam came first and Eve came later and that is a picture too.

Adam is in type a picture of Jesus and had to come first, so that we can understand the picture properly. The first Adam failed, but Jesus is the second Adam, He is perfect, sinless, He did not fail and gave His life for our redemption and our salvation. His also is before all things. Eve is a picture of the bride of Christ. He is Lord of all and the one, who came from heaven to save us! Blessed by His name!

I am very interested it what the pictures, types, antitypes and shadows in the old testament are able to teach us. Ancient Jewish scholars, also used to look into such things too! We often find new tastament truths hidden in the pictures and types of the old testament.

 

[eleos1954]

Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Genesis 2:6 But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.


If women already existed before what is recorded in Genesis 2, IOW, what is recorded in Genesis 1:26-27 is not referring to what is recorded in Genesis 2:7 and Genesis 2:21-23, what were they called at the time since Genesis 2:23 records she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man?

Consider the following passages that refer back to a historic Adam and Eve.

• Jesus affirms the special creation of Adam and Eve at the beginning (Mark 10:6).
• Luke connects the human lineage of Jesus to Adam (Luke 3:38).
• Jesus links the doctrine of marriage to Adam and Eve (Matthew 19:4–6).
• Paul connects the doctrine of the church to Adam and Eve (Ephesians 5:30–32).
• Paul argues for family order because of Adam and Eve (1 Corinthians 11:8–12).
• Paul attaches the origin of sin in the world to Eve (1 Timothy 2:13–14).
• Paul also connects death from sin to Adam (Romans 5:12–14).

 

[DavidPT]

Why is that a problem that woman was taken out of man?

The reason why it would be a problem relating to the OP is because, if it is assumed by some that God created other people before He created Adam and Eve, and the fact Genesis 1 says God created he him; male and female created he them, this indicates that the human female species has been created. Clearly, the human female species are women and called women, yet Adam never called one that until one was brought to him and that she had been taken from man, thus why he called her woman. That contradicts that human females were already created before Adam was formed and that God then made a woman out of Adam's rib.

As to the pictures, types, antitypes and shadows in the old testament, that you brought up, I do fully agree with you about that except that wasn't the point I was trying to make in the OP at the time.

Take the following for example.

Genesis 3:16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

A deeper meaning could perhaps be meaning something such as this---Unto the church he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children into the kingdom; and thy desire shall be to Christ, and he shall rule over thee.

 

[DavidPT]

Consider the following passages that refer back to a historic Adam and Eve.

• Jesus affirms the special creation of Adam and Eve at the beginning (Mark 10:6).
• Luke connects the human lineage of Jesus to Adam (Luke 3:38).
• Jesus links the doctrine of marriage to Adam and Eve (Matthew 19:4–6).
• Paul connects the doctrine of the church to Adam and Eve (Ephesians 5:30–32).
• Paul argues for family order because of Adam and Eve (1 Corinthians 11:8–12).
• Paul attaches the origin of sin in the world to Eve (1 Timothy 2:13–14).
• Paul also connects death from sin to Adam (Romans 5:12–14).

Does this mean that you agree or disagree that God only made 2 people in the beginning, thus the rest of mankind is the result of procreation?

 

[eleos1954]

Does this mean that you agree or disagree that God only made 2 people in the beginning, thus the rest of mankind is the result of procreation?

2 people and humanity came from them. Jesus never disputed it ... nor do I.

 

[Rachel20]

Why is that a problem that woman was taken out of man?

It's not a problem, but boy would the unbelievers have a field day if it were reversed. Genetically, a female can be cloned from a male, but not the other way around.

 

[truthisfreedom2019]

13 Cain said to the Lord, “My punishment is too great to endure! 14 Behold, You have driven me this day from the face of the ground; and I will be hidden from Your face, and I will be a wanderer and a drifter on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me.” Genesis 4:13-14. I have wondered who the people were that Cain was afraid of and he seemed to think they had nature like his, which included murder.

 

[DavidPT]

2 people and humanity came from them. Jesus never disputed it ... nor do I.

The reason why I wan't certain at the time is because you said this---"the special creation"---which could imply a number of things. For example. Those that think God created other people first, then created Adam and Eve, and the fact Jesus comes through the linage of Adam and Eve, it would make that a special creation compared to the earlier creation. I now know you weren't meaning anything like that, but at the time I just wasn't certain, thus why I asked.

 

[DavidPT]

13 Cain said to the Lord, “My punishment is too great to endure! 14 Behold, You have driven me this day from the face of the ground; and I will be hidden from Your face, and I will be a wanderer and a drifter on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me.” Genesis 4:13-14. I have wondered who the people were that Cain was afraid of and he seemed to think they had nature like his, which included murder.

Adam and Eve had other children, and that we are not told who was born to them and when. This of course implies incest. The question is, was incest a sin from the very beginning?

 

[HTacianas]

Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Genesis 2:6 But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.


If women already existed before what is recorded in Genesis 2, IOW, what is recorded in Genesis 1:26-27 is not referring to what is recorded in Genesis 2:7 and Genesis 2:21-23, what were they called at the time since Genesis 2:23 records she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man?

Genesis is a harmonization of two different creation stories. Genesis 1 has it one way, while Genesis 2 has it another. The two books were spliced together at some unknown time.

 

[JAL]

Adam and Eve had other children, and that we are not told who was born to them and when. This of course implies incest. The question is, was incest a sin from the very beginning?

Yes. I believe that incest was a sin from the very beginning. I'm an old-earth creationist (OEC) who believes that God created human-like species prior to Adam and Eve - that's how Cain obtained his wife. Allow me to clarify further.

Adam was the first "man" (and Eve the first woman) only in the strict sense of a creature stamped with a conscience. All prior human-like species were, therefore, essentially animals incapable of real sin (regardless of how intellectual they were).

After Adam sinned, in my view, God removed most of his sin-stained physical soul to a place of suspended animation. Every time a zygote is formed, God mates a tiny speck of that sin-stained soul to it. In other words YOU are Adam (a speck of his soul) even though you don't remember being in the Garden and freely choosing to eat the forbidden fruit. You have a sinful nature, not inherited from Adam, but rather because you are the Adam who sinned.

At some point after Adam sinned, in my view, God started distributing specks of the Adam-soul to those other human-like species as well, whereby they too became real men and women. Again, Cain obtained his wife from one of these species.

God has never been a fan of incest.

 

[DavidPT]

Yes. I believe that incest was a sin from the very beginning. I'm an old-earth creationist (OEC) who believes that God created human-like species prior to Adam and Eve - that's how Cain obtained his wife. Allow me to clarify further.

Adam was the first "man" (and Eve the first woman) only in the strict sense of a creature stamped with a conscience. All prior human-like species were, therefore, essentially animals incapable of real sin (regardless of how intellectual they were).

After Adam sinned, in my view, God removed most of his sin-stained physical soul to a place of suspended animation. Every time a zygote is formed, God mates a tiny speck of that sin-stained soul to it. In other words YOU are Adam (a speck of his soul) even though you don't remember being in the Garden and freely choosing to eat the forbidden fruit. You have a sinful nature, not inherited from Adam, but rather because you are the Adam who sinned.

At some point after Adam sinned, in my view, God started distributing specks of the Adam-soul to those other human-like species as well, whereby they too became real men and women. Again, Cain obtained his wife from one of these species.

God has never been a fan of incest.

A wife would be a woman, obviously. According to Genesis 2 there was no such thing as a woman until God made one from Adam's rib. In the animal kingdom though, there was obviously already male and female species even before Adam was formed. But we are talking about humans. Until Adam was formed there was not yet any male humans, let alone female humans.

Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.


Why would Adam say she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man, if women already existed prior to this?


As to your post in general, unless you can somewhat explain how you are concluding all of those things, one couldn't possibly take you seriously in the meantime, even if you are being serious.

 

[JAL]

Why would Adam say she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man, if women already existed prior to this?

You ignored what I said. All species prior to Adam and Eve were animals for lack of a conscience. Adam was the first man, and Eve the first woman, by that definition.

 

[JAL]

As to your post in general, unless you can somewhat explain how you are concluding all of those things, one couldn't possibly take you seriously in the meantime, even if you are being serious.

All historic attempts to reconcile Adam with a fair and loving God have failed. Therefore mine is the only plausible explanation of the Fall.

For example most accounts of Adam insinuate that the Lord unfairly visits the painful and fatal consequences of his transgression upon his 100 billion perfectly innocent descendants. The following analogy demonstrates how much these conclusions vilify Yahweh. Suppose a perpetrator in the large American state of Texas deliberately poisoned all the ground water, endangering the tens of millions of Texas residents. The President of the USA then publicly declares to those residents, "Even though I have a mechanism to purify the drinking water, I've decided that you should all suffer the consequences of that man’s transgression. You will all drink poisoned water and die." Each of us would rightly deprecate such a President as the most evil man who ever lived. Even calling him a horrible monster would be far too charitable, there is no word adequate to describe such a degree of evil. Such is what traditional approaches to Adam insinuate of Yahweh.

Theologians have had 2,000 years to solve the problem of Adam. They failed. My solution is the only one consistent with a perfectly fair, just, loving God.

 

[DavidPT]

You ignored what I said. All species prior to Adam and Eve were animals for lack of a conscience. Adam was the first man, and Eve the first woman, by that definition.

I did see where you said that but I assumed you weren't meaning literal animals, but were meaning animal-like. Were you meaning literal animals rather than animal-like?

 

[JAL]

I did see where you said that but I assumed you weren't meaning literal animals, but were meaning animal-like. Were you meaning literal animals rather than animal-like?

What's the difference?