How I see Genesis 1&2

[SNPete]

Regarding the first part of Genesis:

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures order of occurrence and dates.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind. Of course we always must bear in mind that God is not limited to obey the laws of nature. So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.

For me science gives us the How. Religion gives us the Why

*************
So, what do you think?

IMO the earth is older than 4004BC since our written history goes back much further. I see no problem with a 5 Billion year old earth or a theistic evolutionary view.

 

[Mumbo]

For me science gives us the How. Religion gives us the Why

So, what do you think?

I think that this is a tidy explanation if you ignore science when it explains the "why" as well, which it does more often than not.

 

[vernee]

NIce thoughts in a neat bundle. I think I would be more with Hebrew way of thinking though. I love facts and all but after a while they all end up in circles for me.

 

[MorkandMindy]

But religion doesn't stick to the why, how do you explain away the description of Noah and the Ark?

Also Jesus referred to it as literally true

 

[SNPete]

But religion doesn't stick to the why, how do you explain away the description of Noah and the Ark?

Also Jesus referred to it as literally true

No big deal. God does "miracles".

 

[TheBear]

No big deal. God does "miracles".

That's the trump card one can use over and over. It puts the American Express Black Card to shame.

 

[Upisoft]

I think that this is a tidy explanation if you ignore science when it explains the "why" as well, which it does more often than not.

Let's try it. Why things fall on Earth when they're dropped?

 

[Iosias]

God does "miracles".

And creation was the first

 

[Morcova]

And so it always comes down to magic.

Life must be so easy for creationist, if you don't know the answer.. it's magic!

Don't know what fuels stars? Magic!

Don't know how the body heals? Magic!

Don't know where babies come from? Magic!

 

[SNPete]

And so it always comes down to magic.

Life must be so easy for creationist, if you don't know the answer.. it's magic!

Don't know what fuels stars? Magic!

Don't know how the body heals? Magic!

Don't know where babies come from? Magic!

Must be fun to mock people with whom you disagree. Not a very effective debate technique tho.

FYI, I am not a creationist, but if it makes you comfortable you can call me one since I believe in God.

 

[SNPete]

Let's try it. Why things fall on Earth when they're dropped?

Soo.............why is there gravity? What is its purpose? How come it exists?

 

[MorkandMindy]

Upisoft[/b]
Let's try it. Why things fall on Earth when they're dropped?

Brilliant, we start with the Creation stories and now need to put General Relativity into a Post Quick Reply...

Answering this could depend on what exactly you mean by 'why',

It can lead to an infinite regress of whys that is ultimately unanswerable in any meaningful way

Why, because gravity pulls it down is not an explanation at all because gravity means weighty which means a tendency to go down...

would you explain more about your 'why'

 

[MorkandMindy]

Soo.............why is there gravity? What is its purpose? How come it exists?

Lots easier, if there wasn't gravity in our universe then we wouldn't be in it either so it wouldn't be our universe

so our universe has to be the one over there with gravity in it

 

[Merlin]

I agree with your statements.

 

[Split Rock]

Regarding the first part of Genesis:

I view the first part of the book of Genesis as basically saying that God created everything. It should be noted that Genesis was written for the Hebrew mindset. We (westerners) are of the Greek mindset. By Greek I mean we follow the Greek way of thinking and looking at the world. We want precise answers, facts, figures order of occurrence and dates.

The Hebrew mindset is primarily interested in concepts, with facts and figures being secondary. What mattered to the Hebrews is that God created the Universe. The order and time of the events were not important to the Hebrew mind.

As I see it you run into problems applying Greek thinking to a Hebrew document. That is why the creation story does not make sense to the scientific mind. Of course we always must bear in mind that God is not limited to obey the laws of nature. So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.

For me science gives us the How. Religion gives us the Why

*************
So, what do you think?

IMO the earth is older than 4004BC since our written history goes back much further. I see no problem with a 5 Billion year old earth or a theistic evolutionary view.

I agree with your post. Most Creationists look closely at the details of Genesis as historical fact, rather than look at the big picture. They ignore the history of what they are reading, and the culture it was written for. The bible is not a text book on nature.

 

[michabo]

Soo.............why is there gravity? What is its purpose? How come it exists?

Is this your tactic, to keep asking "why" until no one has an answer then you cry "god" for the win?

 

[MorkandMindy]

...So, if God wanted to create the universe in six, 24 hour days He could.

He said he did, so if he could have then he should have

I could have been in London this afternoon, so is it ok to say I was?

 

[Upisoft]

Brilliant, we start with the Creation stories and now need to put General Relativity into a Post Quick Reply...

Answering this could depend on what exactly you mean by 'why',

It can lead to an infinite regress of whys that is ultimately unanswerable in any meaningful way

Why, because gravity pulls it down is not an explanation at all because gravity means weighty which means a tendency to go down...

would you explain more about your 'why'

I think you understand me well. Thaw was an example to show the weakness of science when it come to 'why' questions. Yes, it can answer such questions, but the answers tend to be shallow.

Science is about 'how'.

 

[Mumbo]

I think you understand me well. Thaw was an example to show the weakness of science when it come to 'why' questions. Yes, it can answer such questions, but the answers tend to be shallow.

Science is about 'how'.

Depends on the question.

At times, "why" questions are only as meaningful as you want them to be. "How did life come to exist" is a question with a tangible answer, while "Why does life exist" only matters if you care to insert God. As implied by science's answer to the "how" version of the question, life doesn't need a reason to exist, and needn't be questioned in the first place.

"Why" questions, however, are not inherently unanswerable by science. The only problem is that they tend to breed more questions, and if you follow them back far enough, you eventually reach places that science has a tough time reaching.

Why is the sky blue? -> Why does light exist? -> Why does energy exist? -> Why does matter exist? -> Why did the Big Bang occur?

Whether or not God should answer questions that science cannot is up to you. Just keep in mind that science has a good record when it comes to figuring things out.

 

[MorkandMindy]

I think you understand me well. Thaw was an example to show the weakness of science when it come to 'why' questions. Yes, it can answer such questions, but the answers tend to be shallow.

Science is about 'how'.

cop out - artificial distinction

you are claiming that the Bible does not clash with what we see

but it does.

The Bible makes claims about events which now appear could not possibly have happened. The Bible does not major on the why but talks mainly about the what.

The Earth was not made 6000 or even 10 000 years ago, it appears to have formed around 4 500 000 000 years ago, and the sequence in Genesis is hopelessly wrong

And Noah's flood never happened but unfortunately Jesus refers to it according to the gospel so what do you do, claim the only account we have of Jesus is wrong, or that somehow the flood happened but didn't affect lots of things we keep digging up and left no residue and didn't affect a villages in the area.


Again the Genesis account just mentions why but majors on what happened.