"homophobia" term

[KarateCowboy]

He can only claim this after the fact. We don't have any other better words to encapsulate the actions and attitudes of anti-equality activists, and "homophobia" works just fine, so it's the one we've decided to use.

Throw us a bone here. We don't believe homosexuality = heterosexuality, but that doesn't mean we think homosexuals are inhuman. So to us it's not a matter of equality but righteousness, if you get what I'm saying. So I'll help you, which will in turn help me: we'd rather be called pro-family, anti-homosexual, or straight-only than homophobic.

I prefer straight-only.

 

[JGG]

Well, i've never met a homosexual I didn't like. However, I don't like certain things they do: homosexual acts.

I know what you mean. I have a friend who puts milk in his coffee instead of cream. How can I get him to stop doing that?

So to us it's not a matter of equality but righteousness, if you get what I'm saying. So I'll help you, which will in turn help me: we'd rather be called pro-family, anti-homosexual, or straight-only than homophobic.

I prefer straight-only.

So you're anti-homosexual, but you don't dislike homosexuals? That doesn't add up. Its certainly discriminatory, as you claim you prefer straight people.

 

[JustJack!]

we'd rather be called pro-family,...

Except that you're against certain families that differ from yours, so that actually a very misleading adjective for your side.

As if we were somehow anti-family...

 

[MoonlessNight]

So you're anti-homosexual, but you don't dislike homosexuals? That doesn't add up. Its certainly discriminatory, as you claim you prefer straight people.

I'm anti-alcoholism but I don't have a problem with alcoholics. There is a difference between hating a person and finding fault in their behavior or conditions.

Virtue and vice, man. Virtue and vice.

 

[JGG]

I'm anti-alcoholism but I don't have a problem with alcoholics.

So, if I'm pro-white, but have no problems with African, or Asian-Americans, I'm not racist?

 

[MoonlessNight]

So, if I'm pro-white, but have no problems with African, or Asian-Americans, I'm not racist?

Since when is race a virtue or vice or even a habit?

 

[JGG]

Since when is race a virtue or vice or even a habit?

When sexual orientation became vice, virtue, and habit.

 

[MoonlessNight]

When sexual orientation became vice, virtue, and habit.

A habit is a predisposition towards certain actions. A sexual orientation would seem to fit that.

A virtue is a habit that helps you act in a moral matter. A vice is a habit that helps you act in a sinful matter. If you think sexual acts have moral connotations its not unreasonable to think that sexual orientation could be considered a virtue or vice.

 

[JGG]

A habit is a predisposition towards certain actions. A sexual orientation would seem to fit that.

So heterosexuality is just as bad?

A virtue is a habit that helps you act in a moral matter.

Okay, so let's say I believe that being white helps me act in a moral matter.

A vice is a habit that helps you act in a sinful matter.

And lets say that I think not being white helps others act in a sinful matter.

Have you ever been to a white supremacist website? Whites are supposed to be superior because blacks, asians, Jews are immoral. Asians are supposedly scheming, blacks are violent, Jews are greedy. I obviuosly don't agree with any of this, but you're currently making the same argument the white supremacists make.

If you think sexual acts have moral connotations its not unreasonable to think that sexual orientation could be considered a virtue or vice.

Ditto with skin color.

 

[MoonlessNight]

Have you ever been to a white supremacist website? Whites are supposed to be superior because blacks, asians, Jews are immoral. Asians are supposedly scheming, blacks are violent, Jews are greedy. I obviuosly don't agree with any of this, but you're currently making the same argument the white supremacists make.

But there's no good evidence for those things. There is however, good evidence that being homosexual makes you predisposed to homosexual action, i.e. homosexual sex for instance. Are you denying that? If you aren't than your comparison of me to a racist falls flat.

 

[JGG]

But there's no good evidence for those things. There is however, good evidence that being homosexual makes you predisposed to homosexual action, i.e. homosexual sex for instance. Are you denying that? If you aren't than your comparison of me to a racist falls flat.

But sex is not immoral.

 

[DivineRAiN]

MoonlessNight: There is however, good evidence that being homosexual makes you predisposed to homosexual action, i.e. homosexual sex for instance.

what about homosexual sex?

 

[Robinsegg]

JGG,
Your claims make sense only if one believes an homosexual orientation is genetic or present at birth. Not everyone believes that, nor have they found any scientific evidence of such.

Rachel

 

[Robinsegg]

Hey,
Can we get back on-topic of the term "homophobia"?

Rachel

 

[MoonlessNight]

But sex is not immoral.

Not all sex certainly, but I believe that some can be. That is where we disagree. If you want to call me a prude or a puritan or Victorian in my attitudes towards sex or repressed or whatever go ahead because at least then you are hitting the right issues. But trying to make me into a biggot or calling me the same as a white supremicist is completely intellectually dishonest.

 

[MoonlessNight]

Hey,
Can we get back on-topic of the term "homophobia"?

Rachel

Yes, that's a good idea.

 

[JGG]

JGG,
Your claims make sense only if one believes an homosexual orientation is genetic or present at birth. Not everyone believes that, nor have they found any scientific evidence of such.

Actually, there's more evidence that its due to genetics than there is evidence that its a choice. I'll have to find the thread where I posted my citations.

 

[JGG]

But trying to make me into a biggot or calling me the same as a white supremicist is completely intellectually dishonest.

Are you a divorce-o-phobe (made that word up, but I'm sure you'll understand what it means)?

 

[Robinsegg]

I never stated it's a choice, though I do believe there are things that can cause it after birth. I can't imagine why someone would "choose" this lifestyle that's so difficult in our culture.

But, neither do I think it's predetermined at or before birth.

Rachel

 

[DivineRAiN]

JGG: Actually, there's more evidence that its due to genetics than there is evidence that its a choice

wait, there's ppl who still believe it's a choice?