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Read the subsequent posts to what you wrote, they explain everything. From your posts, it seems you don't understand the scientific method, key word is method. That's what scientific theories are based on. That's why people of all different faiths (or lack thereof) can come together with science as everything is universal to explain mechanisms. It's just like math, it's all the same language.ChrisS said:God cannot be explained by the knowledge of man, God himself said this, however, his actions can. Saying that God designed us is scientific. If it isn't, but is the truth, then that realm becomes something science can't answer, therefore science needs to be expanded.
Ninja Turtles said:Read the subsequent posts to what you wrote, they explain everything. From your posts, it seems you don't understand the scientific method, key word is method. That's what scientific theories are based on. That's why people of all different faiths (or lack thereof) can come together with science as everything is universal to explain mechanisms. It's just like math, it's all the same language.
Let's say you figure out the entire mechanism of how people are created and developed and how they were made, that doesn't prove God, that just proves how we came about. Science is agnostic on God.ChrisS said:Our creation.
Science isn't just interpretation. Okay using the scientific method, explain our creation.ChrisS said:With science it's interpretation, but never mind that, I can't convince you, just show you my interpretation.
ChrisS said:God cannot be explained by the knowledge of man, God himself said this, however, his actions can. Saying that God designed us is scientific. If it isn't, but is the truth, then that realm becomes something science can't answer, therefore science needs to be expanded.
ChrisS said:We can measure his actions, like I said before, and that's where he enters science.
Exactly, evolution is all about explaining the mechanism via the scientific method. On the subject of God, you can't place a factor that is not quantifiable into your calculations.gluadys said:RE: bolded statement
Not until you show a) what the mechanism of the design is and b)that the mechanism requires that God exist and use it.
Evolution is a mechanism of design and explains very well how we came to be, so it satisfies a). But, while it is possible that God designed us using the mechanism of evolution, it is not possible to verify that the mechanism of evolution requires that God exist and use it. So it does not satisfy requirement b).
ChrisS said:We can measure his actions, like I said before, and that's where he enters science.
ChrisS said:With science it's interpretation, but never mind that, I can't convince you, just show you my interpretation.
I'm not sure you really understand to whole concept of false dichotomy.Linux98 said:Ok, I'll pin it down. There are only two alternatives: 1) God created the diversity of life, or 2) non-God created the diversity of life.
...
So let's try this: either God did it, or it done itself.
cerad said:I'm not sure you really understand to whole concept of false dichotomy.
Let me give you a third choice: it's entirely possible that an alien civilization with slightly more advanced technology than we currently have could be responsible for all life on Earth. There is not a shred of generally accepted evidence to support such a notion but nevertheless it is possible. In fact, there are an infinite number of possible explanations for life. But only evolution has any real scientific support.
Nope. The issue is how life on earth developed. Or more specifically, how blood clotting came to be. Science makes no claims concerning alien life forms. Lots of speculations but no theories.Linux98 said:Actually, if that were the case, you would still have to explain how the aliens came to be intelligent life forms. So you don't avoid the God vs non-God by appealing to alien races, you just postpone it.
jjdoe said:hehe...I know I'm evil http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_positivism
cerad said:Nope. The issue is how life on earth developed. Or more specifically, how blood clotting came to be. Science makes no claims concerning alien life forms. Lots of speculations but no theories.
Evolution is not concerned with how life is created, it is concerned with the mechanisms of life on Earth, as that is all that can be measured at the moment. You are attacking the idea of a person bringing in aliens into the equation, thus proving the point. You can't just bring in something that you can't measure without first having to explain it through use of the scientific method.Linux98 said:Yep. You do have to answer it. If evolution is really science then it is not bound by the Earth. You are placing a false limit on the theory of evolution. Therefore, naturalistic evolution would still need to explain how the aliens developed without God.
Ninja Turtles said:Evolution is not concerned with how life is created, it is concerned with the mechanisms of life on Earth, as that is all that can be measured at the moment. You are attacking the idea of a person bringing in aliens into the equation, thus proving the point. You can't just bring in something that you can't measure without first having to explain it through use of the scientific method.
Using your logic, you would have to explain how God developed intelligence.Linux98 said:I never talked about creation or origins. Cerad brought aliens into the equation to say that I was building a false dichotomy. I pointed out that you would still need to describe how those aliens developed intelligece (developing intelligence is not an origins question). And that puts you back into GodDidIt vs evolution without God.
Ninja Turtles said:Using your logic, you would have to explain how God developed intelligence.
And there's the problem with your argument, you don't have an explanation for God, thus it can't be science.Linux98 said:If I thought God evolved I guess I would.
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