How long is your liturgy?

[Oblio]

What I have seen in churches of the Great Russian tradition is a table to the side which will hold both antidoron and zapivka (warmed, non consecrated wine) which the faithful will partake of after communing..

This is what I meant, I assumed that was called zeon We warm ours with hot water, just as the chalice is warmed.

On a side note, I prefer the small Russian style loaves, rather than the Greek because it tends to be less dry and crumbly, though as we increase in size we are starting to use medium size loaves for the 'antidoron' to give our baker a break.

 

[choirfiend]

See, that's how things get altered in name....zeon is what I am used to hearing the non-consecrated wine called. Zapivka you say? I'l run it by our babas

 

[Matrona]

This is what I meant, I assumed that was called zeon We warm ours with hot water, just as the chalice is warmed.

I had never had zapivka before last Tuesday. I'm sure the parishioners had a good laugh at the awkward Antiochian trying to imitate the person in front of her with the little cup thing.

It kind of surprised me when I tasted it and it was warm. Why is the water added to it?

 

[zebu]

I have always heard it called zapkiva too...

 

[MariaRegina]

I honestly don't understand how Divine Liturgy can be under an hour and a half! The shortest Divine Liturgy I have been to was Antiochian, 1.25 hours, and it didn't have a sermon. If you have a sermon, then how do all y'all have liturgies lasting an hour or an hour and 15 minutes? What do you do that is so different??? I don't say this as a criticism, but I seriously don't understand how liturgy can be SO short. Most liturgies I have been to are between 1 hour 45 minutes and just over 2 hours, with a few well over 2 hours. And the longest one, clocking in at about 2 hours and 45 minutes, had a sermon that was about 2 minutes long! Gotta love that slooooow Russian singing...

In the Greek Orthodox church I have visited, there are two or three priests who concelebrate and each will take a separate prayer which they say concurrently. No prayers are omitted but the laity cannot hear them either because the three priests are saying three separate prayers in unison. Sounds really like Greek.

While the choir is singing "Holy Holy Holy God," the priest is already saying the next series of prayers.

The "Kyrie Eleison" is said without stopping because the priest will keep on going. Many time two litanies are said together with only one "Kyrie eleison." So special melodies cannot be used in those cases.

A Sunday Divine Liturgy with the sermon will only take one hour even with a long line of communicants because three priests will distribute.

And it does feel rushed.

 

[Oblio]

Water is added to the chalice because:

The warmth is to symbolize the Holy Spirit
Water flowed from His side
Blood is warm

I think warm water is added to the zapivka for like reasons.

 

[Ilian]

Why is the water added to it?

There's no theological reason (although there could certainly be symbolism). I think it is really to make the supply go further and to cut down on the alcohol content.

Always watch for people coming up for seconds.

 

[Oblio]

Another tangent:

We've been using Kagor wine when we can get it Check it out when you see it.

edit: changed spelling

 

[Ilian]

Is it Georgian or Armenian? I've never had it.

Probably my favorite for liturgical use is Mavrodaphne.

 

[Oblio]

Moldovan

 

[Oblio]

IIRC, it's made with a starter from last years wine, spiked with juice and some yeast, and finally fortified a bit when done.

 

[Ilian]

Are you talking about Kagor Oblio? That I've had, it's a Moldovan dessert wine.

 

[Oblio]

Yes

 

[Oblio]

Wiki has it as a variety from France.

 

[Ilian]

Yes, I looked it up and Kagor is the varietal. I have a bottle given to me by a Ukrainian friend and it has this name plus the wine maker. It is a Moldovan dessert wine, so I think we're talking about the same thing. It is definitely sweet enough to be used liturgically.

 

[eoe]

So as of now the average liturgy is 99 minutes long with a total of 33 responses.