How is God just?

[JGG]

I'm bowing out of this. I'm just not interested in running in circles, and not really interested in "discussion" anymore. I'm just gonna keep reading.

 

[oi_antz]

I'm bowing out of this. I'm just not interested in running in circles, and not really interested in "discussion" anymore. I'm just gonna keep reading.

You didn't get resolution, does that bother you much?

 

[JGG]

You didn't get resolution, does that bother you much?

No. I'm an atheist. I have practice not finding resolution. I think we all know I won't be getting any here in any event.

 

[oi_antz]

No. I'm an atheist. I have practice not finding resolution. I think we all know I won't be getting any here in any event.

That is good to know, I will keep it in mind, thanks

 

[bling]

Before I reply, may I know if you are asking this for yourself or for someone else?

I am asking you.

 

[humbleServant77]

How is God just?

Let's suppose two men murder two women. Let's further suppose that one man is Christian, one man is not. Now, based on what I have been told the Christian man receives Grace and is allowed to enter heaven, while the non-Christian is sent to hell for all eternity.

Here's where I have problems:

First, if both men are guilty of the same crime, how is it just that they receive different punishments?

Hi! These are good questions. I cannot promise to make sense out of it for you, but what I will promise is not to gloss over it pretending it is easier than it really is. I also promise not to just make stuff up.

First of all, your question is best answered by the concept of the "economia" of God. Anglicizing that, we see God has an economy. We see reference to this over and over in Scripture, and a study of those portions would serve you well. There are some wonderful study aids on sites that have the Bible on line. It seems silly for me to post all of that here, so I'll move on to deeper concepts:

"Mercy and truth are met together; righteousness and peace have kissed each other." (Psalm 85:10)

You're concentrating on Judgment, condemnation, and "truth." What about Mercy?? Peace? I would rather re-direct your focus towards how utterly amazing it is that God can Love us, at all. That He can accept us, w/o condemnation. And I point out even Angels cannot fathom this.

If the punishment for this crime is eternal punishment then God allows the Christian to escape justice rather than enforce it. Furthermore, one woman's killer sees justice the other's does not.

Nope. Again, God's economia. Further,

If the punishment for the crime is that one must confess and repent

So's Law. Your misunderstanding is rooted in the fact of Communion of Saints, which has its beginning in all people who partake of the Passover doing so at the same "time." (In scare quotes because God transcends time, and He brings us into that in some specific ways, including those who keep the Passover as well as its modern day counterpart, Communion)

God's Judgment is Just. The problem is we don't always see it. Thus:

"For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him." (2 Corinthians 5:21)

Furthermore, if confession and repentance makes the balance of justice, what is the significance of Jesus' sacrifice?

NOW you're on to something! Further, what is the significance of partaking of Communion?

But beyond that, how do we know God is just? How is God just?

Mercy trumps Justice. Job found this out. We do not see this illustrated in every OT story, but in those that it is not, we see that it SHOULD be!

I will admit that with an understanding of God's Mercy, it is readily apparent that we are ourselves shielded from the horrors of Justice. It is within this revelation that the song Amazing Grace was written. This is fitting, because the Bible itself sums the whole thing up as a song.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

For the benefit of other seekers, I will answer the OP even if he has left the discussion.

The OP presents both a valid question and a false assumption. The valid question is regarding how God can forgive sin and remain just, and the false assumption is that forgiveness is simply an acquittal. God just lets the murderer in this case, "off of the hook".

How can God be just and let a murderer free? That's a very good question, and it deserves a good answer.

Christians don't believe that God simply overlooks sin. He is perfectly just. No sin goes with punishment - not a single one; however, God also is merciful and forgiving (and I thank Him for that because my sins are many), so how does God satisfy His justice and mercy at the same time? That's the wonder of the cross.

At the cross, God is both the just and the justifier. He pours out His wrath for sin onto himself, and He bears the eternal weight of that punishment.

Forgiveness never just happens by declaration. Someone always pays. For example, if I come to your house and break your lamp, either I pay you the value of it, or you "forgive" me and absorb the cost of the lamp yourself.

On the cross Jesus is absorbing the penalty of sin. All sin, at its end is against God. He created all things, so if we "break" a part of His creation (we sin against a person) we ultimately sin against Him; therefore either we meet with His justice and pay ourselves, or we meet with His mercy, by trusting in payment made at the cross on our behalf.

 

[humbleServant77]

Brian, that fits very neatly along with what I wrote, so that the 2 reinforce one another and add insight. That's the way the Body of Christ is supposed to work


Plus, it's evident you didn't read my post first.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Brian, that fits very neatly along with what I wrote, so that the 2 reinforce one another and add insight. That's the way the Body of Christ is supposed to work


Plus, it's evident you didn't read my post first.

I didn't read your post first. I read many at the start of the thread, and then gave my answer. Besides what you wrote, which I did just read, many of the answers seemed lacking, so I tried my best to answer biblically.