How do you know you're called?

[rainbowprism]

I have a deep desire to attend VLI, which is basically a bible college within the association of Vineyard churches. How does one know they are called? I mean I feel that this desire is in my heart because of God...but what else would go into the sense of being "called"?

 

[rainbowprism]

Nobody's gonna field this one?!

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

Thats between you and God. Do you have specific incident or feeling which you aren't sure about? You should probably just pray about it, ask for a vision or sign or something.

 

[brinley45cal]

Want to know if your called?and what you are called to do? Whats on your heart? What is it you disire to do?Do you have a passion for young people then be a youth minister,or a disire to preach the gospel?be a preacher,maybe missionary work.
In other words that thing in your heart that burns in you to do,its unmistakable.What is it you want to do more than anything in the world or for the world?.......Theres your answer.

 

[clonenomore]

....In other words that thing in your heart that burns in you to do,its unmistakable.What is it you want to do more than anything in the world or for the world?.......Theres your answer.

Based on my own experience, I'm not sure that I totally agree with this statement. I ran away from God for 23 years. When I returned to the church last year, preaching was the furthest thing from my mind. I started to feel these "nudges" and "pushes" in my soul. I finally realized that God was trying to tell me something, but I didn't know what. In fact, when I finally realized that I was being called to preach, I still didn't believe it. I had bever seen myself as a "preacher" -- but God did.

Remeber, we are all created uniquely by God so that we can fulfill a specific ministry. My advice, based on my own experiences:

1. Pray, pray, and pray. Read the Word of God. God will speak to us -- sometimes were just are not tuned to listen. Pick a time of day to meditate on the Word of God -- and do it every day!

2. Jump in and start doing something. Find a ministry, and plug in. If you are not called to that ministry, God will let you know. Ask your pastor to help.

3. I heard once that your calling will be verified in the community. Ask your family and friends. When I finally answered God's call to preach, I talked to a friend that I had lost contact with several years earlier. I was fully into my hedonistic lifestyle when we had lost touch. I told him that I had been called to preach. He asked me "What took you so long? I was wondering when you would figure it out." He knew before I did.

4. I can't say this enough -- pray again.

I pray that you find your ministry and calling. The fact that you recognize that we are all called to ministry shows that God is at work.

 

[lajekahr]

Wow, major theology 101.

Well there is the Gideon approach...drop some piece cloth out your window and pray that God makes it wet and the ground not (or vice versa) three or four times just to make sure....

Or my prefered method....

Just keep moving. It is easier to guide a person who is moving than one standing still. You should use the intellect, talents, skills and personal desires God gave you to figure out for yourself what would both intrigue you and make you feel useful. Then pursue it full steam ahead.

Whilst you do that, pray and be open that God would influence your decisions to lead you where He wants you. Often you will find he closes doors to places and then opens doors to places you didn't expect! Take each opportunity that fits you.

Luke

 

[mister_p]

You listen. That is how you hear God. Pray, for sure. Try things, absolutely.

Wait on Him, look around you, see reactions. Be honest with yourself.

Listen to the "still small voice."

 

[clonenomore]

I have a deep desire to attend VLI, which is basically a bible college within the association of Vineyard churches. How does one know they are called? I mean I feel that this desire is in my heart because of God...but what else would go into the sense of being "called"?

rainbowprism,

How is it going with your walk? Your calling is there -- keep listening.

 

[rainbowprism]

rainbowprism,

How is it going with your walk? Your calling is there -- keep listening.

Thanks, that was very reassuring to me! Thanks to the rest of you as well, I'm still unsure but God's in control so I'm trying not to 'obsess'!

 

[Koey]

I have a deep desire to attend VLI, which is basically a bible college within the association of Vineyard churches. How does one know they are called? I mean I feel that this desire is in my heart because of God...but what else would go into the sense of being "called"?

Elmer Towns the church planting author once said in a course I took from him that "desire is the call." If you have a persistent desire that lasts longer than a year or two, then God is probably calling you. After thinking about it and praying about it over time, ask around among people who know you. Now that may be risky, especially if all your friends are negative pessimists, but it can also be encouraging.

Remember though, that Robert Shuller was laughed at for 20 years when he said he was going to build a Crystal Cathedral. Nobody laughs at him today, so asking your friends must be done with discernment.

Remember too that some Christian preachers are so manipulative and self-centered that they cannot see anyone being used of God except in pastoral ministry. Don't allow yourself to be manipulated by men who are more interested in numbers and building their little empires and don't really care about you. Make sure this is from God.

 

[Davidatwaypointe]

You're getting some different answers and perspectives, which just illustrates that God speaks to different people (and convicts different people) in different ways.

As far as major life changes go, I actually suggest staying put until you know for sure. If you make some commitment and realize later that it's wrong, you're already tangled in snares, whether financial or emotional, relational, or whatever. And our pride can get in the way as well, and I think it's also a bad witness to others. (I can't tell you how many times I've seen folks say they were "led" to this or that and they wind up like pinballs bouncing around; I hardly imagine God as a flake!)

Learn to hear the voice of God. Wait upon the Lord. Then, when you hear whatever He has to say, obey Him without swerving. I absolutely believe in being under authority and receiving blessing (if not confirmation) from your senior minister and other elders. It's true that sometimes they will indeed be wrong, but if you have to rebel against the authority under whom God has placed you, I don't think it's pleasing to God.

 

[LivingWitness]

Learn to hear the voice of God. Wait upon the Lord. Then, when you hear whatever He has to say, obey Him without swerving. I absolutely believe in being under authority and receiving blessing (if not confirmation) from your senior minister and other elders. It's true that sometimes they will indeed be wrong, but if you have to rebel against the authority under whom God has placed you, I don't think it's pleasing to God.[

Amen. ministry is an incredible responsibility. but while you are waiting on God it does not hurt to get prepared by getting some bible college.

Raygn

 

[Koey]

...I absolutely believe in being under authority and receiving blessing (if not confirmation) from your senior minister and other elders...

I hear this one a lot. "Don't plant a church unless you have a covering, etc." My only question to all of that stuff is, "Who gave authority for the first Vineyard church?" For that matter, "Who gave the first church of any denomination its authority?"

If you want to stay with the Vineyard then you had better stick with their authority structure. Personally, I find their structure too restrictive.

Being young, you may find it helpful to begin within a structure. However, over time you may find that you believe the gospel is no longer being given free course, by an overly restrictive denominational control. Then you will have an ethical dilemma to work out. How will you handle that, with courage or cowardice, with honesty or dishonesty?

 

[Davidatwaypointe]

I hear this one a lot. "Don't plant a church unless you have a covering, etc." My only question to all of that stuff is, "Who gave authority for the first Vineyard church?" For that matter, "Who gave the first church of any denomination its authority?"

If you want to stay with the Vineyard then you had better stick with their authority structure. Personally, I find their structure too restrictive.

Being young, you may find it helpful to begin within a structure. However, over time you may find that you believe the gospel is no longer being given free course, by an overly restrictive denominational control. Then you will have an ethical dilemma to work out. How will you handle that, with courage or cowardice, with honesty or dishonesty?

I strongly believe that David is a great role model for being humble under authority. Most of us would point at Saul and show how insane and ungodly he was and use that as an excuse to usurp his authority or go and start our own church or whatever. David did the right thing once the pressure was too great; he left, and he left alone. He didn't advertise for a flock or create a rebellion or anything; he trusted God to work out His will however it might be. And even when men did seek out David to join up with him, they lived basically in squallor for years because David refused to be an instrument of vengeance against the one in authority.

This is very, very hard stuff, and we're an impatient and proud people. I think it's nearly impossible to be like Christ and ask to not drink the cup, but be willing to do so if it was God's will. I've seen godly women who are, in my estimate, leaps and bounds ahead of their husbands, spiritually, who still honor their husband's bad decisions even though they know better. I think that's much more pleasing to God than a wife who rebels because she knows better, so she'll just disrespect her husband's authority. That's a huge symptom of spritual pride and distrust of God's sovereignty -- even over our frail human decisions.

 

[alaskamolly]

Authority is very important, but can also be easily abused.

Personally, we have clear cut instructions in Scripture that a husband is the head of the wife, but we have NO clear cut instructions in Scripture that say that a CHURCH is the head of a member. When a pastor takes the role of "head," you know you've got serious serious trouble, because he totally overstepped his Scriptural bounds. Christ is head of the church, the husband is head of the wife, but no where does it say that the 'lead pastor' is the "head" of his congregation.

One should certainly listen to church leaders, and obey them in so far as they line up with God's word, but unless you are a Roman Catholic, you are not under a Pope. You are to be hearing from God yourself. And while it is a blessing to plant a church under the 'covering' of another group of Believers (because they are there to support you, to pray for you, to encourage and help you), it is NOT a Scriptural requirement. God has worked both ways through history.

***

As for your call to the ministry, I'd say it's worth listening to very carefully. Whenever that strong desire beats in you for godly service, it's usually coming from the Lord.

Wait for a while and think and pray on it...does it go away, or does it continue to beat? Continuation is usually a good sign--it's not an emotional thing, it's a Spirit birthed thing...

Is it confirmed through others or encouraged by others? That's also a good indicator most times.

If it does pass those tests, it's probably a God-thing. Best not to ignore Him.

And a few years in a good Bible College, saturating in the Word, will probably do MUCH to prepare you. Can't recommend that enough, that's for sure!!!! Though it's important to find a GOOD one, not one that will snuff the life out of you...


Blessings,
Molly

 

[Davidatwaypointe]

Authority is very important, but can also be easily abused.

Personally, we have clear cut instructions in Scripture that a husband is the head of the wife, but we have NO clear cut instructions in Scripture that say that a CHURCH is the head of a member. When a pastor takes the role of "head," you know you've got serious serious trouble, because he totally overstepped his Scriptural bounds. Christ is head of the church, the husband is head of the wife, but no where does it say that the 'lead pastor' is the "head" of his congregation.

One should certainly listen to church leaders, and obey them in so far as they line up with God's word, but unless you are a Roman Catholic, you are not under a Pope. You are to be hearing from God yourself. And while it is a blessing to plant a church under the 'covering' of another group of Believers (because they are there to support you, to pray for you, to encourage and help you), it is NOT a Scriptural requirement. God has worked both ways through history.

Not trying to argue, but I'm curious about something: can you imagine a situation (desert island not included here) in which a person could Biblically operate independent of any authority except what he or she got from the Bible or in relationship to God? Another question would be could that person Biblically operate independently of any accountability?

I don't want to press my personal convictions onto others, so my initial impulse might come from the fact that I'm deeply convicted that I have to be under authority; I'd hate to make my personal convictions some new religion or something.

So I can think of various Old Testament saints who didn't seem to operate within the accountability of fellowship and such (usually prophets), but I don't know if we're to do that in these times.

Thoughts?

 

[alaskamolly]

There is a Scripture that commands wives to be under the authority of their husbands.


There is a Scripture that tells Believers to submit to their governments (but also Scriptures that show our submission only goes so far--when the government defy's the commands of God, we are not to submit).


There is a Scripture that would suggest we obey our church leaders, but also plenty of Scriptures that would suggest we be wary of wolves in the flock and false teachers...so the submission being requested is NOT a 'blind' submission.


Those who have "rule over us" are to ONLY be in that position if they qualify for it--meaning the qualifications of elders and deacons. I'm sure one of the reasons Paul set up those qualifications was to help thin out many of the false teachers, but it's not going to guarantee all of them.


I suppose the reason my reaction is so careful is because we attended and served for some years in ministry with a group that believed the pastor was the "head" over the congregation. This is what was taught and lived--you obey the leaders in ALL THINGS as if obeying God.

Later, upon leaving, we found that our leader had been (and likely still was) in sexual relationships with some of the single women there (why not? he was the "head" over them, right?) and other things.

So much of what went wrong there was because of a false view of authority... Sure, the leader was to have authority, but was he to be the "head?" The Bible says there is ONE head of the church--and that is Christ.

This man felt that he had more authority over me than did my husband--because my husband was my 'marital/physical' head, whereas this church leader felt he was my 'spiritual head.' No wonder there were problems in that place...


I think that authority is everywhere (I actually LOVE Watchman Nee's book, "Spiritual Authority"), and it is easy to tell the rebellious from the submissive in Christiandom...so many do not realize the BEAUTY of operating in proper relationship in and with authority...

But it is also very important to realize ALL authority is delegated by God, and therefore we must be cautious, and not submit past what God requires. When we submit beyond what we should (past the delegation of God and into the power of man), we are in just as much danger as if we were rebellious.


My 2 Cents!

Warm Regards,
Molly

 

[Davidatwaypointe]

Seems like we're basically in agreement.

I basically believe that I'm under the authority of our pastor, and if I am convicted that he is not fit for pastorship, then I leave quietly unless I really felt God for whatever reason was telling me otherwise. I always feel like God holds the trump card over my theology!

 

[alaskamolly]

I always feel like God holds the trump card over my theology!

 

[Koey]

...I always feel like God holds the trump card over my theology!

Excellent!!! You've got my vote for pope, or president, or archbishop, or patriarch, whatever you call the big cheese in your denomination.