how do you get your intellect in your heart?

[maybenotcrazy]

I read of bringing the mind into the heart in the practice of the jesus prayer. I wonder how you do that? I've been praying it for a while now but still can't figure that out. What is the sensation of having the mind in the heart, what is an analogy?

 

[Greg the byzantine]

It's probably better to ask an SF, but I've taken it to mean to pray with the whole being, that every part of you should be involved and united in the prayer, your intellect (mind, nous), your heart, and your body.

 

[Andrew21091]

One of the things that can be dangerous with the Jesus Prayer and to expect something like that to happen. True prayer of the heart is something that one has to work at for years. On of the great errors in practicing the Prayer is to think that we must acquire grace in a short period of time. On Athonite hermit said, "The athlete must accept that he must struggle many years." I'm going to quote the same Elder here, "Noetic prayer requires mainly renunciation of the world, submission to a Gerondas (Elder), a decision by the monk to remain in exile and to keep the commandments of Christ for a long period of time." Once the nous picks up the prayer and says it on it's own it will decend to the heart after much struggle. You say you've been praying it for a while, but have you truly? You have to think of that. When the Prayer is said with full attention with the mind for some time (sometimes it can take years) then and only then can it go into the heart. As it was quoted above, you must have spiritual direction when saying the Prayer since doing it by your own direction, it will bring deception.

The words I type here are things that I've read from various Elders, since I have no words of my own about the prayer since I am far from the experience when it comes to such things. I highly recommend reading Metropolitan Hierotheos' book A Night in the Desert of the Holy Mountain which is his discussion on the Jesus Prayer with an Athonite hermit. Get that book and read it and you will understand more about the Prayer.

 

[Andrew21091]

You should also watch this short little video of Elder Cleopa on the stages of prayer.

YouTube - Elder Cleopa - On Prayer

 

[gzt]

This is outside the scope of subjects that can be addressed on a message board.

 

[maybenotcrazy]

why is it that everything I post is outside the scope of these darn message boards, is it that I have nothing else to say other than dreamy stuff? Is it that I have no substance? Anyway, thanks for your replies. I am in the process of finding a spiritual father, and one quick! I have been in delusion for a while now, all kinds of delusion. It is very disconcerting when you say the jesus prayer, and a whisper in your mind, or sometimes an audible demonic voice tells you in response: Have mercy on me too! or worse, you are insulted by vacuous presences that masquerade as other people, distorting the speech of those you walk by as you say the prayer to yourself. I really haven't been praying for that long, I'm just going by the standards of the "Way of A Pilgrim" which is probably deceptive for the average couch potato like me. You think you've heard enough about my spiritual "psychosis" but you haven't. I was put through a terrible encounter with demonic influence in church on the night when our archbishop came to visit and believe you me, it was terrible. No, not influence on people, but let's just say that the same way they tempt you they can create situations that are very frightening and maddening, not to mention involving spiritual tricks like distorting the words of those speaking around you to insults and threats, and reminders of your own wickedness.

Just so you know, if you are someone who knows me you probably won't notice a thing of this which goes on in my presence. It is an illusion. I am 100% certain that there is no depth to any of this garbage the demons do and not only that, but I am beginning to think I am finding it funny. Except for the tremendous boldness of what they did that night when I was at the archbishop's service, which I mistook for an angry god for a short time, (Stupid me) they are what I will call nothing more than a nuissance. I don't think I'm possessed because I don't have any hatred for christ or the cross, but there is an undue influence of demons in my life. Perhaps I'm a descendent of mohammed... That might explain it. They say that my grandfather was a descendent of the "prophet" and that people like that, when bad things are done to them bad things happen back to the people who do them, perhaps that is demonic in nature and true to an extent and I've betrayed my "GUARDIAN" demons. You know I almost forgot, when I first started dabbling in christianity, I had a day where I totally believed it, as if I were christian for a long time then it stopped... I was viciously put through the cross of schizophrenia from then on, then 3 years later, 2008 I finally believed it again. I was destined to become christian but at the peril of those demons which have been almost vouchsafed my soul.

 

[Paisley]

There is an exorcism prayer that can be done for you, and believe me, this problem you have will vanish in an instant. Ask your priest about it. He cannot do anything for you if you fail to mention it to him.

 

[gzt]

Well, this is outside the scope of subjects that can be addressed on a message board because:
1. Nobody here is likely to be competent to address it.
2. If they were, it's probably not something that can be done in just one page.
3. If it could be done, how would one know you are at the point where this is even truly relevant to your spiritual praxis?
Which is not to say you aren't at that point yet. Nobody on this board is competent to judge. Especially without knowing what you're up to, how you're praying, what it's like, etc etc - which I don't think you should get into because none of us are competent to give concrete recommendations, most likely. We're all ignorant idiots here. Really. You shouldn't trust the details of a single bloody thing you read on this board about history, spiritual life, or theology. On some subjects, it's not harmful to trust the general direction of things, but you want specifics and nitty gritty stuff, and this is not the place to ask for it and this is especially not the subject to ask about.