How do I find a job?

[liars_paradox]

My questions isn't something that can be clearly answered in a Christian context, but one that, I think, can be answered in a more general context. And, that question is what other ways are there that are available for me to find work with beside sitting in my room on a computer? Because, I've been looking for work on the internet and either I haven't looked hard and long enough on the various websites out there or that I'm going about this the wrong way. Additionally, my dad and I argue and one of the things we argue about is how I should go about finding work. He says that I can't find one sitting within four-walls but he never explains what other ways are there except being "out" or whatever it is he says.

I know my dad is like most people and doesn't know how to express his thoughts in as many words for someone like me to understand so I'm hoping that someone who might be better able at explaining things and may have experienced a similar situation to that of my own might be able to offer some helpful advice.

Background information regarding my problem is that I am a graduated with a B.S in computer science in July of this year and I am currently looking for any job that my education would have prepared me for. This would go beyond just software development/engineering but testing, "support", etc. Anything that would have made my education worth while pursuing and would be able to afford me the ability to pay off my student loans and still allow me to have my own financial means to survive.

 

[Peripatetic]

If you are in the software engineering business, you really should call all the local contract companies (ie. head-hunters) and tell them what you are looking for. They usually have all the connections and often fill jobs before they are even posted. The way it works is that the company will place you and either get paid by the hiring company or you would actually work for the contractor and the company would pay them.

You and your dad are both right in part: you don't have to leave your house to find good leads, but cold searching and applying is usually not the best way to do it in that industry. For what it's worth, tech support jobs are often in demand, and so are QA jobs where the individual has a software dev background.

 

[ServantJohn]

Something my sister heard the other day was "You won't find a job unless you have one." In other words, employers are looking for people willing to work. Even if it's not in your field, an employer will be more willing to hire you if you have a job at all.

 

[TigerKanga]

You go places where people have the kind of job you want work. Then you talk to people there about how to get one of those jobs.

 

[BL2KTN]

You start by going to McDonald's and getting a job. Then, once you aren't depending on somebody else to pay for everything your adult butt needs, you start trying to find a job in your field.

BL

 

[TigerKanga]

You start by going to McDonald's and getting a job. Then, once you aren't depending on somebody else to pay for everything your adult butt needs, you start trying to find a job in your field.

BL

If someone else is willing to pay your bills why would you want to work at McDonalds? If someone paid all my bills I'd be holding out for a management position.

 

[Poweranimals]

Something my sister heard the other day was "You won't find a job unless you have one." In other words, employers are looking for people willing to work. Even if it's not in your field, an employer will be more willing to hire you if you have a job at all.

So if you want a job you must already have one. Kinda sounds like I'm screwed.

 

[ServantJohn]

So if you want a job you must already have one. Kinda sounds like I'm screwed.

LOL, kind of like "it takes money to make money". The point is, get what you can no matter how trivial to show better employers you are willing to work.

 

[heron]

Your dad came from an era where "getting out there" meant walking door to door, dropping off a resume and filling out an application. People really did do this on foot, before the Internet.

So whether you do it from Monster.com or sitting in HR offices, this is the time to invest ALL your time looking for work. A CS degree is an amazing thing to have, and opens many doors.

Your degree also comes with a hefty price tag that was probably more than your parents would net in several years of work.

So yes, it is time to have enough confidence in your ability to work, to go get something. The dependent life is over.

Here are two lists of openings with great salaries. Be willing to relocate.
USAJOBS - Search Jobs

Find Jobs: Search millions of jobs now | Monster.com

The idea of a headhunter or temp agency sounds perfect, because you can try different companies in short spurts, and someone is behind you in the search. Adecco, Kelly Services, Manpower ...

 

[Mrs. Luther073082]

Read the paper for jobs, go to places in person to apply, go to temp agencies and/or "headhunters", network, volunteer, etc. Write individual cover letters for the places you're applying to. Research the companies. Etc.

 

[bored]

You start by going to McDonald's and getting a job. Then, once you aren't depending on somebody else to pay for everything your adult butt needs, you start trying to find a job in your field.

BL

Its too bad you cant rate a post and get it deleted if people think it sucks. Everyone knows mcdonalds is not a living wage. I guess you could work there part time for gas money to get to where you need to apply, however you dont want to be working at mcdonalds at peak buisness hours because thats when you will need to be making phone calls or going in for interviews etc.

To the OP: Why did you get a CS degree, what do you want to do? Find the companies that do that and apply, even if there is not a posted opening.

 

[heron]

And yet people live off McDonald's wages.
BL's comment was obviously a hint that we have to humble ourselves and not wait for the perfect job to come to us.

It is an abrupt shift --from obedience to classroom deadlines and tight scheduling-- to setting up one's own life outside of school. Decisions need to be made about housing, location, friendships, career directions... and most of us were not trained in how to "do life." Learning about health insurance, car insurance, apartment leases and downpayments, going to the dentist on your own motivation, negotiating for a car, keeping financial accounts under control.... there are a lot of minor hoops to walk through.

Most colleges have a solid staff of career placement coaches and job listings that provide free services to students. Go back to your college office and see if employers have requested graduates with your degree. You can probably even reach this from their website. They expect that students would have availed themselves of that service while still on campus, but they will usually be helpful with alumni.

Do not think of your first job as the ultimate goal that defines you. Just get out there and start building what your life will look like.

 

[bored]

And yet people live off McDonald's wages.
BL's comment was obviously a hint that we have to humble ourselves and not wait for the perfect job to come to us.

It is an abrupt shift --from obedience to classroom deadlines and tight scheduling-- to setting up one's own life outside of school. Decisions need to be made about housing, location, friendships, career directions... and most of us were not trained in how to "do life." Learning about health insurance, car insurance, apartment leases and downpayments, going to the dentist on your own motivation, negotiating for a car, keeping financial accounts under control.... there are a lot of minor hoops to walk through.

Most colleges have a solid staff of career placement coaches and job listings that provide free services to students. Go back to your college office and see if employers have requested graduates with your degree. You can probably even reach this from their website. They expect that students would have availed themselves of that service while still on campus, but they will usually be helpful with alumni.

Do not think of your first job as the ultimate goal that defines you. Just get out there and start building what your life will look like.

People cant live on mcdonalds wages unless they have gov assistance or family assistance or some other special circumstance. The numbers never add up unless there is assistance comming in from somewhere else or some living expense is subsidized, just sayin. Its a bad idea to leave a free place to stay to work at mcdonalds.

 

[Forealzchola]

sometimes you have to work a job you dont want, until you get the one that you do want

 

[liars_paradox]

If you are in the software engineering business, you really should call all the local contract companies (ie. head-hunters) and tell them what you are looking for. They usually have all the connections and often fill jobs before they are even posted. The way it works is that the company will place you and either get paid by the hiring company or you would actually work for the contractor and the company would pay them.

You and your dad are both right in part: you don't have to leave your house to find good leads, but cold searching and applying is usually not the best way to do it in that industry. For what it's worth, tech support jobs are often in demand, and so are QA jobs where the individual has a software dev background.

You mean those staffing agencies? Yeah, I've talked to a few of those, but I'm waiting to hear back from a couple of them. There's some hope a with a couple of agencies, although I wouldn't want to get my hopes up on these prospective jobs. For at least two agents that I talked to from two different agencies, it doesn't seem that they're at all interested in helping me.

Anyways, I wouldn't mind a QA job or software support job either. Anything that my major would've prepared me for. I've applied for some "computer scientist" jobs for federal government jobs, so hopefully they'll give me a call sometime. I like the sound of "computer scientist" better and an acquaintance of mine told me that there's a shortage of people with computer science backgrounds in the government sector. So, I'm trying my "luck" with these jobs.

 

[liars_paradox]

You start by going to McDonald's and getting a job. Then, once you aren't depending on somebody else to pay for everything your adult butt needs, you start trying to find a job in your field.

BL

If someone else is willing to pay your bills why would you want to work at McDonalds? If someone paid all my bills I'd be holding out for a management position.

Actually, if I worked at Mc Donald's then I would still have to depend on someone else to pay for my bills because I wouldn't be able to afford to live on my own. Believe me, I used to work fast-food, and pizza delivery while going to school and paying for my own apartment. It was still a financial strain on my parents because i didn't always have the money to pay for rent. Student loans will only make matters worse.

I don't know if I come off as someone who views themselves as too good for Mc Donald's or anything like that, but it's not just about being humble or anything. I don't mean any offense by this, but I am at the point in my life where part-time jobs are only a last resort.

I will work somewhere part-time if I have no choice, but this would probably only help alleviate the financial burden that I have been placing on my parents. It's still not a solution by any means to my current problem, unfortunately.

LOL, kind of like "it takes money to make money". The point is, get what you can no matter how trivial to show better employers you are willing to work.

Maybe, but I asked on a forum for programmers the same question and they told me that they really don't care about my part-time jobs when I asked if I should bother placing it on my resume. That is, most of them were like that.

I mean, there were a couple who seemed understandable and said that it's okay for entry-level positions. But, most of them said I was better off volunteering my time working for free for open source projects if I needed "experience" outside of school to put on my resume. But, open source volunteering is the kind of work that doesn't pay and would likely only add to my parents' stress.

 

[liars_paradox]

Read the paper for jobs, go to places in person to apply, go to temp agencies and/or "headhunters", network, volunteer, etc. Write individual cover letters for the places you're applying to. Research the companies. Etc.

I've done all of that. I even used to write an individual resume because the student career center at my old university told me that this was the best way. But, seeing how long it was taking to apply to jobs, I decided that one for multiple jobs was good enough, since they all started looking the same anyways.

But, thanks for your input. I just started exploring the volunteering approach as I have applied to help out with a number of open source projects, but I'll see if I can afford to dedicate my time to these projects in the future.

And, as far as networking, I did call my one friend who's in the software-field. He's an integration specialist at CAE and I asked him they were hiring at where he works. He told me they weren't and I did look online at his company's website and indeed, all of the positions for "integration specialist" were all located in Canada at the time or in far away states that would require me to move.

Your dad came from an era where "getting out there" meant walking door to door, dropping off a resume and filling out an application. People really did do this on foot, before the Internet.

So whether you do it from Monster.com or sitting in HR offices, this is the time to invest ALL your time looking for work. A CS degree is an amazing thing to have, and opens many doors.

Your degree also comes with a hefty price tag that was probably more than your parents would net in several years of work.

So yes, it is time to have enough confidence in your ability to work, to go get something. The dependent life is over.

Here are two lists of openings with great salaries. Be willing to relocate.
USAJOBS - Search Jobs

Find Jobs: Search millions of jobs now | Monster.com

The idea of a headhunter or temp agency sounds perfect, because you can try different companies in short spurts, and someone is behind you in the search. Adecco, Kelly Services, Manpower ...

Right, thanks. I haven't tried the last two before, so I'll go ahead and look at those.

To be honest, I have been spending some of my time in practicing my programming skills but I think that almost all of my time should be spent on finding a job now. At least at this point in time, if not earlier than now.

As far as applying in person, I am still not sure how I should best try to approach the situation yet. I used to do it for part-time jobs and this approach usually worked. I would go in person and ask the manager if they're were hiring. Many times, they didn't even have help wanted posters up on their windows or anything. But, the manager did happen to need someone at the time and I looked like I could do the job I guess.

However, for the full-time jobs, I really don't know where I could even go talk to anyone. Many places that I wouldn't expect someone with background to be working at are hiring, at least that's what I found with online searches. Thinking about what my dad said, I did consider going to at least one of these places.

So, after seeing a job ad for at a local utility company I decided to call their Human Resources department. I asked if I could deliver my resume in person and speak to someone there about the position, but the secretary said that was not possible. But, eventually she did connect me to someone but that person was going to be out of his office for a long while. So, I tried to call back and ask if there was anyone else who was maybe under him that I could speak to, but no one was answering. I tried calling a few times and no answer. So, I called using my cell phone instead of my parent's house phone. The secretary did finally answer but told me that there was absolutely no one else that I could talk to and that they weren't ever going to take a resume in person anyways. So that was that.

Based on how the secretary reacted, my impression is that going to these places in person isn't so easy to do. I could still try going to other places in person, and hopefully something will work out. But, I think that more of that secretary's reaction is to be expected with this approach. I think that going out in person is better than sitting around feeling frustrated.

But, anyone who's actually had experience with applying for full-time jobs might know better than me. Can anyone who's worked a full-time job be able to tell me if going to places in person has ever worked out for them?

 

[liars_paradox]

Its too bad you cant rate a post and get it deleted if people think it sucks. Everyone knows mcdonalds is not a living wage. I guess you could work there part time for gas money to get to where you need to apply, however you dont want to be working at mcdonalds at peak buisness hours because thats when you will need to be making phone calls or going in for interviews etc.

To the OP: Why did you get a CS degree, what do you want to do? Find the companies that do that and apply, even if there is not a posted opening.

Right, you pretty much "hit the nail on the head" in terms of capturing what I'm going through.

As far as job what I can do with my degree, it's really hard to say since the phrases seem to vary from company to company. I knew my friend was an integration specialist but it seemed that the term was only in use with his company. So, remembering from the movie "Office Space" that they used the term "software engineer" I've been looking for that position for the past few months. That, and "software developer" and "programmer" as well.

However, I did discover another possible job title recently. After talking to someone at a staffing agency, I did come accross the phrase "software support". When the staffing agent brought it up to me, she was like "I know that you were looking for software developer positions, but have you thought about 'software support'?" Not knowing what that even meant, I asked her what it meant, and as she was going into detail about it I excitedly interrupted her, saying "Yeah, I can do that!. Really it's anything that my education would've prepared me for - not just 'software development'".

So, I've been trying to expand the search queries recently. At least when using USAJobs.com (which allows you to search for federal government jobs) they usually just use the term "computer scientist" which seems to make job hunting easier for me. But, after my conversation with the staffing agent, who knows what other possible search queries I could've used on the various job-board websites?

 

[Mrs. Luther073082]

Have you gone to job fairs?

I have gotten full time jobs by going to the location in person, BTW.

I also got my last job due to volunteering. As soon as I graduated college, I was offered a position because they already knew my work ethic and such.

My friend who graduated from nursing school had to move after she got married and it took her from December last year until earlier this month to get a job. She got it by volunteering for a few months. She graduated at the top of her class and had a lot of experience and still had issues finding a job, even in nursing. It is just tough looking for employment right now, for anybody.

Volunteering is a way to develop your network, as well, and to get some references if you do not have any.

 

[liars_paradox]

Update:

I finally got some interviews with some programmers, who asked me technical questions. I did terribly on both interviews. It turns out there were some things that I needed to review and yet didn't think to review them the night before. Next time, I'll just be sure that my laptop is available to look all of these up since I could do this on the job anyways if I had to.

I'm not sure what it was exactly that was the problem on these 2 interviews, the fact that I didn't know or that I didn't have any confidence in my abilities? To be honest, I didn't do as well in school as I wanted. There were some times in which I did pretty well in school, at least in my senior year I had mostly A's in all of my courses and a couple of B's.

But, there was one really terrible year that just knocked my gpa down dramatically. The gpa was the reason why I moved back in with my parents, so that I could focus on school and get it finished with.

So, I finished school and got my degree, but no job. I don't know what it would take for me to get a job right now, going back to school and trying to get a masters of science, volunteer in opensource projects, get expensive certifications, or just learn to believe in myself and have this positive attitude and things will magically work out for me?